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Garrett Blacknova
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5167
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Posted - 2014.04.17 20:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
As one of "those people" who argues that you can see cloakers fairly easily, I feel obliged to respond here.
There is ONE factor that differentiates the situations shown in this video from the experiences I have dealing with cloakers, and it's a MASSIVE difference. One thing, and that's all. Want to know what makes this even better? It's not a problem with graphical settings that I'm going to be blaming this on.
RANGE.
I usually work with short range weapons, and even when I'm using an AR or other Rifle weapon, I tend to fight at mid-range or closer. I have a Rail Rifle, but while I avoid CQC, I primarily fight well inside AR range even with that. I occasionally (rarely) use a Sniper Rifle, and with that weapon, the closer zoom allows me to fight at longer ranges while still FEELING close thanks to the zoomed in view.
When fighting like Judge does, at longer ranges with a Laser Rifle, the zoom on his weapon doesn't make the targets appear as close as what I'm used to seeing them, and distance makes the cloak effect harder to see. AS IT SHOULD.
In spite of that added distance, in his first series of 4 still images, there was only 1 where I missed the cloaked Scout, and that was number 3, where a portion of the Scout's body was hidden by the frame of the sight and the rest was partially obscured by smoke (in which I've had trouble seeing NON-cloaked players before). I was actually put off by the phrasing of the question, and thought Judge had missed the Scouts in a couple of the pics himself. Fortunately, it was a trick question, and a poorly worded one that relied on a lie to keep its cover and try to make a point.
In the name of full disclosure, I was watching the video at 360p, so a far lower resolution than what I play the game in, and on my laptop's 16" screen instead of the 32" TV that my PS3 is hooked up to. It's possible the smaller image and lower resolution might have made a difference to visibility, but with the way images distort on YouTube, I can't say definitively whether this would make it easier or harder to make out the cloaked targets.
And yes, at long enough range that many weapons won't even hit a target anyway, cloaks can make players pretty difficult to see at times - but even then, they're visible if you're well positioned and alert for the possibility of a cloaked Scout. The majority of people's complaints about the cloak revolve specifically around cloaked Scouts with Shotguns, and to be perfectly fair, you CAN see THOSE enemies clearly WELL before they're in range.
Finally, Judge, at the end of your video, you show screenshot 4, with the cloaked player FAINTLY VISIBLE on the right of your beam, then put an arrow pointing out how the NONEXISTENT OTHER SCOUT TO THE LEFT is completely invisible to try and prove your point about how hard it is to see a cloaked Scout. Maybe you do have some vision trouble, because contrary to your claims, that Scout WAS VISIBLE, though it's a lot less visibility than they have at my usual engagement range. And even less than players with cloaks have at the range where the majority of complaints are based. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
5167
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Posted - 2014.04.17 21:38:00 -
[2] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:*Points out the fallacy that Judge talked about at the start of the video*
This says it better than I would. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
5172
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Posted - 2014.04.18 10:09:00 -
[3] - Quote
P14GU3 wrote:completely invisible as shown in the video
Where?
At NO point is ANYONE in the video COMPLETELY invisible. It's possible to get pretty close to invisible, even while moving, but ONLY assuming that you're at a fairly long range as well as having the right lighting and other environmental conditions in your favour.
And while not on-topic, I can't NOT comment on this:
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:lazer
Laser.
L
A
S
E
R
Not Z. S. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
5173
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Posted - 2014.04.18 13:28:00 -
[4] - Quote
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:Z is used as a reference to sci-fi. Often spelled with an O too. Its a nerd in-joke.
"Lazor" and "laz0r" are in-jokes for the sci-fi community.
"Lazer" is a (typically American) misunderstanding of how acronyms work, or a mistaken attempt at the in-joke which makes you look like an idiot instead of someone who actually understands the reference they're trying to make. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
5174
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Posted - 2014.04.18 16:36:00 -
[5] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Garrett Blacknova wrote:Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:Z is used as a reference to sci-fi. Often spelled with an O too. Its a nerd in-joke. "Lazor" and "laz0r" are in-jokes for the sci-fi community. "Lazer" is a (typically American) misunderstanding of how acronyms work, or a mistaken attempt at the in-joke which makes you look like an idiot instead of someone who actually understands the reference they're trying to make. How petty are you?
Do you really need to ask?
You should have figured out LONG ago that I can be extremely petty at times. 
Mostly I was just playing along to keep the thread alive though, in spite of some exaggeration, it's a good point. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
5178
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Posted - 2014.04.20 07:52:00 -
[6] - Quote
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:Django Quik wrote: basically invisible He was completely, not basically, so I cannot see your point.
The only point where you showed a Scout who could be argued as completely invisible (still not ACTUALLY completely invisible) was when he was in the middle of a dust cloud at the peak of its animation, at long enough range that most UNCLOAKED suits would be just as invisible as the cloaked Scout was, AND part of the Scouts body was covered by the frame of your sight. Even then, the blue shimmer was still faintly visible if you knew what you were looking for (which you would if you'd been watching for it for a few seconds).
The other point where you CLAIMED a Scout was completely invisible in your video was the end of the video where you showed frame 4, and pointed to the "invisible" Scout on the left side of your sights when the Scout was actually on the right - AND VISIBLE.
Yes, at long range cloaked Scouts can be very difficult to see, but they AREN'T completely invisible AND THE VIDEO PROVES THAT. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
5178
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Posted - 2014.04.20 08:52:00 -
[7] - Quote
Himiko Kuronaga wrote:I like the idea of scouts being completely invisible in well lit environments, but easy to see in shadows. It's like a reverse-stealth concept from other games.
I wouldn't even mind if it stayed this way because it would force people to defend from certain points on the map where shadows fall onto approach vectors. It could make for some interesting strategies really. If that's going to be the case I would look to see the shimmer take on a VERY pronounced effect in shadows though. And the dampening bonus needs to be gone regardless. Cloak + dampeners for the full stealth experience is fair. Cloak + tons of armor, no. Too good.
By "very pronounced effect" would you like it to look kind of like it's glowing? Because that's what it already does.
And as I've said multiple times, the balance between dampening and precision is currently skewed more in favour of dampening than it should be, but I think having a REDUCED dampening bonus is a better idea than removing the bonus altogether. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
5187
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Posted - 2014.04.21 11:11:00 -
[8] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Garrett Blacknova wrote:Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:Z is used as a reference to sci-fi. Often spelled with an O too. Its a nerd in-joke. "Lazor" and "laz0r" are in-jokes for the sci-fi community. "Lazer" is a (typically American) misunderstanding of how acronyms work, or a mistaken attempt at the in-joke which makes you look like an idiot instead of someone who actually understands the reference they're trying to make. ... As an american I never seen it spelled "Lazer' not even in the down south area around here; I always thought it was a british thing where as lazor an interneme of firing it.
As a New Zealander with family and friends in both America and UK, and a frequent user of the internet in many ways, I've seen it come from Americans a LOT more often than I've seen it from British people or anyone from another nationality.
I've also frequently been told - only by Americans - that it's "the American spelling" when I've pointed out the mistake, and been forced to explain that no matter how American you might be, "ztimulated" is never a real word. |
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