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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Heinrich Jagerblitzen
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
1734
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Posted - 2014.05.26 20:24:00 -
[1] - Quote
Shepherd Grey wrote: Losers obviously take huge losses, but let's assess the winning team.
Avg payout per player under current system = roughly 1 mil
Under new hotfix system = roughly 2 mil
Avg. PC suit cost = roughly 150k (lowball figure)
# of deaths to reach 150 clone pack per merc, per team = 9
# of deaths before loss exceeds payout = 13
There's nothing "obvious" about corporations being forced to take a loss. You're simply assuming that everyone HAS to maintain the status quo in terms of gear fielded in PC matches, which is not a given at all. That status quo is only possible because PC corps have sat on fountains of "free" isk. Now they won't have that opulence anymore, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with corporations scaling back what they're able to afford to fight with as well. In fact, one of the healthiest things for PC as a feature would be greater diversity of gear quality fielded. What if corps had to pick and choose which PC fights they brought prototype gear out for? Just because we take it for granted that everyone runs proto all the time doesn't mean that's good for the game.
Shepherd Grey wrote:
Not to mention, vehicle reimbursement is now impossible.
Again, not impossible, just difficult. Corps will have to switch from having a bottomless fountain of isk they shower down on members, to deriving their income from taxed match payouts instead, forcing corps to actually manage a budget and consider a balance between how much content they can provide for their members, and how much expensive gear they can field in every match. Just like with proto suits, corps may have to be selective about which fights they use ADS in, and this could be really healthy for diversity in PC as well.
Shepherd Grey wrote:The moment the hotfix is implemented, online districts become useless to those owning them.........This hotfix will effectively retire anyone STILL playing for the sole competitive aspect provided by PC. If somehow I am misguided or my calculations are off, please correct me ASAP. From what I see, veterans have zero reason to continue PC unless it is to blow their stockpiled isk - small corps invest an enormous risk into a seemingly minimal profit margin. It appears the future of MH is a land desolate with either self-locking isk farmers, or noob corps with nothing left to fight for (and/or no one left TO fight.)
You are only calling the districts useless because you see them as a means to fund blinged out teams, while forgetting that in the process of calling this ability to finance this "impossible" you are also admitting that it'll be easier for less wealthy corps to get a toehold into PC by fighting said corps that "cant afford" to bling out their troops anymore.
Owning a PC district should ALWAYS have been about content generation, not raw wealth. At the heart of every PC debate has always been the issue about how to bring the most fights to the most people. The only reason that self-locking is so prevalent in the current environment is that the labor involved is tolerable enough to be worth the profit. Turn that self-locking into a boring grindfest, and you're going to see a lot more corps just say "**** it, we'd rather just fight people" for a similar amount of gain. We're never going to remove self-locking completely without redoing the entire mechanics, but we can make it a pain in the ass compared to just using a district as a source of fun for corp members.
At the end of the day these changes simply force corps to look at their district as a source of competitive fights with other corps, instead of a source of income to cover ALL of a merc's activities in the game. Corp leaders will have to balance district ownership based on the size of their corp and the the amount of content they can provide (or defend) using their talent and resources. Corp leaders will actually have to use the tax system and come up with a budget accordingly, which will actually dial down the amount of expensive proto gear and vehicles used in PC. Yes, there will be a temporary imbalance because some corps can afford to bleed off isk and field their best longer than others (as you correctly predict).....but that isk bleed is exactly what many intelligent posters have already identified as a necessary step towards a healthy economy.
I know your intent was to be critical, but I actually appreciate you highlighting so many of the benefits these changes will bring. I look forward to the days ahead, and will see you soon on the battlefield in Molden Heath (with or without your protosuit). 
o7 |
Heinrich Jagerblitzen
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
1735
|
Posted - 2014.05.26 20:36:00 -
[2] - Quote
Tallen Ellecon wrote:This is what I've wanted for awhile, but I think the clonepack price is still too high for someone hoping to get into PC for the first time. I think the price should be reduced for corps who own no districts.
As with the changes to dropsuits, modules, and weapons - this is only a first step. Once these changes are deployed the activity will be monitored closely, and if such a price adjustment is deemed necessary (based on the participation data we observe) we can certainly do so. There are certainly many corps right now for which the amount of clones needed to win an attack is a bigger issue than the price of the pack, but if this isn't enough we can still look at the costs as well.
Remember - slashing the pack costs without also slashing the clone count only drives us closer to profitable clone pack farming. As a first pass here, I think its critical to maintain the initial cost-per-clone and see how many corps it brings into PC before we take further risks with the pack price.
Thanks for your feedback though, this is a valid concern and one we should definitely all watch closely as these changes take effect. |
Heinrich Jagerblitzen
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
1736
|
Posted - 2014.05.26 21:05:00 -
[3] - Quote
Dust User wrote:How are corps suppose to make the ISK to buy the new and improved 45,000,000 ISK clone pack?
And before someone chimes in with taxes, give me a break. It would take months to bring in that kind of ISK from taxes.
How are corps (that are not in PC already) making the money for clone packs today? How has any corp ever made the isk needed to buy a clone pack before they actually had districts to print isk for them?
Remember, PC is high level content, and it should take some level of effort and time to prepare a corp to compete and enter Molden Heath to begin with. The fact that there's time and effort involved in ramping up towards PC (both financially and in troop training) isn't really a problem. Before I was in Onslaught I was a member of D3LTA FORC3, one of many corps early in the game's history that made a pointed effort to save isk because we knew PC was a personal goal for the corp. Charismatic leaders with a goal for the corp to work towards don't have any problem finding that isk.
Besides, the per-clone cost isn't being raised at all here, corps are just buying more clones at a time (giving them a greater margin in battle to win the initial attack with). We're really only talking about a 20% greater investment to buy a clone pack after all.
In terms of taxation - that means the difference between a 5% tax and a 6% tax. Or raising a 10% tax to 12%. This is quite reasonable to ask especially if it means the corp is able to provide content previously unavailable to its members. I'm confident that many corps will find the difference between participating in PC or not worthy of this slight additional investment.
Also - tax is hardly the only way to raise funds. 9 million isk today is fairly trivial and could easily be found by even a handful of small donations from individuals from within the corp. Again, corp leadership confident in their ability to win an attack and enter MH may even front this initially themselves, if it means greater income once the corp is in MH and fighting other corps regularly. I think you're dramatically underestimating the myriad ways that players can work around a clone pack cost bump to achieve their goals. |
Heinrich Jagerblitzen
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
1738
|
Posted - 2014.05.27 09:15:00 -
[4] - Quote
ZDub 303 wrote:The math looks great for a corp already in PC but for corps that are not.. its pretty much impossible to get in...
I hope you realize that now that you've said this, some corp is going to go out of their way to prove you horribly wrong. That's always how these things work. |
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