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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12119
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Posted - 2014.04.08 06:35:00 -
[1] - Quote
PC is presently a blue donut - all the 'elite' corps have allied with each other and it's difficult to get into now. Chances are if you're in a corp outside of PC right now, you're not going to be able to get in for some time.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12126
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Posted - 2014.04.08 16:50:00 -
[2] - Quote
Sebastian Days wrote:Arkena says it's difficult because of an elite corp alliance. Arkena, I've seen the doughnut you're talking about. Why would it be so difficult to get into? How can there be no competition over so many districts? What makes these corps so elite that there isn't constant attacking on every district on every open moment? Isn't there enough players, isk, and competetive spirit?
It's so difficult to get into because for any other corp it requires a large up front investment followed by multiple subsequent ones if you hope to take a district. For non-PC groups, it's quite a lot of ISK for a clone pack. Then, a clone pack gives you a sub-par amount of clones. Taking a district with a single clone pack is rarely done, and it's unheard of to manage it against the high tier corps - those people in the 'donut'.
There's no competition over the districts because it takes significant investment that is unlikely to pay off to take these people on. There's no constant attacking because that would require a truly gigantic sum of ISK. You're talking billions of ISK to attack all these districts with clone packs. Those few still in PC can't attack back because their own districts are overwhelmed by hostile clone attacks or are locked up.
Once you actually do get an attack on these corps, you need to realise that these are some of the best players in the game with a lot of experience at PC. When you attack these corps, you're not necessarily attacking that corp. They will happily bring in 'ringers' from their alliance to fill in spaces or indeed field entire teams of ringers should it be deemed necessary. They have a huge talent pool to pick from and vast amounts of funding. Groups hoping to get into PC generally have a fairly limited talent pool and don't have nearly as much ISK.
Taking districts from the donut is simply not feasible unless you muster vast groups of people, and even then a lot of those teams are likely to be beaten handily. Recently there was a coalition attack on Nyain San's districts. That cost several billion ISK (IIRC) and resulted in zero districts taken.
Your best hope to get in, on a personal level, is to excel and know people.
Here are what I would set as a rough set of guidelines for anyone looking to get into PC:
- The ability to fit a fully prototype suit or fully complex tank. Complex modules, solid core skills. Maxed cores are not essential but are desirable.
- A working microphone and preferably a headset. The ability to listen to communications in PC is essential
- High competence in your chosen role. Pure slayers need the ability to go positive at the highest levels of play. Logistics need to coat the ground in uplinks - proto uplinks are an absolute necessity for logis, and highly desirable for assaults.
- Contacts
EDIT: Unfortunately, the loadouts you posted won't cut it. I'm mindful of the fact that those were AV fits, thrown together to counter what you see as the current dynamic, but at a guess your vehicle roles aren't filled out much at all so you'll need a solid infantry loadout.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12127
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Posted - 2014.04.08 17:35:00 -
[3] - Quote
Sebastian Days wrote:
I see how it's expensive to take districts using clone packs, but what if each player of a 16 player team pitched in 15 million ISK in suits and clones? That's about what I think is worth for me to cut in a single district. Of course, I'd be expecting a cut in the district's profits.
That would easily end up covering the cost of a clone pack, but what you end up with then is corp burnout. What if you fail to take a district? After your entire team (likely your A-team) spends that much several times (because it will take several attempts to take a district) they'll burn out and become demoralised. It's unlikely that you'll hold the district in a stable enough condition to make ISK from it - if you take a district from the donut, it'll become completely locked up with attacks. You won't be able to generate ISK from the district, you won't be able to launch attacks from it, and you'll be forced to spend more on clone packs to attempt to get enough districts to prevent all yours from being locked up. That is not a doable prospect.
Quote:
Your reference to the recent coalition attack on Nyain San's districts warrants further inspection and analysis. I wonder how many districts, and how Nyain San managed to keep them all.
It was about a dozen districts, I believe. I'm not sure about the exact number.
Nyain's alliance assisted in fielding teams to defend the districts. Despite having so many stacked timers, they managed to field teams for all of them. Given the large talent pool in DNS, these teams were quite easily able to beat off the weaker teams.
It's unlikely that you'll be able to find nearly enough people to stack that many timers, let alone enough people talented and experienced enough to beat those teams.
Quote:What about my load-outs do you have questions of?
All of them. I would like to see your exact loadouts.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12130
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Posted - 2014.04.08 18:13:00 -
[4] - Quote
lee corwood wrote:Arkena has much more guidance to give you than I can, but I will put input here for your base suit. You should remain in your Amarr Logi suit for the entire match for two reasons.
-snip good advice-
This man also has good advice. Listen to him.
Don't worry about branching out. That's only a concern when you're at 20-30M+ SP with maxed cores and you've maxed your first role.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12134
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Posted - 2014.04.08 19:11:00 -
[5] - Quote
Alright, thank you.
At a glance, there are a couple of things you need to do. Firstly, get complex shield extenders ASAP. They are worth their weight in gold.
Secondly, I recommend not relying on LP equipment. You're going to lose a lot of this gear and that can be difficult to replace.
Thirdly, you're trying to be something you're not in a couple of those fits. Permascans are not your job - leave that to the scouts and Gallogis. What is absolutely your job is to cover the ground in uplinks. You want plenty of uplinks. Spam them everywhere. You're an Amarr logi, this is your job and you can do it very, very well if necessary. It's also highly desirable - Amarr logis are in demand if they can spam uplinks well.
Don't bother with nanite injectors. They're not needed in PC. If you have good uplinks, it's far preferable to spawn on a nearby uplink. It'll get you back into the fight more quickly and with more HP in potentially a more favourable position.
Complex armour plates are rarely worth it. Go with enhanced plates instead.
Cut your fitting number down a bit. Realistically, you're not going to be running half a dozen different loadouts in a match and you don't have time to deliberate over which one to use.
You may want to consider putting a single complex repairer on your fits. You should have plenty enough HP with three enhanced plates, three complex extenders, and a complex repairer and having a local armour rep prevents you from being a write-off after the first engagement. Logi support is not a guarantee - your teammates may appreciate the top-up if you're carrying a rep tool, but it's often more useful to have an uplink ready for them unless you're able to support a heavy with a core focused rep or better to have triage hives.
Good that you have a decent number of flux grenades.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12135
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Posted - 2014.04.08 20:09:00 -
[6] - Quote
If you only have basic armour repairers, don't bother. Just plate it instead.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12135
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Posted - 2014.04.08 20:19:00 -
[7] - Quote
Sebastian Days wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:If you only have basic armour repairers, don't bother. Just plate it instead. What about advanced armor repair?
It only really becomes worth it over a plate (and then, only once) at complex.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12137
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Posted - 2014.04.08 20:39:00 -
[8] - Quote
Sebastian Days wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Sebastian Days wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:If you only have basic armour repairers, don't bother. Just plate it instead. What about advanced armor repair? It only really becomes worth it over a plate (and then, only once) at complex. I have enough skill points to skill in armor repair 3 so I can use the LP complex armor repair and still have 595k SP left over for whatever else. I'm 132k SP short of going 5 armor repair though.
Then go for the complex shield extenders instead.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
12138
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Posted - 2014.04.08 21:02:00 -
[9] - Quote
Actually - I would recommend an ACR fit (perhaps a Six Kin ACR) for the particularly laggy matches.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
EUrobro
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