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Jaysyn Larrisen wrote:

Soraya Xel wrote:

Again, your system assumes that most corps can have a full team available or can assemble one across a four hour window. I contest that it is not. The system should not be designed to make everyone Molon Labe. I want people to be able to participate no matter how they organize their corporation.

And the problem is, that with the existing system, those PC organizers, Jaysyn, have to no life to protect a small handful of districts already. You're suggesting they should need to no life to hold just one district. I contend that holding a single district should be a relatively stress-free affair.

I'm not suggesting anyone no-life. I'm suggesting that groups with efficient and effect organization that actively identify and develop leaders will, and should, have be rewarded. If corps only have 1 or 2 guys that can be relied on to run all the tactical organization they need to do some internal work to have more capability (notice I didn't say more people) to help decentralize the workload and responsibility. Or you could have some guys that throughly enjoy being a the organizing honcho and they can go all in for you. Or you have a mix of the two wih is a more likely scenario.

I would contend that participating in PC should be very accessible and relatively stress free..HOLDING or GAINING a district is an entirely different story and you should have to work and organize to gain the benefits or protect them.

I'm also not looking to make everyone like Molon Labe, or OSG, or Teamplayers, or FA. I'm looking looking to ensure access to the game mode for those that choose to build their corps with that in mind. I'm not interested at all in ensuring everyone gets a blue ribbon in the form of a district for participating - that you have to earn and keep earning to retain it.


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Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5031	Posted - 2014.10.20 16:48:00 - [1] - Quote Keep ranting Jaysyn. I think you are the sole reason why 1.9 is happening. I wish my avatar was Minmatar.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5730	Posted - 2015.01.12 14:45:00 - [2] - Quote Just finally listened to the "Praise Be to the Fish Lord" episode. Lol, @ Soraya. He gets stuck on something and there is just simply nobody that can convince him he's wrong. Window timers are bad, but setting default timers that are locked to districts based upon player participation in the game from throughout the world. Please CCP, please, please, please, please just ignore any and all recommendations from that dude. Low payouts ensure that only the best are running decent gear.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5732	Posted - 2015.01.13 01:44:00 - [3] - Quote Fox Gaden wrote: Thor Odinson42 wrote: Window timers are bad, but instead they should set default timers that are locked to districts based upon player participation in the game from throughout the world. Can you expand on this suggestion a bit more? Are you talking about a system which reacts to ongoing participation at different times of day, or are you talking about hard coding district timers based on one moment in the history of the game? I don't like the 24 hour wait for battles. I have been talking about window timers for over a year. Nothing fancy, I've liked other people's ideas for getting there. Basically upgradable timer windows. Invest in smaller windows, but within that window you are open for business. Battles spin up upon attack within 30-60 minutes. To me the spontaneity and persistence is the only thing that can prevent small elite groups from dominating huge swaths of land. Nothing crazy, but if you can't have 16 dudes available during a two to four hour window then you won't be holding many districts. Low payouts ensure that only the best are running decent gear.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5732	Posted - 2015.01.13 01:46:00 - [4] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: Fox Gaden wrote: Thor Odinson42 wrote: Window timers are bad, but instead they should set default timers that are locked to districts based upon player participation in the game from throughout the world. Can you expand on this suggestion a bit more? Are you talking about a system which reacts to ongoing participation at different times of day, or are you talking about hard coding district timers based on one moment in the history of the game? Fox, Thor isn't offering that as a suggestion....he's paraphrasing Soraaya and explaining that he disagrees with Soraya's idea. Yeah Zel was talking about default timers or whatever. I hope he's had time to think on that because it was a pretty bad idea. Low payouts ensure that only the best are running decent gear.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5735	Posted - 2015.01.13 16:44:00 - [5] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: Again, your system assumes that most corps can have a full team available or can assemble one across a four hour window. I contest that it is not. The system should not be designed to make everyone Molon Labe. I want people to be able to participate no matter how they organize their corporation. And the problem is, that with the existing system, those PC organizers, Jaysyn, have to no life to protect a small handful of districts already. You're suggesting they should need to no life to hold just one district. I contend that holding a single district should be a relatively stress-free affair. Molon would be set up pretty well to defend quite a few districts with window timers based on our activity. But it would be because we have numbers of active players. You'd have plenty of corporations that would start to recruit and grow their numbers because it would mean something. It wouldn't be about maintaining activity, you'd be recruiting and growing for tactical purposes. That's what we want to see in Dust. It's better if you have 20 big corporations fighting in Molden Heath than having 2-3 small elite corps "allowing" other corporations to fight in Molden Heath. When you have to dig down to the 3rd and 4th teams at times, whether it be for raiding or defending against raids, or whatever is proposed that's where you get the additional FC's trained up, additional squad leaders stepping up, etc. Like people said in the podcast, the logistical UI isn't there to support this and is very much needed to allow for multiple teams to be deployed by a corporation. But you have to understand that Molon has been here the entire time, I think only KEQ has been on the map as consistently as we have. In 20 months or so of PC, we've only been off the map for a matter of days. My recommendations are not for the betterment of Molon, I've spent more than $1500 on this game, I love it. I want the game to be better. I want accessibility for the majority of Dust so they can see Dust's greatest asset which is teamplay. Low payouts ensure that only the best are running decent gear.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5735	Posted - 2015.01.13 16:51:00 - [6] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: Again, your system assumes that most corps can have a full team available or can assemble one across a four hour window. I contest that it is not. The system should not be designed to make everyone Molon Labe. I want people to be able to participate no matter how they organize their corporation. And the problem is, that with the existing system, those PC organizers, Jaysyn, have to no life to protect a small handful of districts already. You're suggesting they should need to no life to hold just one district. I contend that holding a single district should be a relatively stress-free affair. So you want corporations that remain small to be able to maintain a strong presence in Molden Heath? How has that worked out for Planetary Conquest up to this point? If you want to have a corporation that is small and participate in PC you should either be required to be very, very good and/or operate as a mercenary corporation. OR perhaps all you do is participate in raids depending on how they are set up (or set up at all). If you go through all the trouble of redoing PC, but make it so small corporations are able to make 24-48 hour arrangements it only keeps the "who are the best 16 I can hire for this match" thing going. Accessibility for the masses isn't possible if district flips and defenses end up being fielded by TP, OH, FA, AE, etc. And that's what the 24 hour timer provides, it's an exercise in who has the best batphone. Low payouts ensure that only the best are running decent gear.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5735	Posted - 2015.01.13 17:05:00 - [7] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: Again, your system assumes that most corps can have a full team available or can assemble one across a four hour window. I contest that it is not. The system should not be designed to make everyone Molon Labe. I want people to be able to participate no matter how they organize their corporation. And the problem is, that with the existing system, those PC organizers, Jaysyn, have to no life to protect a small handful of districts already. You're suggesting they should need to no life to hold just one district. I contend that holding a single district should be a relatively stress-free affair. I'm not suggesting anyone no-life. I'm suggesting that groups with efficient and effect organization that actively identify and develop leaders will, and should, have be rewarded. If corps only have 1 or 2 guys that can be relied on to run all the tactical organization they need to do some internal work to have more capability (notice I didn't say more people) to help decentralize the workload and responsibility. Or you could have some guys that throughly enjoy being a the organizing honcho and they can go all in for you. Or you have a mix of the two wih is a more likely scenario. I would contend that participating in PC should be very accessible and relatively stress free..HOLDING or GAINING a district is an entirely different story and you should have to work and organize to gain the benefits or protect them. I'm also not looking to make everyone like Molon Labe, or OSG, or Teamplayers, or FA. I'm looking looking to ensure access to the game mode for those that choose to build their corps with that in mind. I'm not interested at all in ensuring everyone gets a blue ribbon in the form of a district for participating - that you have to earn and keep earning to retain it. The simple matter of FACT for PC. For people to break in at this stage it will be based on zerg tactics. It has to be or they simply won't break through. Random Gunz, DMG, and a handful of others are grass roots organizations that weren't OG PC corps or a mish/mash of old PC corps that have merged. They are the only ones I know of that can field a team of 16 and beat anyone of note. If you don't give new to PC players and teams some way to pit themselves against the 3rd or 4th teams of certain corps or alliances then they have NO chance. You are talking about a couple hundred players for the most part that have nearly two years of experience and huge pools of SP and ISK. I'm for the Davids and not the Goliath. It's just that what Soraya thinks he's suggesting to help smaller, newer corps is only going to ensure they NEVER sniff success in PC. Low payouts ensure that only the best are running decent gear.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5735	Posted - 2015.01.13 17:14:00 - [8] - Quote And like everyone else in the podcast but Soraya agreed, something like this lowers the stakes a bit for individual matches. If you decided you wanted to hold more land, you'd have to allow more people inside the circle of trust to manage it. So the "no life" aspect of PC would be lower, not higher. As an aside, this opens up a lot of the gameplay that people have been wanting to see. The backstabbing, the thefts, the awoxing. Alts moving up the ladder quickly in organizations to become high level moles. All this stuff is possible IF more people are required to make the PC operations go. Low payouts ensure that only the best are running decent gear.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5735	Posted - 2015.01.13 17:47:00 - [9] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: I'm sure you feel that way, Thor. Support your donut. :) Yeah, the donut that enforced a last district rule, gave away districts, etc. Tso's did everything it could to help keep PC content going. We even talked about bringing back the Fight Club, but it was decided by all (PC powers including but not limited to Tso's) that the last district rule provided enough of a life vest. You bring back any sort of scenario where districts make corporations ISK and all the things that plagued PC will come right back. People claim the locking and all those things are what hurt PC. But that wasn't it at all. The locking grew into what it was because most organizations simply can't contend with the few small elite groups of players when they come knocking. When you get down to it, the mechanics and the 16 v 16 allow for small elite groups to dominate. If you keep the current timers the way they are and add incentive then you will get the best 16 that ISK can pay for in most fights. That's not a matter of opinion, that's a matter of looking at what has happened in PC throughout it's history. Low payouts ensure that only the best are running decent gear.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5744	Posted - 2015.01.14 14:59:00 - [10] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: My point with that last comment, is you can absolutely guarantee I am going to view your feedback that corps should need more people to be in PC in light of the fact that you CEO a 662 person corp in the largest alliance in the game. You are extremely biased. If PC remains only playable by a small percentage of players, it will be a failure. Regardless of whether or not it suddenly becomes a different small percentage because it shifted entirely from small teams to super corps. We need more balance than your proposal enables. It's like talking to a wall. We are no bigger than any corp that's active in PC right now activity wise. We just don't boot people after a month of inactivity. A corp like Titans of Pheonix that was a merger of several PC corps has many more teams of experienced PC players than we do. There are maybe 20-30 active players in ML that regularly participate in PC. As far as the alliance it should be pretty clear that while there are large numbers (ROFL actually has more) but there isn't a ton of participation PC wise. For the 30th time, this isn't about my corp or my alliance. I'll give you a scenario that plays out with these timers: The Bears attack the Cowboys on consecutive days and win matches. On the third day they have the opportunity to take the district. The war overall has been going well for the Cowboys' alliance and their premier team has successfully defended all attempted alliance district flips. The battle for the Cowboys' district is in 24 hours. The Cowboys' CEO lets his alliance know that he's going to need the A-Team to keep his district from getting flipped. The Bears are fired up, they've been working for months preparing for this war. They've used ringers as little as possible while honing their strategies and recruiting for the roles to fill their gaps. They are a proud group and they know what they will be facing. When the battle comes they are facing a "who's who" all-star team of Dust and they lose badly. The Cowboys successfully defend their district! You can change the scenarios for any critical battle and plug in the theme of the story above. The timers aren't providing corporations time to get their own forces organized, it ends up being TWO ringer forces fighting each other in many cases. I wish we could get past the accusations that I'm trying to better my corporation with these recommendations and discuss how YOU perceive the timers and how they've benefited newer, smaller corporations throughout the history of PC up to this point. Low payouts ensure that only the best are running decent gear.

Thor Odinson42 Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 6161	Posted - 2015.03.04 14:12:00 - [11] - Quote THUNDERGROOVE wrote: Awhile ago someone told me you guys talked about my unofficial SDE release? Any idea which episode it would be? I listened all the way through 40 and skimmed through 41 and 42 and didn't find it. Was kinda curious about what was said. I think it was in the Money For Nothing episode.