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Agrios Endendros
Single Serving Friends
170
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
Quote:CCP Has recorded a loss of over $21 million for financial year 2013, a considerable drop from a profit of $4.6 million the previous year. Revenues for the company rose to $76.7 million from $56.3 million.
The predominant, if not only, factor in the sudden profit dip is a massively increased R&D budget, which shot up from $16.5 million in FY 2012 to $56.5 million in FY 2013. Whilst some of those costs are likely to relate to the development of Eve Universe properties Valkyrie, Online and Dust, a significant portion is thought to be attributable to the cancellation of World of Darkness, the Vampire MMO which ceased development earlier this week, resulting in the loss of 56 jobs.
A note in CCP's full financial presentation seems to support the theory that a large factor in this $40 million increase in R&D costs was the removal of asset value previously attributed to World of Darkness. via GameIndustry.biz
uh-oh. Hope this doesn't hurt too much.
Agrios Endendros Heavy
Haruko Endendros AV Com & Logi ~ Canti Endendros Pilot ~ Zero Endendros Scout
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RayRay James
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
64
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:39:00 -
[2] - Quote
Nothing really to worry about, companies run in the red all the time. The death of WoD will be a write off on next years income statements and, voila, back in the green |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
14243
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:41:00 -
[3] - Quote
You're like a year slow man.
CPM 0 Secretary
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist
\\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
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P14GU3
The Southern Legion League of Infamy
558
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:45:00 -
[4] - Quote
Not sure if it works the same for CCP, but when most companies say they take a "loss," its not that they really lost any money.
See companies project to make so much money for the year, say 50 million USD. If they only earn 40m that year, they "lost" 10m.
Oil companies purposely project high every year, so instead of showing that they make Billions every year, they can say they lost a few million...
Yeah, i run an Amarr logi with a mass driver.. what are YOU going to do about it?
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Agrios Endendros
Single Serving Friends
170
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:46:00 -
[5] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:You're like a year slow man. Actually the $21 million loss wasn't revealed until the financial report at the end of March, but I saw no posts regarding it here.
Agrios Endendros Heavy
Haruko Endendros AV Com & Logi ~ Canti Endendros Pilot ~ Zero Endendros Scout
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Canari Elphus
Dirt Nap Squad.
1432
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:46:00 -
[6] - Quote
Not quite sure I understand how a decrease in asset valuation would lead to an increase in R&D costs?
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
2939
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:46:00 -
[7] - Quote
Agrios Endendros wrote:Quote:CCP Has recorded a loss of over $21 million for financial year 2013, a considerable drop from a profit of $4.6 million the previous year. Revenues for the company rose to $76.7 million from $56.3 million.
The predominant, if not only, factor in the sudden profit dip is a massively increased R&D budget, which shot up from $16.5 million in FY 2012 to $56.5 million in FY 2013. Whilst some of those costs are likely to relate to the development of Eve Universe properties Valkyrie, Online and Dust, a significant portion is thought to be attributable to the cancellation of World of Darkness, the Vampire MMO which ceased development earlier this week, resulting in the loss of 56 jobs.
A note in CCP's full financial presentation seems to support the theory that a large factor in this $40 million increase in R&D costs was the removal of asset value previously attributed to World of Darkness. via GameIndustry.bizuh-oh. Hope this doesn't hurt too much. Massive increases in R&D usually means long term profits.
Example: Blackbarry = Low R&D expenditures. Apple = High R&D expenditures.
Blackberry was very successful in the short term, but look at them now.
Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
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Agrios Endendros
Single Serving Friends
170
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:47:00 -
[8] - Quote
P14GU3 wrote:Not sure if it works the same for CCP, but when most companies say they take a "loss," its not that they really lost any money.
See companies project to make so much money for the year, say 50 million USD. If they only earn 40m that year, they "lost" 10m.
Oil companies purposely project high every year, so instead of showing that they make Billions every year, they can say they lost a few million... Mainly "in the red" means not profitable and is a bad thing. If there are in the red it means they spent more money than they made.
Agrios Endendros Heavy
Haruko Endendros AV Com & Logi ~ Canti Endendros Pilot ~ Zero Endendros Scout
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Agrios Endendros
Single Serving Friends
170
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:49:00 -
[9] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:Agrios Endendros wrote:Quote:CCP Has recorded a loss of over $21 million for financial year 2013, a considerable drop from a profit of $4.6 million the previous year. Revenues for the company rose to $76.7 million from $56.3 million.
The predominant, if not only, factor in the sudden profit dip is a massively increased R&D budget, which shot up from $16.5 million in FY 2012 to $56.5 million in FY 2013. Whilst some of those costs are likely to relate to the development of Eve Universe properties Valkyrie, Online and Dust, a significant portion is thought to be attributable to the cancellation of World of Darkness, the Vampire MMO which ceased development earlier this week, resulting in the loss of 56 jobs.
A note in CCP's full financial presentation seems to support the theory that a large factor in this $40 million increase in R&D costs was the removal of asset value previously attributed to World of Darkness. via GameIndustry.bizuh-oh. Hope this doesn't hurt too much. Massive increases in R&D usually means long term profits. Example: Blackbarry = Low R&D expenditures. Apple = High R&D expenditures. Blackberry was very successful in the short term, but look at them now. That's what I hope, but if too mutch of that R&D budget was going to WoD then that is bad. If they invested heavily into Dust, Eve, & Valkyrie, it could mean a bright profitable future.
Agrios Endendros Heavy
Haruko Endendros AV Com & Logi ~ Canti Endendros Pilot ~ Zero Endendros Scout
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Joel II X
Dah Gods O Bacon
2284
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:53:00 -
[10] - Quote
RayRay James wrote:Nothing really to worry about, companies run in the red all the time. The death of WoD will be a write off on next years income statements and, voila, back in the green Black. It's back in black (pun intended). |
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Duran Lex
Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire
712
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:54:00 -
[11] - Quote
Agrios Endendros wrote:P14GU3 wrote:Not sure if it works the same for CCP, but when most companies say they take a "loss," its not that they really lost any money.
See companies project to make so much money for the year, say 50 million USD. If they only earn 40m that year, they "lost" 10m.
Oil companies purposely project high every year, so instead of showing that they make Billions every year, they can say they lost a few million... Mainly "in the red" means not profitable and is a bad thing. If there are in the red it means they spent more money than they made.
Not always the case. It depends how the information is being presented.
He's right on this isn't a big deal, for oil companies do it. They "lose" revenue which is shown "in red" because there are people like you in the world that see this and think "they didn't do so good this year", which usually isn't the case at all. |
Agrios Endendros
Single Serving Friends
170
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Posted - 2014.04.15 19:09:00 -
[12] - Quote
Duran Lex wrote:Agrios Endendros wrote:P14GU3 wrote:Not sure if it works the same for CCP, but when most companies say they take a "loss," its not that they really lost any money.
See companies project to make so much money for the year, say 50 million USD. If they only earn 40m that year, they "lost" 10m.
Oil companies purposely project high every year, so instead of showing that they make Billions every year, they can say they lost a few million... Mainly "in the red" means not profitable and is a bad thing. If there are in the red it means they spent more money than they made. Not always the case. It depends how the information is being presented. He's right on this isn't a big deal, for oil companies do it. They "lose" revenue which is shown "in red" because there are people like you in the world that see this and think "they didn't do so good this year", which usually isn't the case at all.
I'm pretty sure nobody in the financial world sees this as "doing good". There is a difference between showing lost revenue in red and the company being in the red. Don't get me wrong, I like CCP, that's why I'm concerned. CCP has been around a while and Eve is very successful I'm confident they can recover but $21 milloion is nothing to sneeze at based on their companies value.
Agrios Endendros Heavy
Haruko Endendros AV Com & Logi ~ Canti Endendros Pilot ~ Zero Endendros Scout
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General John Ripper
20057
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Posted - 2014.04.15 19:15:00 -
[13] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:Agrios Endendros wrote:Quote:CCP Has recorded a loss of over $21 million for financial year 2013, a considerable drop from a profit of $4.6 million the previous year. Revenues for the company rose to $76.7 million from $56.3 million.
The predominant, if not only, factor in the sudden profit dip is a massively increased R&D budget, which shot up from $16.5 million in FY 2012 to $56.5 million in FY 2013. Whilst some of those costs are likely to relate to the development of Eve Universe properties Valkyrie, Online and Dust, a significant portion is thought to be attributable to the cancellation of World of Darkness, the Vampire MMO which ceased development earlier this week, resulting in the loss of 56 jobs.
A note in CCP's full financial presentation seems to support the theory that a large factor in this $40 million increase in R&D costs was the removal of asset value previously attributed to World of Darkness. via GameIndustry.bizuh-oh. Hope this doesn't hurt too much. Massive increases in R&D usually means long term profits. Example: Blackbarry = Low R&D expenditures. Apple = High R&D expenditures. Blackberry was very successful in the short term, but look at them now. Just like paying ringers in your pc... only wanna buy and pay for thebest.
Everytime I get a like, another bug is fixed.
20k bugs fixed. :)
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Nirwanda Vaughns
426th Infantry
539
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Posted - 2014.04.15 19:19:00 -
[14] - Quote
time ot bring back BPOs for us to throw money at. pretty obvious people arn't buying the regular aur suits
Rolling with the punches
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Nothing Certain
Bioshock Rejects
485
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Posted - 2014.04.15 19:21:00 -
[15] - Quote
P14GU3 wrote:Not sure if it works the same for CCP, but when most companies say they take a "loss," its not that they really lost any money.
See companies project to make so much money for the year, say 50 million USD. If they only earn 40m that year, they "lost" 10m.
Oil companies purposely project high every year, so instead of showing that they make Billions every year, they can say they lost a few million...
No, you may be thinking of government budgets but when businesses report port a loss, it is a loss.
Because, that's why.
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2Berries
Ghosts of Dawn General Tso's Alliance
105
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Posted - 2014.04.15 19:25:00 -
[16] - Quote
Let us all bow our heads & pray increase in R&D = PS4...amen, shalom, whatevs.
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Agrios Endendros
Single Serving Friends
170
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Posted - 2014.04.15 19:31:00 -
[17] - Quote
Canari Elphus wrote:Not quite sure I understand how a decrease in asset valuation would lead to an increase in R&D costs?
I'm no expert but I think it's refering to before WoD was cancelled it had an asset value, as in for instance if a company wanted to buy a game in development, they would have to decide on what that unfinished game might be worth. Well that value helped to offset R&D costs on the game. Once that asset value was gone then all that R&D was no longer investment but now loss. I could be wrong on that if anyone has more/better input?
Agrios Endendros Heavy
Haruko Endendros AV Com & Logi ~ Canti Endendros Pilot ~ Zero Endendros Scout
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Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
8019
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Posted - 2014.04.15 19:44:00 -
[18] - Quote
For the record, in 2013 CCP spent 56.5 million USD on research and development. For reference, in 2012 CCP only spent 16.5 million USD on research and development. It's not like they are going to toss down 56.5 million USD every single year. It is a long term investment. So just because you see them in the red now doesn't mean they are in a bad position, they're just betting that all this R&D will pay out big in the future.
Amarr are the good guys.
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Luk Manag
of Terror TRE GAFFEL
412
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Posted - 2014.04.15 19:50:00 -
[19] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:For the record, in 2013 CCP spent 56.5 million USD on research and development. For reference, in 2012 CCP only spent 16.5 million USD on research and development. It's not like they are going to toss down 56.5 million USD every single year. It is a long term investment. So just because you see them in the red now doesn't mean they are in a bad position, they're just betting that all this R&D will pay out big in the future.
I would bet that they are throwing money at Eve Valkyrie to capitalize on the industry buzz.
There will be bullets. ACR+SMG [CEO of Terror]
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COVERT SUBTERFUGE
PSU GHOST SYNDICATE DARKSTAR ARMY
904
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Posted - 2014.04.15 19:59:00 -
[20] - Quote
Luk Manag wrote:Aero Yassavi wrote:For the record, in 2013 CCP spent 56.5 million USD on research and development. For reference, in 2012 CCP only spent 16.5 million USD on research and development. It's not like they are going to toss down 56.5 million USD every single year. It is a long term investment. So just because you see them in the red now doesn't mean they are in a bad position, they're just betting that all this R&D will pay out big in the future. I would bet that they are throwing money at Eve Valkyrie to capitalize on the industry buzz.
CCP was a day 1 investor of Oculus Rift and was among the first to get the first kits. They said that they believed in the tech and wanted to make a game that really showcased its potential. I dare say this is an important initiative for CCP and warrants decent investment. Many lauded Valkyrie as the most impressive implementation of VR to date. CCP pioneering as usual.
Proud Minmatar scout - Republic Merc 7/10
Immune to bitter/jaded vet syndrome
Alt of THE GREY CARDINAL - eWar Merc
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Zahle Undt
Bullet Cluster Lokun Listamenn
1361
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Posted - 2014.04.15 20:00:00 -
[21] - Quote
They spent R&D money for pretty flowing clothing for a game they just cancelled and for Eve pilots to walk around in stations which apparently most Eve players either don't give a **** about or actively hate. Additional money spent on development for VR platforms that will either be the next big leap in gaming or (more likely in my opinion) be short lived fads like motion gaming or the power glove.
If their investments payoff for them, good for them, if not they'll be bought out by some massive publisher perhaps, hopefully one of the ones I can stomach and not EA or Activision.
Most tankers are like sand people. They frighten easily, but will quickly return...and in greater numbers.
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12339
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Posted - 2014.04.15 20:31:00 -
[22] - Quote
Zahle Undt wrote:They spent R&D money for pretty flowing clothing for a game they just cancelled and for Eve pilots to walk around in stations which apparently most Eve players either don't give a **** about or actively hate. Additional money spent on development for VR platforms that will either be the next big leap in gaming or (more likely in my opinion) be short lived fads like motion gaming or the power glove.
If their investments payoff for them, good for them, if not they'll be bought out by some massive publisher perhaps, hopefully one of the ones I can stomach and not EA or Activision.
EVE pilots walking about in stations was not 2013 stuff. So immediately I get the impression that your post is uninformed and quite probably stupid.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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Lorhak Gannarsein
Science For Death
2702
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Posted - 2014.04.15 20:43:00 -
[23] - Quote
There was a post about this when the report was released.
You're a month or two late, OP.
ak.0 4 LYFE
I am the Lorhak. I speak for the trees.
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Xocoyol Zaraoul
Superior Genetics
1928
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Posted - 2014.04.15 20:46:00 -
[24] - Quote
Zahle wrote: Undt Eve pilots to walk around in stations which apparently most Eve players either don't give a **** about or actively hate
Wat...
"You see those red dots over there?
Go and shoot them until you see a +50 on the screen" - Arkena Wyrnspire
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Dimmu Borgir II
The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR.
338
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Posted - 2014.04.15 21:06:00 -
[25] - Quote
Joel II X wrote:RayRay James wrote:Nothing really to worry about, companies run in the red all the time. The death of WoD will be a write off on next years income statements and, voila, back in the green Black. It's back in black (pun intended).
\m/
Blue is good, red is bad, orange you glad you're not red?
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bear90211
Nyain San Dirt Nap Squad.
196
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Posted - 2014.04.15 21:33:00 -
[26] - Quote
sooo... dose that mean I can own CCP for 120M $? if so, i might just own it sometime next year
My sig is suuper old.. now i rip faces with my HMG. looking for logies yo.btw #tacos
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Canari Elphus
Dirt Nap Squad.
1433
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Posted - 2014.04.15 23:31:00 -
[27] - Quote
Agrios Endendros wrote:Canari Elphus wrote:Not quite sure I understand how a decrease in asset valuation would lead to an increase in R&D costs?
I'm no expert but I think it's refering to before WoD was cancelled it had an asset value, as in for instance if a company wanted to buy a game in development, they would have to decide on what that unfinished game might be worth. Well that value helped to offset R&D costs on the game. Once that asset value was gone then all that R&D was no longer investment but now loss. I could be wrong on that if anyone has more/better input?
I was posing the question from an accounting standpoint.
I think the author of that article is mixing up terminology and painting a strange picture.
Basically, he thinks that a large chunk of the R&D budget went into WoD and, that failing, also reduced the overall asset valuation of the company.
CCP spent a good chunk of change trying to get WoD off the ground and, because it never saw the light of day, they have no additional revenues to offset the cost. Still, its a little scary to think that a company increased its R&D costs to more than its income from the previous year. My only guess is that, if most of that was for WoD, they were hoping to launch it pretty quickly to justify the massive increase.
@bear90211 - No, that isnt taking into account all assets of the company. That would include physical and intellectual which I am sure are valued at well over 120 million.
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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The Robot Devil
Brave Bunnies Brave Collective
2338
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Posted - 2014.04.15 23:43:00 -
[28] - Quote
Every time they rebalanced this game it is a loss. They lost money in time spent and in money of future profits from the code they had to throw out. Unless you are CCP you don't know how they money was lost, spent or what the defining factors are. It is not worth speculating about unless you are a member of their company and on the board.
"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production."
Raoul Duke
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Canari Elphus
Dirt Nap Squad.
1433
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Posted - 2014.04.15 23:48:00 -
[29] - Quote
The Robot Devil wrote:Every time they rebalanced this game it is a loss. They lost money in time spent and in money of future profits from the code they had to throw out. Unless you are CCP you don't know how they money was lost, spent or what the defining factors are. It is not worth speculating about unless you are a member of their company and on the board.
Its the interwebz, what would we do if we didnt have the ability to speculate without basis?
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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pseudosnipre
667
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Posted - 2014.04.15 23:49:00 -
[30] - Quote
Amazon is spending millions on drone R&D under the banner of faster delivery within large metro areas. Most assume Amazon is hoping to make big bucks on this...
Same with VR pioneering. The intellectual property is worth many factors more than anticipated future revenues...hoping that a responsible adult is around who can explain this to you.
Today is the sort of day where the sun only comes up to humiliate you.
BitterVet the turkey says GOML GOML GOML
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