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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
7842
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Posted - 2014.04.08 03:44:00 -
[1] - Quote
Selinate deux wrote:Shion Typhon wrote:The "economy" in Dust is already so completely busted only a full reset can fix it, so why not, let the chortles commence. What economy? All of the prices are already fixed. It's more like counter strike at this point, and the whole selling point of this game is a joke because of it. If you allow this to happen, then everyone who plays Eve is going to funnel isk to their Dust character. When that happens, since there are amounts of isk owned by players in Eve that make Dust players look poor in comparison, then they'll just buy proto suits and never worry about going negative in a match. Then let the free market come in where all of our stuff is produced and bought by players. Then let the prices of protos jump out of everyone's range so quickly because of Eve players donating isk to their players that no one else can ever afford it if they don't play Eve. A solution would be to remove tiers altogether and just have specialties and variants. I honestly think that's the only solution to this. Tiers are already breaking Dust game play and making it boring for newer players. Might as well remove them altogether and make it about how good the player is and not how old their Eve toon is.
This is something only CCP's in-house economist can decide on. He is the only one who knows when and how we should approach this, not the community.
Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer
Everything I know about the Caldari I learned at Nouvelle Rouvenor
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
7843
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Posted - 2014.04.08 04:14:00 -
[2] - Quote
Selinate deux wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:Selinate deux wrote:Shion Typhon wrote:The "economy" in Dust is already so completely busted only a full reset can fix it, so why not, let the chortles commence. What economy? All of the prices are already fixed. It's more like counter strike at this point, and the whole selling point of this game is a joke because of it. If you allow this to happen, then everyone who plays Eve is going to funnel isk to their Dust character. When that happens, since there are amounts of isk owned by players in Eve that make Dust players look poor in comparison, then they'll just buy proto suits and never worry about going negative in a match. Then let the free market come in where all of our stuff is produced and bought by players. Then let the prices of protos jump out of everyone's range so quickly because of Eve players donating isk to their players that no one else can ever afford it if they don't play Eve. A solution would be to remove tiers altogether and just have specialties and variants. I honestly think that's the only solution to this. Tiers are already breaking Dust game play and making it boring for newer players. Might as well remove them altogether and make it about how good the player is and not how old their Eve toon is. This is something only CCP's in-house economist can decide on. He is the only one who knows when and how we should approach this, not the community. Congratulations for figuring out that CCP is able to make changes to basic mechanics of the game and not us. I'm sure that was difficult.
CaptainPichardFacePalm.jpg
Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer
Everything I know about the Caldari I learned at Nouvelle Rouvenor
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
7846
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Posted - 2014.04.08 04:39:00 -
[3] - Quote
Spartacus Dust wrote:Well DELT I know you're anti one universe//one war, you want dust to be it's own game and have nothing to do with EVE and want to turn DUST into COD, but let's be realistic.
EVE and DUST both exist in New Eden, they should share similar things, like a market, and the ability for me to pay not only my own mercs but other mercs to do things for me :)
I'm a free market guy, and those of you who study the free market know that it eventually balances itself out. they need to open the market and let the isk flow, there's no reason why I shouldn't be paying mercs for their services with EVE isk.
I want a free market as well between Eve and Dust. Hell, that's part of CCP's 5-year plan as they announced back in Fanfest 2013. But being realistic here we know that this will take time. And the reason here has less to do with Eve hurting Dust and more to do with Dust hurting Eve if the Dust economy is implemented incorrectly. Keep in mind that Eve's economy is a huge beast that is delicate at the same time. Speculation, regional monopolies, economic interdictions, scamming, null-sec/low-sec warfare, mining, invention, production, freight deliveries, etc. all factor into the secondary market in both major and subtle ways in Eve.
The point here is that Dust's economy needs to be done correctly and in phases. First phase should obviously let us do simple trade-window transactions between two players for those of us who like to sell our excess BPOs and unwanted officer gear. This phase should also deal with the issues present in Planetary Conquest. The next phase should bring in the early stages of resource gathering with maybe an implementation of Eve-Dust ISK transfers with Eve players handling the production side of things. The final phase should see the full implementation of the market window allowing Dust players to establish system-wide and region-wide markets with the ability to pay someone else to move it for them.
But again, this is something best left to CCP's in-house economist who obviously has 10 years active experience with Eve Online monstrous economy.
Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer
Everything I know about the Caldari I learned at Nouvelle Rouvenor
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
7850
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Posted - 2014.04.08 16:41:00 -
[4] - Quote
Joseph Ridgeson wrote:Shion Typhon wrote:The "economy" in Dust is already so completely busted only a full reset can fix it, so why not, let the chortles commence. DUST has no economy. It has as much economy as single player Diablo does. If you gave everyone a billion isk in DUST, almost nothing would change. You would have people using their most expensive fits but it isn't that huge of a deal because people already do that anyway. Give everyone in EVE a billion isk and the game would pretty much collapse. When the learning skills were removed from EVE and the SP given back as a bonus, they were trying to determine if they could refund the ISK value of all the used Skill Books in EVE. They asked their economist and, quote, "he fell out of his chair. After he sat up he asked 'please, no'." Yet the did it in DUST with no problem because the game has no economy.
I can confirm that the lead economist did fall out of his chair upon hearing CCP's suggestion. Lol
Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer
Everything I know about the Caldari I learned at Nouvelle Rouvenor
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
8138
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Posted - 2014.04.28 06:41:00 -
[5] - Quote
Source: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2094808#post2094808
Maken Tosch wrote:It depends on how CCP handles it. From an economic point of view, the logical first step to establishing a stable secondary market in Dust is to FIRST AND FOREMOST fix PC. PC in it's current state despite some changes it recently had, is still a bit of an ISK faucet. There is also the infamous ALT-recycling exploit that needs to be addressed. If they address that first, then we can proceed to the next step.
The second logical step is to establish a series of ISK sinks. Eve Online has a lot of ISK but in small bits that are subtle but add up quickly. Broker Fees are imposed at a flat rate (adjustable via skill books) on any buy/sell orders you establish. Taxes are imposed on any sales you make (also adjustable via skill books) as a percentage of the value of the sale. There are also fees imposed on modifying current buy/sell orders on the market that are your own. There are export taxes imposed whenever you transfer planetary materials from the planet to the customs office in orbit. As you can see, fees, taxes, and tariffs are literally everywhere in New Eden. Even the use of NPC facilities such as repair services and manufacturing/research/invention slots will force you to pay a fee of some form. This is a great way to keep ISK flow under control.
The third and final step is to introduce material requirements for the operation and maintenance of planetary districts. Those outposts won't fuel themselves and thus can force even the most powerful corps to invest heavily in buying or harvesting materials needed to fuel those districts.
If done right, this will bleed off the excess ISK without needing to do any ISK/Asset wipes and can keep the ISK flow under control.
Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer
Everything I know about the Caldari I learned at Nouvelle Rouvenor
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