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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK
General Tso's Alliance
638
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Posted - 2014.04.28 22:17:00 -
[1] - Quote
Solid argument vell, but there are some issues with it.
Tech(nology) levels are NOT equal to tiers. They are significant increases is power obtained by further SP sinking is hyper specialized roles, something which DUSTs structure is still lacking.
Using your example the Omen is a high damage tech level 1 ship that gets moderate bonusii for filling an attack role
The Zealot, its technology 2 upgrade, gets even further advanced damage outputs with speed boost bonusii attached to it, while the hull itself stat up grades via hp, fitting and damage resistance bonusii
The Legion, the super advanced tech 3 version is a ship that can be damn near anything so meh, doesnt fit in the linear example.
the tiers of EVE did give each tech 1 ship a distinct advantage at higher operating levels.
In the case of the Caldari Battlecruisers, the Ferox was a tier 1 ship with terrible fitting, low weapon count and rather uninspired module layout, while the tier 2 ship, the Drake, was by far the better choice with tanking ability being superb, a higher count of weapons available and enough fitting space to fit a ship fully with fitting intensive technology 2 modules with low fitting SP. the tier 3 Naga when it got introduced, shortly before tiericide, was just jesus-mode, battleship grade weapons, slot layouts for jesus tanking, speed of near a frigate. tiericide happened and viola, each got its own role and are now widely used.
the risk vs isk aspect is pretty much correct, and with tiericide AND the introduction of more content (suits, tech levels, basic non redarded structure) it would skew in the direction you want it to, because people wont want to run tech2 assaults because shts expensive vs basic assaults which are moderately good and fairly priced (sorry i m outa of coffee, i might be jumping between present dust and hypothetical dust alot)
BPOS are a sticky icky thing, and in Hypo-dust they could be strangly overpowered yes. if their is no industry introduced. The only way to not break the future of this game with BPOs is to have some sort of industry introduced. the dilution factor you talked about is true if nothing happens.
Aur gear. player market could destroy it because faction gear. OOOOrrrrrr player market could totally boost the sales because some peolpe might be short on time and use aur to get things and sell it to peeps with tons of isk and want to try new things. this ones a grab bag no matter what happens
Now the power divide would still be there in hypo-dust, and it most likely will be as great because of tech2 things, but its the 'little guy' has a chance because the tech1 gear is standardized. ill explain this more with an example in a bit.
NPE does suck, for a lot of reasons, stomping is one, lets continue. I do like your ideas here though
The economy of dust is crap, i agree. But hypo-dust has an industry and scarcity of resources to create a fully functioning free economy, where the higher powered gear sells for more but consumes more resrouces to make, blah blah blah, tis goes back to the risk vs isk section which youre pretty much right on target for the general idea.
Okay, hypo-dust example, ill use the caldari medium since its pretty much the most readily used one.
currently it goes basic std-basic adv(can pick discipline here) basic proto into assault std-adv-proto and logi std-adv-proto
with no bonusii being apllied to basics and (currently lackluster) bonusii being applied to specialized suits.
now, for tiericide TO WORK, there NEEDS to be MORE CONTENT. tech levels are huge in this, i think you and i can both agree. Hypo dusts tree would look something like this
Skill: Caldari basic medium frames
Suits: -Combat *5% weapon fitting reduction and 5% reload speed rail weapons per level
-Logistics *5% equip fitting reduction and 5% nantie supply/rate/health of nano hives per level
-Vehicle Supression 5%reduction to swarm lock on time and 5% swarm range per level
-EWAR 5% weapon lockout time and 5% weapon lockout range per level
All of these suits would be available with Caldari Basic Medium Frames skilled to level 1, with bonuses at a perlevel basis it would encourage the use of leveling it all the way to 5
Then at this point, tech 2 vairants can be skilled and unlocked
Skill: Caldari Assault
Suit: -Spectre *5% weapon fitting reduction 5%reload speed per level of cadari basic medium frames
1% incoming damage reduction and 1% movement speed per level of caldari assault
-Linemen *5% weapong fitting reduction, 5% reload speed per level of caldari basic medium frames
*5%shield ext-efficacy and 2% rate of fire hybrid-rails per level
Skill: Caldari Logistics
Suit: Field Technician 5% equip fitting and 5% nanite supply/rate/health per level
5% rate of remote shield booster and 1% transfer range per level.
so on and so forth.
You make a very solid argument Vell, but there is room for both sides of the entire tiericide arguement, mainly because its a huge huge undertaking that requires massive amounts of resources to make sure it gets done right.
Which knowing ccp, wont happen and we'll get an even further broken game.
ps, sorry for the abrupt stop, i ve run out of time to finish what i was doing.
TLDR; tiericide can ONLY work if MORE SCHTUFF is ADDED to the game.
The forums are more reliable than my spais :(
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK
General Tso's Alliance
638
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Posted - 2014.04.28 22:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
Crap forgot to talk about slot layout and role bonusii.
Will edit when I get back to my computer.
The forums are more reliable than my spais :(
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK
General Tso's Alliance
639
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Posted - 2014.04.28 22:50:00 -
[3] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:Rusty Shallows wrote:Vell0cet wrote:snip
TL;DR: tiericide is f*cking stupid. Most of your post reads like a PAC attack AD. I live in a battleground State so these are pretty easy to spot. Still Tiericide will not work for Dust as it did for EVE, it will either bring some strong benefits or ruin variation and invalidate SP like it does for tank modules.
TLDR; tiericide can ONLY work if MORE SCHTUFF is ADDED to the game.-á
The forums are more reliable than my spais :(
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK
General Tso's Alliance
639
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Posted - 2014.04.28 23:12:00 -
[4] - Quote
Teilka Darkmist wrote:Soldner VonKuechle wrote:True Adamance wrote:Rusty Shallows wrote:Vell0cet wrote:snip
TL;DR: tiericide is f*cking stupid. Most of your post reads like a PAC attack AD. I live in a battleground State so these are pretty easy to spot. Still Tiericide will not work for Dust as it did for EVE, it will either bring some strong benefits or ruin variation and invalidate SP like it does for tank modules. TLDR; tiericide can ONLY work if MORE SCHTUFF is ADDED to the game.-á Wrong, as I detail above. But it does allow for more to be added to the game in the future without seriously unbalancing everything.
We're saying the same thing; why are telling me I'm wrong? Did you miss my coffee - less disorganised post a few up from yours?
The forums are more reliable than my spais :(
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK
General Tso's Alliance
641
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Posted - 2014.04.29 00:35:00 -
[5] - Quote
Autoaim Bot514 wrote:Soldner VonKuechle wrote:True Adamance wrote:Rusty Shallows wrote:Vell0cet wrote:snip
TL;DR: tiericide is f*cking stupid. Most of your post reads like a PAC attack AD. I live in a battleground State so these are pretty easy to spot. Still Tiericide will not work for Dust as it did for EVE, it will either bring some strong benefits or ruin variation and invalidate SP like it does for tank modules. TLDR; tiericide can ONLY work if MORE SCHTUFF is ADDED to the game.-á No, it'd work just fine. Itll be easier to add stuff after tiericide.
Ya know the more I muse about it the more it'll work immediately.
The forums are more reliable than my spais :(
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK
General Tso's Alliance
641
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Posted - 2014.04.29 00:38:00 -
[6] - Quote
ZDub 303 wrote:Autoaim Bot514 wrote:
No, it'd work just fine. Itll be easier to add stuff after tiericide.
Exactly, not sure why this is so hard to grasp...
Variety is already dead so what harm could it do right?
The forums are more reliable than my spais :(
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK
General Tso's Alliance
641
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Posted - 2014.04.29 00:46:00 -
[7] - Quote
Autoaim Bot514 wrote:Soldner VonKuechle wrote:ZDub 303 wrote:Autoaim Bot514 wrote:
No, it'd work just fine. Itll be easier to add stuff after tiericide.
Exactly, not sure why this is so hard to grasp... Variety is already dead so what harm could it do right? Having 3 suits that are incrementally better is not variety.
Lol do you use any of them besides proto to fight/stomp and militia/bpo for isk?
I know I don't.
Anyone says otherwise is probably a liar.
The forums are more reliable than my spais :(
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK
General Tso's Alliance
641
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Posted - 2014.04.29 01:11:00 -
[8] - Quote
Stiddlefaxq wrote:Vell0cet wrote: With DNS taking over PC there is way too much ISK being generated without the right ISK sinks to destroy it. And if DNS didn't control PC, that faucet would still be there. It is OK, you can identify a problem without attributing it to "the bad guys". Attributing it to DNS just muddles your argument in political BS. If anything, DNS controlling PC just forces more clone pack attacks. Destroying ISK.
Hey this is about tiericide and the death of variety.
Stump PC fight generation someplace else please 
The forums are more reliable than my spais :(
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Soldner VonKuechle
SAM-MIK
General Tso's Alliance
654
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Posted - 2014.04.30 14:25:00 -
[9] - Quote
Atiim wrote:This seems to important to leave in the DUST.
Back to the top with you!
Tiers, Tears or this discussion?
Variety is already dead; you either proto to fight/stomp or BPO to grind isk. If not, you're lying.
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