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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1501
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Posted - 2014.04.04 22:17:00 -
[1] - Quote
Blasters Blasters, as I see them, are meant to be anti-infantry (AI). To do this, they must sacrifice AV capabilities. Currently, blasters can deal too much damage to vehicles, even while they are hardened. A blaster tank should not be able to slaughter infantry, then kill a tank that threatens it, and go back to slaughtering infantry. It just negates the purpose of having the turret be AI. Also, I hear that infantry are unhappy at how powerful the turret is against them as well. I don't see what the problem really is, but let's continue.
I propose that large blasters see a damage reduction of about 33%. This is to counter the hardener nerf as well as reducing their effectiveness against infantry which so many seem to have a problem with.
Before the hardener nerf, I thought that large blasters were very balanced. No blaster tank really threatened my missile Gunnlogi, as my shield could regen through a good portion of the incoming DPS and allow me to sit and absorb damage while reloading and launching a second volley, even a third one before my shield got too low. I found this to be balanced because they were much better at AI than I was, so in exchange for that I was much better at AV than they were.
Now, I scramble to get my second volley out before my shield drops to destroy a blaster tank. These are just my experiences, but I'm using them to help paint the picture of the tank vs tank balance.
Railguns Railguns are meant to be the sniper rifles for vehicles. High alpha, low DPS, and only good at range. However, this is not so in the current build. Railguns have both high alpha and high DPS while remaining good at any range.
For railguns, I have three suggestions. Only one of the last two suggestions should be chosen.
The first is something that could be applied with the following suggestion, or it may be unnecessary. This suggestion is to have railguns immobilize the tank while they are spooling up, maintaining a charge, and spooling down, like the breach forge gun. Immobilizing it while firing will make it disadvantaged in CQC where it allows the CQC tank to outmaneuver the rail tank.
The second suggestion is to revert railguns to either the compressed or the regular variant from 1.6. I just think that the railgun is too good at everything, so reducing damage, reducing RoF, and increasing the heat cost is the best alternative. Essentially, you get a pre-1.7 railgun. The regular variant has about the same RoF, but significantly less damage, while maintaining a similar, yet slightly higher, heat cost than the 1.7/1.8 railgun. The compressed variant has a much smaller RoF, much greater heat cost, while having only slightly less damage than the 1.7/1.8 railgun.
The third suggestion is to give railguns a range profile similar to the laser rifle. They should only deal 100% damage at say, between 200 and 350m. Damage should then drop to 50% at 100m and 450m, then down to 30% at 50m and 500m. This allows them to have their range back at the price of damage falloff. It also allows them to keep all of their attributes without nerfing any of them, that way they can still do their job at range while making them ineffective at CQC and extreme ranges. I personally prefer this suggestion over the second one, as it doesn't reduce ranged effectiveness
As for lore, it can be said that the charged plasma in the canister shell requires a fraction of a second to reach its highest energy state, after which it begins to decay rapidly. This will then produce said range profile.
Missiles Missiles are practically my child in Dust and I find them to be perfectly balanced. I'd hate to see any nerfs happen to them, but I'll do my best to keep any bias aside for their review. I've only used prototype missiles, so I have no idea how they perform at the standard and advanced levels.
The XT-201 Missile Launcher can destroy any armor tank or unhardened shield without a damage mod when aimed at the rear of the vehicle. I think that missiles are intended for flanking and ambushing tactics. As such, a missile turret should be able to destroy a vehicle from the rear using only one volley without the help of any damage amplifier. I'm not sure if standard or advanced missiles can do this, and if not, then I believe that only prototype missiles should be able to do this.
As for shooting at vehicles from the side or from the front, the line gets blurred. Some get destroyed in one volley, some do not. A damage amplifier will ensure destruction in one volley against any armor vehicle, however. Again, I'm not sure if it's just the prototype missiles that are allowing me to do any of this.
My conclusion for missiles is that I have no conclusion. They will have to just get play tested with the changes done to blaster turrets and railguns to see if missiles are too powerful. If they are, then I think that only a small damage reduction is necessary, while increasing the damage bonus done to the rear of the vehicle by missiles. This way, the ambush style of play that missiles are best at isn't affected.
Conclusion With these changes, a balance is achievable. Blaster tanks remain to be the most effective at AI while sacrificing most of their AV capabilities. Railguns remain good at range while becoming ineffective at CQC and at extreme range. Missiles remain best at ambush tactics. Both railguns and missiles have 'equal' AV capabilities as well as AI abilities within their optimal ranges.
A missile tank will beat any tank that it ambushes. A rail tank will beat any tank it catches in the open at range. A blaster tank will only be able to beat a rail tank in CQC. This is my opinion of perfect large turret balance. A three-tank group will preferably have one of each tank: a rail tank to provide overwatch and ranged AV, a missile tank to provide CQC AV, and a blaster tank to provide AI.
TL;DR Sorry, no TL;DR
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1501
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Posted - 2014.04.04 23:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
CLONE117 wrote:u must god awful hate losing your tank to blaster turrets. I just hate anything that's good at everything. Blaster turret wants to be good at AI? Then it should be the worst for AV. Simple as that. Trade-offs.
WarMachine88 wrote:Blasters are fine, u reduce damage then loses its ability to fight other tanks. SO this guy wants a blaster tank to have no defense against any other tank. Missiles need a damage nerf no turret should instantly kill a tank and Rails need a reduce RoF. And on top of this Rails need to switch to Lvl 5 and Missles to Lvl 3. So, you want a tank that's not only best at killing infantry, but can also handle itself against other tanks? Dude, it's all about trade-offs. Blaster tank gains advantage at killing infantry, it should then lose any advantages against other tanks. Also, did I not mention that a blaster tank should be able to defeat a rail tank in CQC?
I think you're also forgetting that missiles must reload right after killing a tank, in addition to having the longest reload time of the turrets. It's just the same as the scrambler rifle: massive DPS against one person, low DPS against multiple targets. Plus, actually using your intelligence to ambush should be rewarded instead of bum-rushing with a railgun.
Missiles should stay at level 5; apparently they require too much intelligence for people to use properly and the skill levels will accurately reflect the required intelligence level
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1529
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Posted - 2014.04.07 01:42:00 -
[3] - Quote
Bump
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
Atiim didn't agree with limiting tanks!
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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1532
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Posted - 2014.04.07 05:42:00 -
[4] - Quote
Vulpes Dolosus wrote:My opinions:
Blasters:
I agree blasters should be geared more toward AI than AV, but I wouldn't make them totally defenseless. I don't think a MLT Sica with a hardener should be completely immune to an Ion Cannon. Also, blasters are too good at AI at ranges >75m; I'd like a harsher drop off for those ranges and more dispersion. Blasters are meant to be the most CQB of all the weapon types. I could see auto-cannons being the lower damage, longer range AI alternative with faster tracking, more ammo, or other things to make it stand apart from the blaster, but we'll see.
Rails:
There are a few things I think need to be changed to fix rails: damage mods need to be 15-20% and base damage should be reduced as well, fitting costs need to be up up upped on them, and the redline needs removed and replaced before I'd be willing to accept longer rail range. I'm not sure how I feel about the immobilization idea, but I think if my ideas were implemented, it wouldn't be necessary.
Missiles:
The only problem with missiles is shield tanks. Unless you're packing XTs, a damage mod or two, and are right up on it, a shield rail tank with a hardener will eat you for breakfast. I really think there should be a EM variant (damage profile +20 shield/ -20% armor), considering you spending literally 60x more SP for a one trick-pony that a rail can either match or honestly out preform. Adding a shotgun-style reload (loading one missile at a time while being able to interrupt the loading by firing) would be nice as well. I agree with all of your points. I think that a range profile similar to that of the laser rifle will emphasize the ranged aspect of the railgun and reduce its CQC effectiveness. Also, immobilization would be unecessary and missile tanks will stand a chance of winning against hardened railgun shield tanks. I'm still all for ammo types that we can load in and out between engagements.
As for their range and redline issue, my numbers on damage fall off were just examples. Damage drop off could happen faster beyond a shorter range than was given in the example, that way even if you could still sit in the redline, your damage wouldn't be lethal but merely a weak suppressant (a few shots won't do much but you wouldn't just sit there and let them pound a full clip into you)
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
Atiim didn't agree with limiting tanks!
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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1537
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Posted - 2014.04.07 21:15:00 -
[5] - Quote
Alena Ventrallis wrote:Large blasters should be reworked into an AV weapon. Slower ROF, higher damage, dispersion to make hitting infantry difficult.
First though, we need more vehicles to shoot at. there really isn't a threat beyond blaster tanks for vehicles to kill. The nature of the blaster turret will always make it the easiest turret to use for AI. You might think that changing its attributes to make it "harder" to use against infantry (lower RoF but higher damage) will only make it unbalanced, as it'll still wreck infantry the easiest while being a threat to other vehicles.
You just can't be most effective against AI while retaining AV potential. So that's why blasters should instead be reworked for AI, by reducing their damage by a fair amount. Now it'll be rather ineffective at AV while its nature still makes it the best turret against infantry.
Then we can get a more refined picture of: AI (blaster) tank > infantry > AV infantry > AV tank > AI tank.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
Atiim didn't agree with limiting tanks!
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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1537
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Posted - 2014.04.08 03:29:00 -
[6] - Quote
Godin Thekiller wrote:Harpyja wrote:Alena Ventrallis wrote:Large blasters should be reworked into an AV weapon. Slower ROF, higher damage, dispersion to make hitting infantry difficult.
First though, we need more vehicles to shoot at. there really isn't a threat beyond blaster tanks for vehicles to kill. The nature of the blaster turret will always make it the easiest turret to use for AI. You might think that changing its attributes to make it "harder" to use against infantry (lower RoF but higher damage) will only make it unbalanced, as it'll still wreck infantry the easiest while being a threat to other vehicles. You just can't be most effective against AI while retaining AV potential. So that's why blasters should instead be reworked for AI, by reducing their damage by a fair amount. Now it'll be rather ineffective at AV while its nature still makes it the best turret against infantry. Then we can get a more refined picture of: AI (blaster) tank > infantry > AV infantry > AV tank > AI tank. Actually, a lower ROF will make consecutive harder (because you know, if the person is not a idiot, he/she can strafe through your shots, just like now, but even better). And if that's enough, a tracking nerf can help. EDIT: You think missiles are balanced. Your opinion of blasters are invalid. Your opinion is invalid because you want blasters to be the be-all end-all large turret like it was in 1.6. Missiles are very much balanced.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
Atiim didn't agree with limiting tanks!
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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1541
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Posted - 2014.04.08 13:37:00 -
[7] - Quote
Azri Sarum wrote:I have to disagree with the notion of the large blaster being worked into a more anti-infantry role. Thats what the small turrets on your tank are for.... The large blaster should have its anti-infantry capabilities nerfed into the ground.
You want anti-infantry capability, then fit the weapons already designed for that role. Read one of my above replies on the large blaster. It will always be the easiest to use against infantry, that's why it should have the worst AV abilities.
Also, it's the turret type that defines its role, not its size. Size only determines effectiveness and fitting ability. The SMG, combat rifle, and HMG are all projectile weapons. They are all bonused against armor, so they kill armor dropsuits more easily. What you're trying to say is like saying that the HMG should not be able to hit and kill light and medium suits and it should only be able to kill heavy dropsuits.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
Atiim didn't agree with limiting tanks!
|
Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1541
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 17:35:00 -
[8] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:Harpyja wrote: The third suggestion is to give railguns a range profile similar to the laser rifle. They should only deal 100% damage at say, between 200 and 350m. Damage should then drop to 50% at 100m and 450m, then down to 30% at 50m and 500m. This allows them to have their range back at the price of damage falloff. It also allows them to keep all of their attributes without nerfing any of them, that way they can still do their job at range while making them ineffective at CQC and extreme ranges. I personally prefer this suggestion over the second one, as it doesn't reduce ranged effectiveness
The Laser Turret is coming. Have patience. The railgun is just too good at CQC for being a ranged weapon. It needs damage falloff when it gets too close. You don't see rail and arty battleships in EVE engaging other ships at 10km. They engage at 100km+
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
Atiim didn't agree with limiting tanks!
|
Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1541
|
Posted - 2014.04.08 20:46:00 -
[9] - Quote
Tebu Gan wrote:Fox Gaden wrote:I like the 300m Rail Turret range. It is still sufficient to give an advantage over Blasters, but it gets the Rail Tanks out of the Red line. I have been having a lot of fun with mine, now that I am getting the hang of it. Trying to sneak up on and out maneuver enemy tanks is a lot more fun than sniping from the Red Line.
For the power, I agree. 300M is one of the few (only) tank changes I agree with, and even suggested that very thing not long ago. I always brawled with the railgun, brawling being anything within 300M. Addressing Harps, I still don't think damage falloff is a good way to go about it when the railgun is concerned. I'm all for a variety of different types of railguns, and the way you describe it makes me think of only the one type. We NEED variations like we had before, and I imagine that is what CCP has in mind for the future (I hope). I believe that addressing the main issue, range and power, is the way to go about it. High range, low power. As we begin lowering the range, we increase the power to reflect it's place on the battlefield. In this way a long range railgun could still try to CQC, but is actually hampered by the damage in comparison to a lower range railgun. I think this leaves a lot of possibility's open, whereas damage falloff limits our options for the future, not to mention it makes a lot less work on the coders adding a new dynamic to railguns and developers trying to balance around it. My only concern about dropping the power with an increase on range is that it will become less effective at it's intended role. For example, let's say we still had the 600m range railgun, but at proto level it only did 900 damage per shot to balance out its range. But now it can't kill anything because it has too little power balancing out its range, and bumping up its power will make it unbalanced.
The railgun needs that power at range to do its job. But it shouldn't have that power at just about any range. You can then have variants that lower the falloff rate in exchange for less damage per shot or increasing the falloff rate in exchange for greater damage per shot.
That's just how I view the railguns, where their purpose is at being an effective ranged weapon.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
Atiim didn't agree with limiting tanks!
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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1574
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Posted - 2014.04.12 15:25:00 -
[10] - Quote
*sigh*
There's absolutely no skill to tanking anymore if it comes down to who has more damage mods and a higher tier railgun and gets the first shot like in a twitch shooter.
I started Dust because it was not a twitch shooter and fittings, skills, and tactics mattered, way back in closed beta. I'm sad to see that this game is only becoming more of a twitch shooter.
It should not come down to having damage mods, a railgun, and shooting first to win.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1588
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:11:00 -
[11] - Quote
Bump of justice.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1615
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Posted - 2014.04.19 13:23:00 -
[12] - Quote
Bump
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1616
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Posted - 2014.04.19 20:56:00 -
[13] - Quote
Godin Thekiller wrote:Harpyja wrote:Azri Sarum wrote:I have to disagree with the notion of the large blaster being worked into a more anti-infantry role. Thats what the small turrets on your tank are for.... The large blaster should have its anti-infantry capabilities nerfed into the ground.
You want anti-infantry capability, then fit the weapons already designed for that role. Read one of my above replies on the large blaster. It will always be the easiest to use against infantry, that's why it should have the worst AV abilities. Also, it's the turret type that defines its role, not its size. Size only determines effectiveness and fitting ability. The SMG, combat rifle, and HMG are all projectile weapons. They are all bonused against armor, so they kill armor dropsuits more easily. What you're trying to say is like saying that the HMG should not be able to hit and kill light and medium suits and it should only be able to kill heavy dropsuits. What about the Autocannon, or the pulse lasers? They too should be more about AI than AV. For now, while we don't have them, the blaster will be the easiest to use for AI. Once we have autocannons and pulse lasers, they all should be more for AI than AV.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1625
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Posted - 2014.04.22 03:05:00 -
[14] - Quote
No one else has anything to comment on this?
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Harpyja
molon labe. General Tso's Alliance
1721
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Posted - 2014.05.12 00:25:00 -
[15] - Quote
Dalton Smithe wrote:Dunce Masterson wrote:in EVE online Bigger turrets destroy smaller ships really fast if they can hit them battle ships for example can and do one shot frigates.
has it is now the Rail turret has higher dps then the blaster turret so to balance large turrets a few things need to happen.
Rail turrets these do to much alpha damage for their rate of fire either the rate of fire needs to be decreased to 2.5-2.75 or the damage per shot(standard forge gun) Large rail turret proficiency needs to change from turret rotation speed to a small rate of fire increase 2-4% per leve.
Large blasters these don't do enough damage per shot and need a 20-25% increase to their damage also their accuracy is to good they need to be more the Assault blaster and get less accurate the longer it is fired. They can one shot frigates, yes, but what about drones? A battle ship with blasters will have a hell of a time knocking out a drone, think of infantry in the same aspect. I stand by the statement I made, tanks should not be used to counter infantry, they should strictly be anti vehicle. Blasters should do more damage per hit, but only to other vehicles. Small turrets are supposed to be the anti infantry weapon and its ignorant to think that any military would run around a battlefield gunning down infantry with a 40mm cannon....it's just not practical. I would love for CCP to implement ammunition cost to the game, then see how many people run around blasting away at infantry, especially when their amunition costs 100-200 isk per round....25-50k per reload anyone? Actually CCP -PLEASE- do that, implement ammunition cost into the game....that would counter quite a bit of tanks being the Swiss army knives they are now.... To reiterate, I am a tanker and I would fully support this. The reason why I put blaster turrets as AI turrets is simply due to the fact that they have the easiest time hitting and killing infantry of all the turrets (with a few exceptions, such as small missiles, but they require the high-ground to be effective, good luck getting any direct hits on level ground).
You just can't give all large turrets equal capabilities for AV because the blaster will be inherently better against infantry. Thus, the blaster should give up AV potential in exchange for it being inherently better at AI.
Giving role based on turret size is not the way to balance. I still strongly believe that turret type should define the role while turret size only affects the effectiveness and fitting ability.
You also just cannot compare EVE's automated turret tracking to Dust's player operated turret tracking. EVE takes out all of the skill that there is to aiming, so it only simulates aiming abilities with variables such as target size. I'd even make the argument that EVE's automated turrets are dumber than Dust's player operated turrets. In reality, if you have a battleship sized turret, you only have to shoot it once to instapop a frigate (in EVE). Trying to keep up with the target is not the way to aim; instead you should predict flight path, aim ahead of the target, and fire at the right time. A true computer system will do that, but then that wouldn't be fun (and there'd be no point to flying anything smaller than a battleship) if it only took a few volleys to pop a frigate even if it's orbiting you at 1000m/s at 2km.
So again, going about balancing by turret size is the wrong path. Infantry weapons are definitely not balanced by size. If they were, then HMGs would only be able to kill heavies, light weapons would only be able to kill medium frames, and sidearms -> light frames.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Harpyja
molon labe. General Tso's Alliance
1722
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Posted - 2014.05.12 13:06:00 -
[16] - Quote
Dalton Smithe wrote:Quote: The reason why I put blaster turrets as AI turrets is simply due to the fact that they have the easiest time hitting and killing infantry of all the turrets (with a few exceptions, such as small missiles, but they require the high-ground to be effective, good luck getting any direct hits on level ground).
You just can't give all large turrets equal capabilities for AV because the blaster will be inherently better against infantry. Thus, the blaster should give up AV potential in exchange for it being inherently better at AI.
Giving role based on turret size is not the way to balance. I still strongly believe that turret type should define the role while turret size only affects the effectiveness and fitting ability.
You also just cannot compare EVE's automated turret tracking to Dust's player operated turret tracking. EVE takes out all of the skill that there is to aiming, so it only simulates aiming abilities with variables such as target size. I'd even make the argument that EVE's automated turrets are dumber than Dust's player operated turrets. In reality, if you have a battleship sized turret, you only have to shoot it once to instapop a frigate (in EVE). Trying to keep up with the target is not the way to aim; instead you should predict flight path, aim ahead of the target, and fire at the right time. A true computer system will do that, but then that wouldn't be fun (and there'd be no point to flying anything smaller than a battleship) if it only took a few volleys to pop a frigate even if it's orbiting you at 1000m/s at 2km.
So again, going about balancing by turret size is the wrong path. Infantry weapons are definitely not balanced by size. If they were, then HMGs would only be able to kill heavies, light weapons would only be able to kill medium frames, and sidearms -> light frames.
That's your opinion, but I disagree. And I never said anything about giving all turrets equal capability, rails are long range, lower DPS. Blasters are short range, high DPS. Missiles fill the middle ground, but do more damage to armor than shields. I also talk about reducing the damage to infantry was a way to counter the "twitch" factor inherent in FPS games, just doing an overall nerf to something isn't going to fix anything, it never does. You can't just hit something with a hammer and expect it to work, sometimes you need a scalpel to cut out the piece that isn't working, adjust it, and put it back. As far as your remark about infantry weapons not being balanced, your wrong on the "HMG's would only kill heavies". They are built specifically for anti infantry rolls, and the forge gun is built to take out vehicles(although they also use it to kill infantry, but that's another thing) Reducing damage done to infantry by turrets just doesn't make sense. If anything, vehicles should get a damage reduction based on size, but that's already evident in the fact that they have more HP than infantry, so everything should and must receive the same damage value, regardless if it's infantry or a vehicle. You can't argue that an infantryman in real life will have some sort of resistance against a lot of weapons, can you? So making large turrets deal less to infantry makes no sense.
Second, the blaster will always be the most reliable of the current turrets to use against infantry. This means that you cannot give it a competitive DPS against other vehicles. Unless you make one shot deal like 10 damage to infantry, but then see my above statement. Tanks are meant to be inherently strong against infantry. You do not **** with the main cannon of an MBT in real life. It'd just be silly to make large turrets capable of destroying vehicles but only tickling infantry. And finally, what would be the point of having tanks in the first place if they don't have this natural strength against infantry? To kill ADS, that were never meant to be aerial gunships?
Sorry, I just don't feel you don't get the whole picture. Your opinion is that of an infantryman who only sees his side of the picture and thinks that any AI nerfs would balance the situation.
Also, I never said that infantry weapons were imbalanced. I was using an example to show how stupid it'd be to balance weapons on size, and not on type. Because yes, you got different types of weapons in each size class that have different roles (like the HMG vs forge gun, or the rifle vs swarm).
Bottom line: weapon types within size classes define roles, not the size classes.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Harpyja
molon labe. General Tso's Alliance
1722
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Posted - 2014.05.12 19:50:00 -
[17] - Quote
Dunce Masterson wrote:Dalton Smithe wrote:Dunce Masterson wrote:since the blaster turret is a single barrel weapon it should have kick and dispersion like the Assault blaster without any skills reducing it so short controlled burst would be necessary to engage infantry while blaster tanks can just spray on tanks.
having ammunition cost ISK is not something we want in the game unless we are paying for different types but not per shot.
Until the blaster has better DPS then the rail the rail is still OP. The rail is overpowered in certain situations, I'll agree to that, but it has to be that way(for now) to counter certain fits in the game. Everything in Eve costs money, the same should hold true in dust, we are in the same universe. The thing is, most people who play console shooters aren't used to having to buy things every time they want to run with it. More often than not I hear the argument that Dust isn't Eve, and they are right, but here is the thing, we all live on earth, and if you drive a car, you need to put gas in that car, regardless of where you live, you have to BUY gas. Someone in England is going to pay more per gallon than someone in United States(yes I know they buy per liter in England). They still have to pay for gas regardless of where they live. They should increase the rail gun range to pre nerf stats, lower the damage(decreasing it further for infantry) and rails would become the snipers they were supposed to be. Blasters should have their damage increased(while making it do significantly less against infantry) Either that or implement ammunition cost, whichever would be easier. Watch how it works(or doesn't) and go from there. Its a FPS no FPS charges you for ammo. no the rail turret range is fine where it is. what im suggesting for large blasters is for them to be inaccurate on small targets if the small targets get hit it should really hurt and have higher dps then rail turrets. I'm not of the opinion that spread, or even kick, on the blaster turret will make it harder to use against infantry. Sure, you might be unable to snipe infantry from a distance, but I've also missed a lot of infantry kills due to the precision of the blaster where dispersion would've made hitting them easier.
I think that the blaster can keep its AI capability if it has a clear downside, and I think such a downside would be making it the weakest AV turret, not by a margin, but by a good amount.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Harpyja
molon labe. General Tso's Alliance
1722
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Posted - 2014.05.12 20:04:00 -
[18] - Quote
Dalton Smithe wrote:When is the last time you heard about an Abrams rolling across the battlefield targeting the lowly rifleman?
You wouldn't see a Battleship using it's 16 inch guns on a patrol boat.
Bottom line: Size does dictate the role of a weapon as any war will teach you.
The problem is the players who have found a way to exploit something and use it to their advantage.
ADS were designed to be aerial gunships, the whole reason was to give the pilots a way to fight, and ground targets are the most prevalent in Dust, so they are gunships.
As for my opinion, it is that of a merc that has played as both infantry and tanker, so I do see the big picture. You seem to think that by nerfing the damage to infantry it will somehow break the game, it won't.
If they continue to keep tanks in their current state then they need to give infantry a way to destroy them(with some effort). They should improve AV, or even give them a better weapon, such as a single fire, high damage missile.
Either way, you have your opinion and I have mine and it appears that neither one of us is going to change the others mind, so lets just agree to disagree. Re-reading my post, I may have sounded a bit harsh, I apologize for that.
Your points are valid. Though, there's nothing stopping an Abrams from targetting infantrymen when there isn't anything bigger for it to do, such as engaging hostile armor.
Also, a battleship won't use its 16 inch guns on a patrol boat because it'd be too costly and labor intensive to fire and reload new rounds when there's a cheaper alternative that can get the job done as well.
What I was aiming at was that although it might be impractical, the job can still get done (though it'd be overkill and thus too costly if you figure in the costs associated with say, firing your main armament instead of using smaller arms that can still do the job).
And yes, you have your opinions and I got mine.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1827
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Posted - 2014.06.05 14:01:00 -
[19] - Quote
Bump from the dead
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Harpyja
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1827
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Posted - 2014.06.05 19:15:00 -
[20] - Quote
Godin Thekiller wrote:Still denied, as you haven't adjusted your OP. Adjusted for....
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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