The-Errorist
690
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Posted - 2014.05.21 04:28:00 -
[1] - Quote
{Part 1/3 Turret roles and traits}
Small turrets don't really have much of a role and the idea that a blaster is AI, a railgun is AA, and a missile is in between is oversimplified and blurs too much the roles of what a large and small turret should be.
Here's what I think the roles and qualities the two turret classes should be:
[Large turrets]
- Best for taking out large targets
- Worst for taking out small targets
- Slowest RoF
- Smallest splash radius
- Slowest tracking speed
[Small turrets]
- Best for taking out small targets
- Worst for taking out large targets
- Highest RoF
- Highest splash radius
- Highest tracking speed
With this plan, large blaster wouldn't be the most effective turret to kill infantry; then role slaying infantry and small vehicles like LAVs, would be reserved for small turrets.
Here are the types, styles, and traits the turret types should follow.
Blasters: Brawler
- Best turret in fast paced close range engagements
- Highest tracking speed
- Highest tracking speed
- Highest damage per minute
- Lowest heat cost per shot
- Lowest accuracy
- 2nd in dispersion
- Lowest splash radius & damage
Missiles: Hit and run
- Best turret at medium-to-long range
- Slowest projectile speed
- 2nd in tracking speed
- 2nd Highest tracking speed
- Highest dispersion
- 2nd in accuracy
- Highest splash radius & damage
- High RoF
- Smallest magazine size
- 2nd in tracking speed
- High burst damage
- No damage drop-off
Railguns: Sniper
- Best turret at long range engagements
- Low damage drop-off (currently has none)
- Highest alpha damage
- High burst damage
- Highest heat cost per shot
- Highest accuracy
- No dispersion
- 2nd in splash radius & damage
- Lowest tracking speed
- Slowest reload speed
- Lowest damage per minute
{Part 2/3 Rebalancing turrets}
[All turrets]
Damage difference between tiers
The damage gap between tiers is too big and its only consistent for large hybrid turrets. Anyway here are the stats:
Large railguns: increase by 217.5 dmg between tiers and that's a 15% of Sta.
Large missiles: increase by 83 dmg (20% increase) from Sta->Adv and increase by 41.5 at Pro which is 10% of Sta.
Small missiles: increase by 70 dmg (20% increase) from Sta->Adv and increase by 35 at Pro which is 10% of Sta.
Large blasters: increase by 15.75 dmg between tiers and that's a 15% of Sta.
Small blasters: increase by 7.6 dmg (20% increase) from STA->Adv and increase by 3.8 at Pro which is 10% of Sta.
In comparison, Infantry weapons increase by a flat 5% (except for a few weapons including the swarm launcher) and the difference between prototype and standard is 10%. The damage difference between tiers for turrets however, is very large and it's only consistent with large rails & blasters. The damage difference between standard and prototype is a huge 30% which 3x of a percent increase compared to what prototype infantry weapons get. I think it would be best if the damage boost between tiers was a flat 10% damage increase from standard which would give us a 20% difference between prototype and standard, fix the general problem of there being too much of a power gap between standard and prototype, and fix the unwanted diminishing returns effect when upgrading turrets.
MAG vet, Dust closed beta vet, and an alt of Velvet Overkill (infantry) & Agent Overkill (vehicle).
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The-Errorist
690
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Posted - 2014.05.21 04:29:00 -
[2] - Quote
{Part 2/3 Rebalancing turrets} Continued
To achieve the things I outlined above, these general things would need to be done and concerns I and some others feel:
[Small turrets]
A major problem with small turrets is that they have never been accurate while the vehicle was moving and a lot of times they don't shoot anywhere near where you aim. This is very noticeable for small turrets which should have pinpoint accuracy, but a lot of times, even if the reticule/dot is red, the shot can't hit the target; this even happens when stationary and especially on uneven ground. Another problem small turrets have is that they're too slow; they need to have a noticeably faster rotation speed compared to large turrets for them to be on any use on moving vehicles.
Against installations and other vehicles, small turrets have a damage penalty and for small blasters, it huge; that penalty needs to be reduced and it should not discriminate against rails, missiles, and blasters. The penalties against vehicles & installations should like the following:
Small turrets
- Full damage penalty against infantry
- -10% against installations, LAVs and dropships
- -20% against HAVs
For more information on how much damage small turrets deal visit these threads:
Pre: 1.8 thread (locked)
Post 1.8 thread (also locked)
[Missiles]
They are the most balanced turret in game. Having shotgun like reload for missiles would be awesome, but they would need to be rebalanced (dmg, RoF & reload speed) so that they wont become OP; if that can't be done, don't add it.
[Railguns]
Damage profile
All railgun turrets have, in-game, have a damage profile of +10% damage to shields and a -10% damage to armor which is backwards; the damage profile has been wrong since beta.
Its weird that large railguns (I haven't tested small ones that much) don't have a damage falloff and do full damage at their maximum range. They would also need at most a 100m range buff too if this was done since they would be doing far less damage at higher ranges (also because it feels like the range is a tad too short already).
[Range]
The hotfix over nerfed the excessive range which railguns had and didn't address an equally if not worse set of problem: for starters, railguns don't have a damage drop-off and do full damage at their maximum range which doesn't make any sense. Railguns need around 100 or 150m of their range back and they need to have fall-off damage so their role as a long range sniper turret isn't messed up.
[Reload speed]
Another problem all railguns share is that they have the same reload speed as blasters which makes their damage per minute too high in comparison to blasters which are supposed to have the best dpm. For the best alpha damage turret, to have the 2nd best burst damage per second, in addition to the best damage per minute, just screams overpowered.
Large railguns
They need a combination a small RoF reduction with a reload speed increase (and small rails too) and maybe a heat cost per shot increase. Their damage per minute is way too high (~32k while a large blaster has ~23k), the interval between shots is to high, and as I said above, they have the same reload time as blasters (6s), which is way too many pros for a sniper rifle like turret.
[Blasters]
Damage per minute is fine, but their accuracy, and precision are too high; with a little less, they wouldn't need pinpoint railgun aim to effectively damage targets the way the should. This would make large blasters less effective at longer ranges and at the same time make small blasters easier to work with.
Large Blasters
Their RoF is too high; a RoF reduction, and a direct damage increase (like the old compressed/breach variant) would make it still a useful turret, but not seem like the most OP infantry slaying gun ever in modern gaming history and prevent them from being able to easily kill people when they're past in the swarm launcher's lock-on range.
Small blaster
In addition to the general blaster problems and efficacy problem against vehicles above, small blasters have an awful targeting reticule, have too little reserve ammo, and they overheat too quickly, making the worst turret ever. They need an aiming reticule more like an HMG, they they really need splash radius back, lower heat cost per shot, and its reserve ammo capacity improved.
I used to use blasters on my ADS against infantry when they had a splash radius and it was pretty fun for me and my gunners for a short while; it was good enough to get several kills and scare away other vehicles, but wasn't as effective as it should be. The changes above would make them fun and actually useful for something, even on a dropship.
MAG vet, Dust closed beta vet, and an alt of Velvet Overkill (infantry) & Agent Overkill (vehicle).
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The-Errorist
690
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Posted - 2014.05.21 04:30:00 -
[3] - Quote
{Part 3/3 Other issues}
[Vehicles]
All vehicles classes should not share the same damage-to-stop-shield-recharge/Shield Impairment Dmg threshold; tanks should keep theirs at 102, dropships should have theirs a little lower, and LAVs should have theirs even lower, so that a small blaster at it's optimal range would be able to stop an LAVs shields from regenerating. This makes sense since small turrets are supposed to be effective against small targets, large turrets are for large targets, and it wouldn't be make sense if a large blaster can stop shield regen on a tank. but a small blaster can't stop shield regen on an LAV.
Turret pitch
Gallente tanks still have a greater range of motion than caldari tanks, making them even better for any turret. Just try and see how low you can aim a railgun on a soma compared to a sica.
LAVs
To also bolster small turret use, there would need to be more protection for gunners either by giving them a frontal shield or maybe even a bit of damage resistance if that client-side change isn't possible.
I would very much like shotgun style reload for missiles, it makes lots of sense just like the recent ability to individually fire missiles. Though it sounds cool, missiles would need to be rebalanced so that they won't be overpowered, especially for an ADS, it would be a nightmare to have to go against an ADS with lv5 reload skills that is seemingly able to fire missiles nonstop as infantry.
[Installations]
Turret installations get destroyed in the first minute of the match and don't get to serve any tactical value because of how squishy they are and they need to be easier to hack then to destroy, not the other way around. They need at least 3k more HP to serve any purpose on the battlefield.
Turrets installations need to have the same stats as their standard vehicle turret counterparts and benefit from the gunner's skills like for turret rotation and reload speed.
The AI is too smart sometimes and can target you when not aggressed and you're far away from it.
Large missile installations
They can hit targets all the way from your ground spawn area all the way to the enemy MCC, and the reload speed is pretty high which makes it way OP against dropships.
MAG vet, Dust closed beta vet, and an alt of Velvet Overkill (infantry) & Agent Overkill (vehicle).
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