DUST Search - Dust > Legion Transfer

Jaysyn Larrisen wrote:

Vicious Minotaur wrote:

Jaysyn Larrisen wrote:

1) I do not agree with needing to "re-grind" in any way. My opinion is that you should get whatever the equivalent amount of SP would be in Legion, unallocated, from day one of your transfer.

I never said it was "the same." Do note that preceding the word "same" were the words: "pretty much." Which, of course, denotes that there are, in fact, differences. In addition, the sentiment is more or less the same. Which is to say, the core idea: the crux. That is the important thing, and that is where there is no disagreement from what I can see.

You said you "absolutely disagree" with Sponk's idea. But you don't. What you don't agree upon are the tertiary details.

However, the tertiary detail of how long do we accrue our DUST SP (and other related details) are not insignificant. You mention a 90-day benchmark. Roughly three months... I have trouble with that only if we start getting our DUST SP upon beta entrance. Three months into a beta, and people are pushing mid-8 digit SP amounts (or the Legion equivalent) -- and the game has yet to be officially released.

Another related detail: why does getting our DUST SP back have to be a completely passive affair? Should there be an active accrual of our DUST SP (on top of passive, not instead of)?

I myself would say a six-month SP accrual for passive, in addition to extra 'active SP accrual' to encourage playing AND whittle down the time it take to get your SP back from six-months to, say, three/four with active play.

I don't think you are noticing my #1 point. There should be zero re-grind of SP...period.

The addendum for the accelerated SP window was simply my thoughts on a solution if for whatever reason a clean bank of SP can't be delivered to the players upon standing up their Legion characters. It certainly isn't my first option by a long shot.

Additionally, I mean exactly what I write for the most part. When I say I "absolutey disagree" that's pretty much what I mean. I'm also pretty aware that my opinion might not be exactly how CCP goes with things and you need to consider looking a best alternative - even if you don't necessarily agree with the manner it delivers the end state.


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Vicious Minotaur Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 821	Posted - 2014.05.28 04:38:00 - [1] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: SponkSponkSponk wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: This would likely mean AUR, along with some sort of conversion (or some such thing) for SP and ISK. As far as SP goes, to eliminate the influx of 50M-SP characters on day 1 of Legion, I strongly suggest that you implement a 'for every x million SP, you will have a 30-day passive SP booster pre-injected on your Legion character' (or whatever the equivalent is - for all I know it has a subscription plan like planet side ). This will make veterans gain Legion SP in line with their Dust SP, without front-loading it or discouraging fresh Legion players from trying to keep up. I absolutely disagree with this. I want my investment of time and resources (sometimes from active or omega boosters from events) to be transferred as cleanly as possible to Legion when the time comes. I do NOT want to grind for it again. There is no true transfer of my investment if I have to make the exact same investment as a non-transferred character. If they perhaps adjusted our passive SP gain (even if they still maintain that system) to drastically increase SP to a predetermined number corresponding with our old Dust character so you essentially achieve full SP investment in say 90 days...that might be legit. Um.... What? It sounds like you agree more than you disagree. Sponk(x3) said: "...This will make veterans gain Legion SP in line with their Dust SP" ---> You said: "...increase SP to a predetermined number corresponding with our old Dust character" Sponk said: "...passive SP booster pre-injected on your Legion character" ---> You said: "If they perhaps adjusted our passive SP gain..." Yeah. Sounds like you both pretty much want the same exact thing. In which case, I agree with both of your sentiments. I too would like a transfer of my SP via passive-SP manipulation -- such that we get, in time, Legion SP that is equivalent to our DUST SP.
Vicious Minotaur Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 821	Posted - 2014.05.28 07:14:00 - [2] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: It's not the same at all. Sponk is advocating for normal 30day boosters to be keyed to your character in X increments based on the amount of SP you have. If you have a 30/40/50 mil SP character it will take you well over a year to recoup that amount of SP in the system Sponk is advocating. Honestly...you're talking at least 11mo's to hit about the 30 SP mark. 1) I do not agree with needing to "re-grind" in any way. My opinion is that you should get whatever the equivalent amount of SP would be in Legion, unallocated, from day one of your transfer. 2) If for whatever reason that's not possible I strongly advocate for a more significant step than what Sponk is proposing. The 90 day bench mark I referenced was simply a defined maximum window in which SP should equal your Dust level IF the concern is too much of an imbalance at launch. I never said it was "the same." Do note that preceding the word "same" were the words: "pretty much." Which, of course, denotes that there are, in fact, differences. In addition, the sentiment is more or less the same. Which is to say, the core idea: the crux. That is the important thing, and that is where there is no disagreement from what I can see. You said you "absolutely disagree" with Sponk's idea. But you don't. What you don't agree upon are the tertiary details. However, the tertiary detail of how long do we accrue our DUST SP (and other related details) are not insignificant. You want a 90-day benchmark. Roughly three months... I have trouble with that only if we start getting our DUST SP upon beta entrance. Three months into a beta, and people are pushing mid-8 digit SP amounts (or the Legion equivalent) -- and the game has yet to be officially released. Another related detail: why does getting our DUST SP back have to be a completely passive affair? Should there be an active accrual of our DUST SP (on top of passive, not instead of)? I myself would say a six-month SP accrual for passive, in addition to extra 'active SP accrual' to encourage playing AND whittle down the time it take to get your SP back from six-months to, say, three/four with active play.
Vicious Minotaur Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 827	Posted - 2014.05.28 18:52:00 - [3] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: Vicious Minotaur wrote: Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: 1) I do not agree with needing to "re-grind" in any way. My opinion is that you should get whatever the equivalent amount of SP would be in Legion, unallocated, from day one of your transfer. I never said it was "the same." Do note that preceding the word "same" were the words: "pretty much." Which, of course, denotes that there are, in fact, differences. In addition, the sentiment is more or less the same. Which is to say, the core idea: the crux. That is the important thing, and that is where there is no disagreement from what I can see. You said you "absolutely disagree" with Sponk's idea. But you don't. What you don't agree upon are the tertiary details. However, the tertiary detail of how long do we accrue our DUST SP (and other related details) are not insignificant. You mention a 90-day benchmark. Roughly three months... I have trouble with that only if we start getting our DUST SP upon beta entrance. Three months into a beta, and people are pushing mid-8 digit SP amounts (or the Legion equivalent) -- and the game has yet to be officially released. Another related detail: why does getting our DUST SP back have to be a completely passive affair? Should there be an active accrual of our DUST SP (on top of passive, not instead of)? I myself would say a six-month SP accrual for passive, in addition to extra 'active SP accrual' to encourage playing AND whittle down the time it take to get your SP back from six-months to, say, three/four with active play. I don't think you are noticing my #1 point. There should be zero re-grind of SP...period. The addendum for the accelerated SP window was simply my thoughts on a solution if for whatever reason a clean bank of SP can't be delivered to the players upon standing up their Legion characters. It certainly isn't my first option by a long shot. Additionally, I mean exactly what I write for the most part. When I say I "absolutey disagree" that's pretty much what I mean. I'm also pretty aware that my opinion might not be exactly how CCP goes with things and you need to consider looking a best alternative - even if you don't necessarily agree with the manner it delivers the end state. I noticed it. I don't think you know what "grinding" means. A passive wait is not a grind, nor is being active in a game. And nobody here is suggesting an actual, real, true to the sense of the word, "grind." At least nobody involved within the immediate and previous quote chain. As such, I have no business addressing it. In addition, I don't think you noticed your number 2 point, which is basically you being fine with: Passive SP manipulation Wait period You advocated, in the event that your ideal option is not on the table, an extension/expansion of Sponk's core idea. You, however, wish it to be taken a step further. But it being a step further requires it be on the same idea "staircase." But, you claim that you absolutely disagree with a core idea that you yourself advocated in your number 2 point. And I'm sorry to inform your... but "Considering" and "advocating" are not the same thing. You did much more than "consider" the alternative. Word choice matters. So sorry for taking you at your word.
Vicious Minotaur Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 828	Posted - 2014.05.28 20:14:00 - [4] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: .... So i guess my question back you is what do you think a fair way of transfering SP would be? On that note, there may really not be clean ways to do this depending on how CCP Z's concept plays out. Do you think ISK, ISK derived assets, BPOs, and AUR should come over as is, at all, or with some type of exchange? Well... the entire reason I quoted you in the first place deal with, to avoid needless specifics, semantics... silly, yes. But I love me some semantics. Language is fascinating... but I digress Like you, I don't want to grind again. Any system that encourages/forces grinding I will be against 100%. I see multiple ways of SP transfer: 1) none - grind like a new, non-dust player 2) passive exclusive - all you have to do is wait [x] time units 3) active exclusive - play, be active and get DUST sp as reward 4) 2&3 combo 5) immediate 1:1 transfer 6) other --- I would agree to either 2/4.0 #4, though, could encourage grinding if the active SP is less like the login bonus and more like an active booster. 5 could cause problems, but I could agree to it. For other assets (AUR, ISK, BPO, items) I see more limited options: 1) 1:1 (ish) conversion - more like an exchange of currency in today's world 2) limited converson - some things won't transfer at all 3) no conversion 4) other --- For AUR, option 1 is a must in my mind. For ISK, considering the PC farming and such, I'd say #3 For BPO, suits and vehicles ought to transfer, but mods would be problematic, so option 2. For other consumable assets, no transfer. If I had my way, the market would be a blank slate and allowed an almost completely natural evolution. Massive influx of consumable items and ISK could severely imbalance the market day-1, which for a new game, is not good.