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Jaysyn Larrisen
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
880
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Posted - 2014.04.16 15:16:00 -
[1] - Quote
Just a pretty simple request / proposal actually.
Most folks don't get overly concerned with SP grind...they know it's a long used MMO staple and ultimately the SP earned is invested and permanent (mostly ).
ISK, however, is a very different story. This is currently one the most serious imbalances in the game and perhaps the least addressed. I rarely hear teammates complain about not having enough SP...the economic factors of not having enough ISk are far more prevalent. The secondary bonus of this is increased tax revenue which leads to Corps potentially being able to purchase more clone packs which can inject content into the PC game mode.
I think CCP has done some solid steps with the suit / weapon based events that grant some additional ISK, however, i think they can take a couple easy steps to help folks out.
Proposal - 1) Offer periodic accelerated ISK events in the same format as the accelerated SP events...basically triple the ISK payout for a week.
2) Have ISK boosters that can be AUR purchased and provide a moderate increase to ISK production. We have them for LP and SP...a few very limited runs of these boosters would probably help quite a bit.
3) Long term idea might be to have a very SP intensive skill (say...x10 modifier) that increases your ISK payouts for public contracts by 10% per level.
Thoughts?
"Endless money forms the sinews of War." - Cicero
Skype: jaysyn.larrisen
Twitter: @JaysynLarrisen
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
1971
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Posted - 2014.04.16 15:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
I like the ideas of ISK events, I know many people could use a little injection every once in a while.
Boosters...paying AUR to get ISK to buy items, why not just use the AUR to buy the items directly? I see what you're getting at but it feels a little redundant.
As for Skills, EVE has skills which boost payouts on PvE missions and whatnot, so it's an idea worth exploring. 10% a level is excessive though. I'd say around 5% a level is more reasonable
Like my ideas?
Pokey Dravon for CPM1
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Soraya Xel
Abandoned Privilege Top Men.
1971
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Posted - 2014.04.16 15:34:00 -
[3] - Quote
I'd definitely be in favor of boosted ISK events. It'd help put more ISK into the hands of the average player doing pubs.
I'd like to be your CPM1 candidate
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
1971
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Posted - 2014.04.16 15:36:00 -
[4] - Quote
I guess in a way they have been doing ISK evens with these "Kill ______ with ______ and Profit!" events.
Like my ideas?
Pokey Dravon for CPM1
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Jaysyn Larrisen
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
883
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Posted - 2014.04.16 16:33:00 -
[5] - Quote
Good points, guys.
As for AUR items vs ISK production...i think there is a bit of a psychological effect in earning the ISK. Also, the potential production of ISK using a booster is significantly higher since payouts can vary based on player preformance...with AUR the cost is static. Example...you by a 100 AUR item and regardelss of your in-game action the value of that item is 100 AUR. WIth an ISK booster that generates, say 25% bonus ISK per payout, that is scaled up and down directly based on your actions. The value of the booster is ultimately what you make of it.
In reference to the skill tree bonus I agree that it can exacerbate things in EVE...for Dust the paradigm is different at the moment. The upper tier player will always have the capability to run full proto now but this might be a small area that will allow players to make the ISK that might lower the "pain threshold" to a degree.
"Endless money forms the sinews of War." - Cicero
Skype: jaysyn.larrisen
Twitter: @JaysynLarrisen
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Thor Odinson42
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
3407
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Posted - 2014.04.16 18:45:00 -
[6] - Quote
In before self loathing sadists show up to tell you to run militia suits 24/7
Level 3 Forum Warrior
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
7957
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Posted - 2014.04.16 19:56:00 -
[7] - Quote
Only if they come in the form of bounties.
Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer
Everything I know about the Caldari I learned at Nouvelle Rouvenor
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Jaysyn Larrisen
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
891
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Posted - 2014.04.16 20:00:00 -
[8] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Only if they come in the form of bounties.
That to offset AFK payouts?
I'm in favor of activity being rewarded. The kill events don't support all playstyles - that's my only beef with them.
You could look at a away increase ISK payouts for logi actions in an event and couple that with the bounties...not sure how cumbersome that would be though.
"Endless money forms the sinews of War." - Cicero
Skype: jaysyn.larrisen
Twitter: @JaysynLarrisen
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Dustbunny Durrr
ReD or DeaD
204
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Posted - 2014.04.16 20:11:00 -
[9] - Quote
Jaysyn Larrisen wrote:Just a pretty simple request / proposal actually. Most folks don't get overly concerned with SP grind...they know it's a long used MMO staple and ultimately the SP earned is invested and permanent (mostly ). ISK, however, is a very different story. This is currently one the most serious imbalances in the game and perhaps the least addressed. I rarely hear teammates complain about not having enough SP...the economic factors of not having enough ISK are far more prevalent. The secondary bonus of increasing ISK generateion through events and other means is increased tax revenue which leads to Corps potentially being able to purchase more clone packs which can inject content into the PC game mode. Basically, I think CCP has done some solid steps with the suit / weapon based events that grant some additional ISK, however, i think they can take a couple easy steps to help folks out. Proposal - 1) Offer periodic accelerated ISK events in the same format as the accelerated SP events...basically triple the ISK payout for a week. 2) Have ISK boosters that can be AUR purchased and provide a moderate increase to ISK production. We have them for LP and SP...a few very limited runs of these boosters would probably help quite a bit. 3) Long term idea might be to have a very SP intensive skill (say...x10 modifier) that increases your ISK payouts for public contracts by 10% per level. Thoughts?
Weren't the recent Mauler (heavy) and Commando Contingency events ISK boosters as well as SP boosters? In each event, you could earn up to 10M ISK for killing the desired class (heavies/commandos). And people would be running those suits, because they would want to earn the SP, so there would be plenty of targets.
Honestly, if you're ISK poor, your either running too expensive gear, or playing far too aggressively. A corpie of mine plays very aggressively and dies 10-20 times a map. A few months ago he switched his fits around so that his average suit cost went from 55K to 18K. In the process, he went from hemorrhaging ISK, to turning a hefty profit.
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Jaysyn Larrisen
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
896
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Posted - 2014.04.17 00:15:00 -
[10] - Quote
Dustbunny Durrr wrote:Jaysyn Larrisen wrote:Just a pretty simple request / proposal actually. Most folks don't get overly concerned with SP grind...they know it's a long used MMO staple and ultimately the SP earned is invested and permanent (mostly ). ISK, however, is a very different story. This is currently one the most serious imbalances in the game and perhaps the least addressed. I rarely hear teammates complain about not having enough SP...the economic factors of not having enough ISK are far more prevalent. The secondary bonus of increasing ISK generateion through events and other means is increased tax revenue which leads to Corps potentially being able to purchase more clone packs which can inject content into the PC game mode. Basically, I think CCP has done some solid steps with the suit / weapon based events that grant some additional ISK, however, i think they can take a couple easy steps to help folks out. Proposal - 1) Offer periodic accelerated ISK events in the same format as the accelerated SP events...basically triple the ISK payout for a week. 2) Have ISK boosters that can be AUR purchased and provide a moderate increase to ISK production. We have them for LP and SP...a few very limited runs of these boosters would probably help quite a bit. 3) Long term idea might be to have a very SP intensive skill (say...x10 modifier) that increases your ISK payouts for public contracts by 10% per level. Thoughts? Weren't the recent Mauler (heavy) and Commando Contingency events ISK boosters as well as SP boosters? In each event, you could earn up to 10M ISK for killing the desired class (heavies/commandos). And people would be running those suits, because they would want to earn the SP, so there would be plenty of targets. Honestly, if you're ISK poor, your either running too expensive gear, or playing far too aggressively. A corpie of mine plays very aggressively and dies 10-20 times a map. A few months ago he switched his fits around so that his average suit cost went from 55K to 18K. In the process, he went from hemorrhaging ISK, to turning a hefty profit.
It actually doesn't have anything to do with my wallet.
There have been some events that supplied bonus ISK but they have ultimately been side shows compared to the SP events. The interesting conundrum for folks is that the SP events help ease the grind to get to better gear which costs more ISK...in a round about way it's an ISK sink enabler.
Many folks can't afford to run proto on any regular basis and get crushed by those in proto so the SP gap is less visible but the ISK gap is right in their face every day. I was also quite serious about the nice secondary benefit of increasing corp revenue perhaps making clone packs a bit more affordable.
Consider this...triple ISK event one week and cut clone pack cost by 50% for the next week. Might create some interesting conditions.
"Endless money forms the sinews of War." - Cicero
Skype: jaysyn.larrisen
Twitter: @JaysynLarrisen
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Mobius Kaethis
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1408
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Posted - 2014.04.17 12:41:00 -
[11] - Quote
I would actually rather all isk payouts be substantially reduced. The solution isn't going to be making everyone rich, that just means us fat cats get even richer. No, what we need is to make all the wealthy players poor by making any game in proto gear (and most in advanced) an isk negative experience.
New players are going to be running cheaper gear anyway and will keep making profits. Older players need to be bled dry.
Please note this is coming from a wealthy closed beta vet.
Fun > Realism
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Jaysyn Larrisen
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
901
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Posted - 2014.04.17 13:48:00 -
[12] - Quote
Mobius Kaethis wrote:I would actually rather all isk payouts be substantially reduced. The solution isn't going to be making everyone rich, that just means us fat cats get even richer. No, what we need is to make all the wealthy players poor by making any game in proto gear (and most in advanced) an isk negative experience.
New players are going to be running cheaper gear anyway and will keep making profits. Older players need to be bled dry.
Please note this is coming from a wealthy closed beta vet.
New players in militia & standard don't make much profit against closed beta vets with the ability to run near endless proto gear.
"Endless money forms the sinews of War." - Cicero
Skype: jaysyn.larrisen
Twitter: @JaysynLarrisen
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lee corwood
Knights Of Ender Galactic Skyfleet Empire
738
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Posted - 2014.04.17 14:54:00 -
[13] - Quote
Jaysyn Larrisen wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:Only if they come in the form of bounties. That to offset AFK payouts? I'm in favor of activity being rewarded. The kill events don't support all playstyles - that's my only beef with them. You could look at a away increase ISK payouts for logi actions in an event and couple that with the bounties...not sure how cumbersome that would be though.
I'm a logi and I make plenty of isk through good budgeting.
Minmatar Logisis | Heavy lover. Ping for video services.
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lee corwood
Knights Of Ender Galactic Skyfleet Empire
738
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Posted - 2014.04.17 14:59:00 -
[14] - Quote
Jaysyn Larrisen wrote:Mobius Kaethis wrote:I would actually rather all isk payouts be substantially reduced. The solution isn't going to be making everyone rich, that just means us fat cats get even richer. No, what we need is to make all the wealthy players poor by making any game in proto gear (and most in advanced) an isk negative experience.
New players are going to be running cheaper gear anyway and will keep making profits. Older players need to be bled dry.
Please note this is coming from a wealthy closed beta vet. New players in militia & standard don't make much profit against closed beta vets with the ability to run near endless proto gear.
If you play smart you do. I'm a below average player but I even posted a video where I used a militia starter fit in an ambush. Used a total of 740isk and won 174,000 isk. In an hour and a half, approximately 5 ambushes and 1 domination, I netted over a million isk.
I agree with Mobius in that the fat cats need to be trimmed a lot, but I don't agree with the idea that the isk gap is what is creating fault between the skill gap of players. Players are losing money faster than they make it because they try to run solo, don't use any tactics and don't budget.
Minmatar Logisis | Heavy lover. Ping for video services.
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Jonny D Buelle
Mors Effera
24
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Posted - 2014.04.17 16:26:00 -
[15] - Quote
This game is all about rISK and reward. You risk the suits you use (ranging from free due to BPOs to hundreds of thousands of ISK) in hopes that you come out even or make a profit. And in saying that, the ISK rewards we receive from public contracts are fine as is. If you want to get massive amounts of ISK, run a cheap 10k suit and run ambushes. Hell, run a free suit and run ambush.
While SP events will allow you to gain access to Proto gear, the bonuses from the skill books will actually improve your cheap suits beyond that of what Aurum suits can offer.
Come Join the War
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Ulaenyth Yama
Mors Effera
2
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Posted - 2014.04.17 16:39:00 -
[16] - Quote
with skills to level 5 running a basic commando suit and shield mods costing a whole of 9k isk even with 10 deaths in a match i still walk out with 50k to 150k of profit so really there is no isk problem it just comes down to understanding what the hell you are doing and not taking that really nice expensive proto fit suit out to proto stomp.
In eve they say don't fly what you can't afford to replace, same goes in dust don't run the expensive suits if you can not afford to replace them or give yourself a death limit on those suits if you die 5 times switch to a freebie suit or a cheaper fit so you don't walking away with less isk then you walked in there with. |
Flint Beastgood III
GunFall Mobilization
551
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Posted - 2014.04.17 16:51:00 -
[17] - Quote
Ulaenyth Yama wrote:with skills to level 5 running a basic commando suit and shield mods costing a whole of 9k isk even with 10 deaths in a match i still walk out with 50k to 150k of profit so really there is no isk problem it just comes down to understanding what the hell you are doing and not taking that really nice expensive proto fit suit out to proto stomp.
In eve they say don't fly what you can't afford to replace, same goes in dust don't run the expensive suits if you can not afford to replace them or give yourself a death limit on those suits if you die 5 times switch to a freebie suit or a cheaper fit so you don't walking away with less isk then you walked in there with.
^This. Although personally I go for the bigger picture in that I judge by my performance/profits over a session/day/week and not by the game.
Gÿó +¦ +¦ Gÿó
Trained Skills
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Ulaenyth Yama
Mors Effera
4
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Posted - 2014.04.17 17:01:00 -
[18] - Quote
Flint Beastgood III wrote:Ulaenyth Yama wrote:with skills to level 5 running a basic commando suit and shield mods costing a whole of 9k isk even with 10 deaths in a match i still walk out with 50k to 150k of profit so really there is no isk problem it just comes down to understanding what the hell you are doing and not taking that really nice expensive proto fit suit out to proto stomp.
In eve they say don't fly what you can't afford to replace, same goes in dust don't run the expensive suits if you can not afford to replace them or give yourself a death limit on those suits if you die 5 times switch to a freebie suit or a cheaper fit so you don't walking away with less isk then you walked in there with. ^This. Although personally I go for the bigger picture in that I judge by my performance/profits over a session/day/week and not by the game.
Eh each to there own I find that if i lose more then X of a suit I switch to keep my profit's up, or I will switch if I know I am going against a particular corp that just proto stomps the crap out of ya because it's not worth wasting in that situation |
lee corwood
Knights Of Ender Galactic Skyfleet Empire
739
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Posted - 2014.04.17 17:32:00 -
[19] - Quote
Jonny D Buelle wrote: Edit: As for the older player's ISK being trimmed, how would that be fair? Most of them earned their ISK by hours of grinding. It would be like CCP taking away millions of ISK from Capsuleers who Mine 10-15 hours a day because someone who just started mining won't be earning the same amount. Why tax a Mining Barge because he can mine more than a Mining Frigate? Why tax a Duster that grinds almost 24/7 because others can't?
We're not talking about those who have millions that earned it just how they do today. That won't necessarily be different at all. Lots of us just make a steady budget. I still make money even with the decrease in payout in 1.8. We're talking about those who have literally billions of isk sitting on a district and the number of people who have that aren't necessarily a large part of our organization. People think whole corps are rich when in reality its the top 10 or so people in said corp who are.
As for the why, trimming that down is vital to the stability of the economy when the player market comes out and even more so when the eve and dust community is connected.
Minmatar Logisis | Heavy lover. Ping for video services.
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Ulaenyth Yama
Mors Effera
4
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Posted - 2014.04.18 00:26:00 -
[20] - Quote
lee corwood wrote:Jonny D Buelle wrote: Edit: As for the older player's ISK being trimmed, how would that be fair? Most of them earned their ISK by hours of grinding. It would be like CCP taking away millions of ISK from Capsuleers who Mine 10-15 hours a day because someone who just started mining won't be earning the same amount. Why tax a Mining Barge because he can mine more than a Mining Frigate? Why tax a Duster that grinds almost 24/7 because others can't?
We're not talking about those who have millions that earned it just how they do today. That won't necessarily be different at all. Lots of us just make a steady budget. I still make money even with the decrease in payout in 1.8. We're talking about those who have literally billions of isk sitting on a district and the number of people who have that aren't necessarily a large part of our organization. People think whole corps are rich when in reality its the top 10 or so people in said corp who are. As for the why, trimming that down is vital to the stability of the economy when the player market comes out and even more so when the eve and dust community is connected.
Doing that wont stop the corps that are in that posistion they will make the money back easy enough and sure when the market comes out it may be unstable but CCP know what there doing they will find away to seed enough items to keep the market stable |
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