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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Ender Storm
Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
79
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Posted - 2014.05.08 18:43:00 -
[1] - Quote
CCP Android wrote:Regis Blackbird wrote: New question regarding map design: Do you see any limitations in your engine when it comes to huge environments, which is almost required for the sandbox experience in Legion? Are you still committed in "maps" (however huge they may be), or are you thinking of a more seamless environment (kind of like Skyrim)? In addition, are you also using the "socket" idea further in Legion? Although very good concept, the maps in Dust 514 could be a little familiar after a while. I would go as far and say that we are not limited by anything there are off course constraints that we need to work with (time being one of the biggest ones) but its the same constraints that everyone has to deal with, regardless of which engine/tool they use. As for the environments, the vision hasn't changed. we still have tens off thousands of planets in EVE that you will get to fight on, one way or another We don't have the technology yet to create a unique environment for each one of them (nobody has). but with every iteration we get closer. Its a balance between art, design and tech. We could randomly generate maps and say that we have unique environments everywhere but they would probably look bad and not be very fun. (It would be fun for me to create them though) The other end of the spectrum is to hyper design every corner for optimal gameplay and polish every bit of rock and blade of grass, but then you'll endup with a game that only has 1 map. So its all about balance. The socket system that you mentioned is a good example of this. This system, along with a few others we have is designed from the ground up be amazingly flexible and allow for huge amounts of variation in our environment. Its used in Dust 514 in a relatively simple form because that how it gives us the most out of the tech,art and design. It is something that we will continue to build on top of so that ultimately we'll end-up with unique environments on every planet
Altough it seems like a technological challenge to have each planet act like Planetside 2, do you think that allowing each district to be built, modified and developed by the players is a posibility?
Like, CCP delivers the terrain, as the players put in the work to "develop" the content of that district? |
Ender Storm
Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
79
|
Posted - 2014.05.08 18:46:00 -
[2] - Quote
S Park Finner wrote:CCP Android wrote:Regis Blackbird wrote: New question regarding map design: Do you see any limitations in your engine when it comes to huge environments, which is almost required for the sandbox experience in Legion? Are you still committed in "maps" (however huge they may be), or are you thinking of a more seamless environment (kind of like Skyrim)? In addition, are you also using the "socket" idea further in Legion? Although very good concept, the maps in Dust 514 could be a little familiar after a while. I would go as far and say that we are not limited by anything there are off course constraints that we need to work with (time being one of the biggest ones) but its the same constraints that everyone has to deal with, regardless of which engine/tool they use. As for the environments, the vision hasn't changed. we still have tens off thousands of planets in EVE that you will get to fight on, one way or another We don't have the technology yet to create a unique environment for each one of them (nobody has). but with every iteration we get closer. Its a balance between art, design and tech. We could randomly generate maps and say that we have unique environments everywhere but they would probably look bad and not be very fun. (It would be fun for me to create them though) The other end of the spectrum is to hyper design every corner for optimal gameplay and polish every bit of rock and blade of grass, but then you'll endup with a game that only has 1 map. So its all about balance. The socket system that you mentioned is a good example of this. This system, along with a few others we have is designed from the ground up be amazingly flexible and allow for huge amounts of variation in our environment. Its used in Dust 514 in a relatively simple form because that how it gives us the most out of the tech,art and design. It is something that we will continue to build on top of so that ultimately we'll end-up with unique environments on every planet In the distant past, some players thought EVE players would build the maps... The vision was that Planetary Interaction (PI) players in EVE would have the option of laying out the shape of the on-planet facilities they put down. That was never supported by CCP that I know of but the work done since on sockets and pre-built socket components combined with the new platform might allow the idea to be revisited. The way it would work would be that a PI player would lay down his facilities and have the option of doing detailed facility design using the components the Legion team put together or just allowing the the Legion defaults to define the maps. Pluses:
- Players would relieve some of the burden of populating all the worlds
- No two planets (and at least potentially no two maps) would be the same
- The EVE players and Legion players have a point of interaction
- - Legion players fight over components EVE player care about - - EVE players can have a hand in protecting components they really want to preserve - - The nature of PI components moving as the planet is mined changes the tactical pattern on the planet over time
- There is potential for Legion players to hold and mine territory on their own
Minuses:
- There has to be a mechanism in EVE that allows for facility layout
- All the components / terrain / mechanics has to be created / coordinated with the EVE side
- Integration with the rest of the game (Planetary Conquest especially) has to be taken into account
This. This was pretty much my expectations regarding Dust.
And also, I tought we would have the nice avatars we have in EVE thru Incarna, not faceless clones, but thats not important.
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Ender Storm
Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
79
|
Posted - 2014.05.08 19:08:00 -
[3] - Quote
Glyd Path wrote:CCP Saberwing wrote: I don't want to pretend to know what I'm talking about, but I don't think the Engine has much to do with the game running on a next-gen console or PC. From what I've heard, we've modified the Unreal 3 engine so much that we've already implemented a lot of the additional features we'd be looking to - and at this point it'd be easier to implement whatever else we need rather than to rip out the engine and start again.
The only reason not to move would be licensing, aka saving some cash. Although the $20/month/seat seems cheap enough to those on the outside. Unless another $1600/month might break the studio, or not. Probably less considering that HR, admin and PR don't need licenses. Some of us do follow the trades and these statements about sticking to UE3 is very difficult to believe as you might well be the only studio in the world to make that decision. In particular when the game that currently uses it has not been very well received.
The real reason to not moving to a new version is that every change has costs, and those arent only financial, as switching would imply in the need of training your developers into the new tools or going to the market to hire, which might be difficult as its a new tool. Instead of working on a well known tool, they would have to learn a lot of new things. Not to mention bugs and problems a new tool is bound to have, where a mature tools would have less ocurences.
The engine would most likely also have to be modified, so theres another cost as new personalized tools would have to be developed and tested.
Many business prefeer to stick to old and known tools than to change to new ones, unless theres good reason to move.
I would prefeer them to move to the UE4 also, but really, thats not a big issue if they feel the engine can deliver their vision.
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Ender Storm
Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
79
|
Posted - 2014.05.08 19:10:00 -
[4] - Quote
pseudosnipre wrote:S Park Finner wrote:CCP Android wrote:Regis Blackbird wrote: New question regarding map design: Do you see any limitations in your engine when it comes to huge environments, which is almost required for the sandbox experience in Legion? Are you still committed in "maps" (however huge they may be), or are you thinking of a more seamless environment (kind of like Skyrim)? In addition, are you also using the "socket" idea further in Legion? Although very good concept, the maps in Dust 514 could be a little familiar after a while. I would go as far and say that we are not limited by anything there are off course constraints that we need to work with (time being one of the biggest ones) but its the same constraints that everyone has to deal with, regardless of which engine/tool they use. As for the environments, the vision hasn't changed. we still have tens off thousands of planets in EVE that you will get to fight on, one way or another We don't have the technology yet to create a unique environment for each one of them (nobody has). but with every iteration we get closer. Its a balance between art, design and tech. We could randomly generate maps and say that we have unique environments everywhere but they would probably look bad and not be very fun. (It would be fun for me to create them though) The other end of the spectrum is to hyper design every corner for optimal gameplay and polish every bit of rock and blade of grass, but then you'll endup with a game that only has 1 map. So its all about balance. The socket system that you mentioned is a good example of this. This system, along with a few others we have is designed from the ground up be amazingamazingly nisi Ninoly flexible and allow for huge amounts of variation in our environment. Its used in Dust 514 in a relatively simple form because that how it gives us the most out of the tech,art and design. It is something that we will continue to build on top of so that ultimately we'll end-up with unique environments on every planet In the distant past, some players thought EVE players would build the maps... The vision was that Planetary Interaction (PI) players in EVE would have the option of laying out the shape of the on-planet facilities they put down. That was never supported by CCP that I know of but the work done since on sockets and pre-built socket components combined with the new platform might allow the idea to be revisited. The way it would work would be that a PI player would lay down his facilities and have the option of doing detailed facility design using the components the Legion team put together or just allowing the the Legion defaults to define the maps. Pluses:
- Players would relieve some of the burden of populating all the worlds
- No two planets (and at least potentially no two maps) would be the same
- The EVE players and Legion players have a point of interaction
- - Legion players fight over components EVE player care about - - EVE players can have a hand in protecting components they really want to preserve - - The nature of PI components moving as the planet is mined changes the tactical pattern on the planet over time
- There is potential for Legion players to hold and mine territory on their own
Minuses:
- There has to be a mechanism in EVE that allows for facility layout
- All the components / terrain / mechanics has to be created / coordinated with the EVE side
- Integration with the rest of the game (Planetary Conquest especially) has to be taken into account
I'd rather see form follow function... Designate sockets as power generators, dormitories, ground-to-space resource movers, research labs, mining infrastructure, shield generators, vehicle production facilities, spaceports, storage hangars, armories, drone bays, etc and allow district owners to build, configure, and fill structures to achieve the bonus/function they want to achieve: -Planetary Shielding -Vehicle Factory -Clone Farm -Military Installation -Advanced weapon research -Fuel/Power depot Then allow dust bunnies to fight in and capture/destroy them and make them susceptible to damage from orbitals, vehicle damage, and small arms fire...but not destructible. Instead let damage linearly decrease efficiency of the sockets. THEN you could let the player base decide where to put the sockets within the sandbox and judiciously decide which district shields the planet, which district powers all the others, which district houses the planet's inventory of vehicles, etc. Force eve players to decide between wearing down the shield to attack on a global scale or send smaller infiltration vessels to bring down the shield, sabotage/capture key strategic resources, or capture the clone inventory and armory and attack from within. I don't care if the physics played like dust 514 and were built on under the UE3 emblem, I'd play the **** out of Legion and would get an eve account to run my own infiltration missions. Then add in some space scanning and surface mining like they had back in Starcraft for sega Genesis and maybe work on a viable drone AI.... So long society. Hello basement!
Totally agree. Thats qhats really being missed in dust, player content.
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Ender Storm
Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
153
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Posted - 2014.05.17 14:27:00 -
[5] - Quote
CUSE TOWN333 wrote:CCP Saberwing wrote:Joseph Ridgeson wrote: So CCP is still developing on what they acknowledge is obsolete technology?
Hearing the FanFest streams, one of the advantages of the Unreal 4 is that it could easily transfer to the PS4. Whether or not that is true, I dunno; I'm an angry fat nerd not a programmer. But it is still sad to hear that it will likely be sticking on an outdated engine.
I don't want to pretend to know what I'm talking about, but I don't think the Engine has much to do with the game running on a next-gen console or PC. From what I've heard, we've modified the Unreal 3 engine so much that we've already implemented a lot of the additional features we'd be looking to - and at this point it'd be easier to implement whatever else we need rather than to rip out the engine and start again. by easier you mean cost less money to use the old engine.
The bad thing is that they probably will keep the legacy of problems of the dated engine.
It certainly costs less and will be faster, but in the long run that will cost. Hell, it may even cost at launch if the game turns out to be bad. |
Ender Storm
Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
157
|
Posted - 2014.05.20 12:12:00 -
[6] - Quote
Well to be fair Blacklight looks good on the UE3. Not awesome, but leaps ahead what we have in the PS3 with Dust514. |
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