DUST Search - [Feedback] Cloaks

Cyrius Li-Moody wrote:

Lowest Dampening possible or worth noting:
Caldari - 18.49 db w/ 2 complex damps (17.56 db while proto cloak active)
Minmatar - 15.85 db w/ 3 complex damps (15.05 db while proto cloak active)
Amarr - 14.73 db w/ 4 complex damps
Gallente -13.87 db w/ 2 complex damps

For reference:

Gal Logi can 360 scan 4 Focused Scanners that scan at 15db for 5 seconds each.

Caldari Precision
-17.85 db w/ 2 complex precision
-15.81 db w/ 3 complex precision
-14.91 db w/ 4 complex precision

CCP Rattati wrote:

Scouts and EWAR - the intention was never to "fix" the EWAR meta with Hotfix Alpha. Just to force players to make a choice between being completely unscannable or scannable and invisible.

So what you really should have said is you're forcing players to fill all their lows with dampeners or not run their scout suits if they wish to be competitive. Actually even worse, this encourages EHP tanking even more because beating scans is going to be incredibly difficult or just simply not at all possible depending on what suit you're running. I know you guys are trying to encourage scouts to use something besides ehp tanking modules but you honestly give little incentive to use anything but a gallente or caldari scout even more now (both for completely different reasons and honestly the Gallente is just so far ahead it's not even funny).

You guys really should reconsider these numbers. It's absolutely insane the sacrifices that will be required for anyone but a Gallente scout to remain competitive because people WILL be running triple and quadruple precision caldari or 4 focus scanner Gallente logis until everyone gets enough SP to specc into Gallente.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Sir Dukey SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 918	Posted - 2014.05.24 00:56:00 - [1] - Quote I would like to start out and say that the duration proposed are wayto low. 15 seconds of STD is a waste of PG and CPU no joke. That's like 120m in an 8m/s suit. I want all the cloaks to keep their duration. The problem with the cloak was the SG/Cloak combo where you can shoot before you decloak which I agree needs to be addressed but there was nothing wrong with cloak durations. Also the fact that it was hard to see in some environments. Also, the dampening is way wrong like Cyirus Li-Moody (how ever you spell it) said. It is way to low, we are going to have a situation where everyone is going to be forced to fill all their lows with damps just to get under a gallante GK.0 with a scanner and most people wont do this. It's going to be brick/ ehp tank the crap out of your suit. - minmitar and caldari scouts will not be able to ever hide from caldari Precision and Amarr will have to use all their lows to hide (bit unfair) . Gallante suit is the only suit that will ever be able to hide from anything and it will require the suit give up 3/4 low slots. I propose STD cloak- 30 second duration, 20 second recharge, 10% dampening ADV cloak- 60 second duration, 30 second recharge, 15% dampening PRO cloak- 80 second duration, 40 second recharge, 20 % dampening This will make the PRO cloak more useful than the other's because it receives higher dampening. I know you are tying to get the scout to either be invisible or be unscannable but why??? It's a scout suit for freking sakes, it's suppose to have low HP and hard to detect, there is no point to being invisible if you can be scanned. killing a scout is like taking candy from a baby when you have him scanned. I can assure you that after this hotfix, you will see very little scouts use cloaks, they will all be using them as brick tanked light assault. Please CCP, Don't over nerf the Cloak for something that is perfectly fine. Nerf the fact that you can shoot while invisible but don't nerf the cloak other than make a difference between PRO, ADV, STD.
Sir Dukey SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 918	Posted - 2014.05.24 01:18:00 - [2] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: You do know that it's pointless being cloaked if there's a chevron over your head right? There's no point in being shimmery and opaque with an effing arrow pointing at your head. Cloak does not grant invisibility no matter how much anyone wants to believe it does. I have eyes and a good monitor. I can see cloaks from over 70m out. Cloaks are not INVISIBILITY and far from it. I feel like I'm taking crazy pills here. Why would cloaking be worth it if there's an effing chevron over your head while you're cloaked??????? Who are you fooling? Answer: nobody. Dampening and cloaking go hand in hand because if you are scanned while you are cloaked PEOPLE CAN STILL SEE YOU. This completely negates the point of the cloak.
Bayeth Mal OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 403	Posted - 2014.05.24 11:01:00 - [3] - Quote I'm actually in agreement about the cloak duration issue. My cloak has saved me a couple of times hiding like a coward in a red nanohive while a heavy waddles up, replenishes his ammo and moves on. To prevent cloak spam make the recharge rate much longer. Scouts shouldn't live in their cloak, only decloaking to kill before going back to being cloaked. But not being able to sit still when a whole squad wanders past hidden in plain sight. Either: A - Have moving while cloaked a severe penalty on the cloaks duration. Sitting still while cloaked = 60sec, moving = 25sec B - Have the recharge rate severely lengthened. I'd rather double the recharge time than half the active time. Heading over to Destiny Beta and a few others Hit me up for Skype and PSN
Izlare Lenix Arrogance. Dark Taboo 601	Posted - 2014.05.24 11:55:00 - [4] - Quote +1. I agree with all points made. Like always CCP is trying to make more changes then there are problems. The decloak glitch is the only thing that really needs to be addressed. Gun control is not about guns...it's about control. The only way to ensure freedom is by having the means to defend it.
Sir Dukey SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 925	Posted - 2014.05.24 13:57:00 - [5] - Quote Izlare Lenix wrote: +1. I agree with all points made. Like always CCP is trying to make more changes then there are problems. The decloak glitch is the only thing that really needs to be addressed. CCP always dose this and it has a huge ripple on every thing like tanks and dropships, hardeners nerfed so dropships nerfed. Many people dont even run a shield hardener on caldari dropships anymore. Flaylock nerfed to sht because they reduced radius to a point where you have to hit the target in the face to do damage, The only problem was the amount of damage it was doing and then when you reduce amount of damage and radius you get a sht weapon. Damage mod nerf and proficiency nerf hurt snipers and specialized weapon users like ScR. ScR now almost always overheats trying to kill one person unless its a glass cannon. Officer sniper barley does enough damage to kill some militia suits.
Stefan Stahl Seituoda Taskforce Command 532	Posted - 2014.05.24 14:32:00 - [6] - Quote Bayeth Mal wrote: To prevent cloak spam make the recharge rate much longer. Scouts shouldn't live in their cloak, only decloaking to kill before going back to being cloaked. But not being able to sit still when a whole squad wanders past hidden in plain sight. I agree that people shouldn't consider being cloaked their default state when running a scout. The cloak should be the right tool for the right job, not the thing you always use when a red dot appears on your tacnet. Whether you achieve this by reducing total duration or recharge rate is of no concern to me.

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 1687	Posted - 2014.05.24 14:36:00 - [7] - Quote There is an in depth conversation in another thread. I suggest you use that. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Sir Dukey SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 925	Posted - 2014.05.24 14:37:00 - [8] - Quote Stefan Stahl wrote: Bayeth Mal wrote: To prevent cloak spam make the recharge rate much longer. Scouts shouldn't live in their cloak, only decloaking to kill before going back to being cloaked. But not being able to sit still when a whole squad wanders past hidden in plain sight. I agree that people shouldn't consider being cloaked their default state when running a scout. The cloak should be the right tool for the right job, not the thing you always use when a red dot appears on your tacnet. Whether you achieve this by reducing total duration or recharge rate is of no concern to me. like I said this thread is not all about the duration, it's with the dampening bonus. But, I would like to add that the duration that is proposed is wayyyy to low to make the cloak useful. 15 Seconds for STD is absolutely nothing.
Sir Dukey SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 925	Posted - 2014.05.24 14:39:00 - [9] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Lowest Dampening possible or worth noting: Caldari - 18.49 db w/ 2 complex damps (17.56 db while proto cloak active) Minmatar - 15.85 db w/ 3 complex damps (15.05 db while proto cloak active) Amarr - 14.73 db w/ 4 complex damps Gallente -13.87 db w/ 2 complex damps For reference: Gal Logi can 360 scan 4 Focused Scanners that scan at 15db for 5 seconds each. Caldari Precision -17.85 db w/ 2 complex precision -15.81 db w/ 3 complex precision -14.91 db w/ 4 complex precision CCP Rattati wrote: Scouts and EWAR - the intention was never to "fix" the EWAR meta with Hotfix Alpha. Just to force players to make a choice between being completely unscannable or scannable and invisible. So what you really should have said is you're forcing players to fill all their lows with dampeners or not run their scout suits if they wish to be competitive. Actually even worse, this encourages EHP tanking even more because beating scans is going to be incredibly difficult or just simply not at all possible depending on what suit you're running. I know you guys are trying to encourage scouts to use something besides ehp tanking modules but you honestly give little incentive to use anything but a gallente or caldari scout even more now (both for completely different reasons and honestly the Gallente is just so far ahead it's not even funny). You guys really should reconsider these numbers. It's absolutely insane the sacrifices that will be required for anyone but a Gallente scout to remain competitive because people WILL be running triple and quadruple precision caldari or 4 focus scanner Gallente logis until everyone gets enough SP to specc into Gallente.
Sir Dukey SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 932	Posted - 2014.05.25 14:48:00 - [10] - Quote



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