DUST Search - [Feedback] Hotfix Beta grenade and RE recommendation

Jaysyn Larrisen wrote:

Appia,

I appreciate the detailed feedback. By and large I believe I agree with your comments and i've got a couple points of clarification in areas I might not have been clear on. Quick note: I'll keep using the number / letter headers just so I can keep track.

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3 - I might not have been clear. You can already carry more REs, which i think we agree have greater utility and lethality, than grenades. By increasing the nanite cost or potentially removing replenishment from nano hives for grenades it would continue to make the RE a far better choice for a player.

4 - I agree that SP pays for minor increases in effectiveness vs increased cost of CPU/PG, no issues with that. My point is that the relative value that proto nades (particularly locus) give you vs the CPU/PG cost has now shifted somewhat out of balance. With the ability to carry less (and no variant that gives you that option) and a nerf to resupply capabilty my subjective opinion is that they aren't quite worthy the CPU/PG outlay. Admittedly, this could be just reflective of my personal view and not indicitive of anyone else.

I do think it's safe to say that most folks would agree the proto RE options are more value per resouce cost (CPU/PG) than proto nades.

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7 - I see your point on distance factors and tactical employment; my point is that not every objective gets 2 to 3 REs. On a purely one for one basis it is imbalanced.

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9 - I take a little issue with referring to it as hyperbole; i.e. "hyping" things to make the point. Granted it is a subjective assesment but i suspect you would agree that there is a distince uptick in heavy suits and "tanked" scouts.

Also - i should have clarified that I had CCP Rattati's comments about his subjective effectiveness tiering of nades vs various suits and meta levels. Basically...militia nade should kill militia medium suit and it scales up so that proto nades kill proto non-sentinel suits. Based on the tiering noted in Hotfix Alpha the numbers don't seem to jive with that based on relative amounts fo eHP and calculated resistances.

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Appia Nappia 843	Posted - 2014.06.02 04:13:00 - [1] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: TL;DR: If you're concerned about "Frisbee RE" then convince Rattati to increase arming time. Nerfing any other aspect of REs (A) is unwarranted and (B) will interfere with AV functions. As someone that has all 4 commandos, let me tell you that my favorite equipment ~~is the Frisbee~~ are Remote Explosives. I say this as someone that uses them as better grenades, as someone that's been using them as better grenades for a long time: they need a longer arming time. Secretly Appia Vibbia If you can read my signature... I'm on the wrong alt.
Appia Nappia 847	Posted - 2014.06.02 13:45:00 - [2] - Quote TheEnd762 wrote: You nerf RE damage, or increase their arming timer, you make them useless against tanks. REs take a LOT of skill to use effectively. They're certainly not more of an instant win button than rolling around in a proto heavy suit. increasing arming time shouldn't increase the speed in which you deploy them, on the time between thrown and detonation when rapidly pressing L1 Secretly Appia Vibbia If you can read my signature... I'm on the wrong alt.
Appia Nappia 854	Posted - 2014.06.03 04:07:00 - [3] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: Appia, I appreciate the detailed feedback. By and large I believe I agree with your comments and i've got a couple points of clarification in areas I might not have been clear on. Quick note: I'll keep using the number / letter headers just so I can keep track. ... 3 - I might not have been clear. You can already carry more REs, which i think we agree have greater utility and lethality, than grenades. By increasing the nanite cost or potentially removing replenishment from nano hives for grenades it would continue to make the RE a far better choice for a player. 4 - I agree that SP pays for minor increases in effectiveness vs increased cost of CPU/PG, no issues with that. My point is that the relative value that proto nades (particularly locus) give you vs the CPU/PG cost has now shifted somewhat out of balance. With the ability to carry less (and no variant that gives you that option) and a nerf to resupply capabilty my subjective opinion is that they aren't quite worthy the CPU/PG outlay. Admittedly, this could be just reflective of my personal view and not indicitive of anyone else. I do think it's safe to say that most folks would agree the proto RE options are more value per resouce cost (CPU/PG) than proto nades. ... 7 - I see your point on distance factors and tactical employment; my point is that not every objective gets 2 to 3 REs. On a purely one for one basis it is imbalanced. . . . 9 - I take a little issue with referring to it as hyperbole; i.e. "hyping" things to make the point. Granted it is a subjective assesment but i suspect you would agree that there is a distince uptick in heavy suits and "tanked" scouts. Also - i should have clarified that I had CCP Rattati's comments about his subjective effectiveness tiering of nades vs various suits and meta levels. Basically...militia nade should kill militia medium suit and it scales up so that proto nades kill proto non-sentinel suits. Based on the tiering noted in Hotfix Alpha the numbers don't seem to jive with that based on relative amounts fo eHP and calculated resistances. #3 is me being a jerk and telling you that comparing Grenade slot to Equipment slot numbers isn't the same thing. There's no reason you can't carry both. With grenade and REs each serving a distinct purpose #4 I think you're undervaluing the increase in range for locus grenades and overvaluing the increased number of deployable REs. I could go into this point specifically if you'd like. #7 . . . They serve different puposes. They shouldn't be equivalent on a 1 on 1 direct comparison. And to the last part, yeah. Those numbers don't really work out. The STD damage is less than the base HP on Medium suits. And a a few basic HP mods protect Medium Frames from the ADV level. It seems like the new numbers are only there to OHK scouts. But still I completely disagree with a single item that's easily restocked and can be thrown will little personal skill being able to just kill someone instantly. Secretly Appia Vibbia If you can read my signature... I'm on the wrong alt.