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Toby Flenderson
research lab
435
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Posted - 2014.04.03 19:02:00 -
[1] - Quote
The people who are complaining don't care enough to counter cloaks using precision enhancers or scanners. A corpmate of mine uses to complex precision enhancers and manages to see most cloaked scouts. It might suck for health but that's the price you pay for countering basically an entire strategy of many enemies. Even if one person does this in a squad and sticks together, passive scans can protect you. Having a designated scan scout can save the squad from minjas easily.
I say let it play out and eventually if there is no nerf people will adapt and sacrifice their up tank for precision |
Toby Flenderson
research lab
436
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Posted - 2014.04.03 19:42:00 -
[2] - Quote
I-Shayz-I wrote:TheD1CK wrote:
Squad up, watch each others back, there's your cloak nerf right there
Then why don't scouts have to squad up in order to be effective? Why don't scouts have to look behind them and use their eyes? Yeah sure I could do all these things that people keep telling me to do, but instead I can skill into scouts in order to: -See where the enemy is at all times -Not be detected easily -Play by myself -Get kills before anyone else can -Run away without fear of someone chasing me -Counter other scouts easily Yet if I want to play ANY other roles I have to adapt in so many ways to counter scouts. Using tactics to counter scouts all the time is like carrying around swarm launchers or forge guns all the time because I have to always be prepared to counter a tank.
Except the things that counter scouts counter every other infantry as well. SL/FG do not help you against anything but tanks (generalizing that most people aren't FG prodigies).
Also you're basically listing the perks of being a scout. This could be done with any suit. Heavies never have to worry about grenades or explosives in general. They have the best CQC weapon available. They have enough health to drop just about any suit in a CQC. They're targets for logi support.
Logis are still able to tank a ridiculous amount of health. They get more equipment and bonuses to them. They have back speed bonuses. They get the most WP in general.
You could keep going. My point is that scouts are good for ewar. That's the point of using a scout. It really seems like they're all getting **** for finally having a strength to play against the med/heavy suits |
Toby Flenderson
research lab
439
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Posted - 2014.04.04 03:30:00 -
[3] - Quote
I-Shayz-I wrote:Toby Flenderson wrote:Having a designated scan scout can save the squad from minjas easily. That's like saying you need a designated tank in your squad in order to counter other tanks -_-
Not even close. Without the scout, you can still kill the cloaked enemies with just about anything. It just helps being able to see them when they think you can't. Tanks are virtually indestructible without forges or well coordinated REs. Or another tanker, as you put it. |
Toby Flenderson
research lab
450
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Posted - 2014.04.04 19:14:00 -
[4] - Quote
Dauth Jenkins wrote:Toby Flenderson wrote:I-Shayz-I wrote:TheD1CK wrote:
Squad up, watch each others back, there's your cloak nerf right there
Then why don't scouts have to squad up in order to be effective? Why don't scouts have to look behind them and use their eyes? Yeah sure I could do all these things that people keep telling me to do, but instead I can skill into scouts in order to: -See where the enemy is at all times -Not be detected easily -Play by myself -Get kills before anyone else can -Run away without fear of someone chasing me -Counter other scouts easily Yet if I want to play ANY other roles I have to adapt in so many ways to counter scouts. Using tactics to counter scouts all the time is like carrying around swarm launchers or forge guns all the time because I have to always be prepared to counter a tank. Except the things that counter scouts counter every other infantry as well. SL/FG do not help you against anything but tanks (generalizing that most people aren't FG prodigies). Also you're basically listing the perks of being a scout. This could be done with any suit. Heavies never have to worry about grenades or explosives in general. They have the best CQC weapon available. They have enough health to drop just about any suit in a CQC. They're targets for logi support. Logis are still able to tank a ridiculous amount of health. They get more equipment and bonuses to them. They have back speed bonuses. They get the most WP in general. You could keep going. My point is that scouts are good for ewar. That's the point of using a scout. It really seems like they're all getting **** for finally having a strength to play against the med/heavy suits Lol, try tanking the minmatar suits that CCP has made most logis use
Aside from my token MLT FG fit, I'm pretty confident sure none of my fittings have more tha 400 ehp. I don't know what you consider a tank but any logi can be tanked by my standards. All you have to do is stack armor plates. If that's not enough then use shields too. If health is your priority then you don't also get to counter scout stealth
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Toby Flenderson
research lab
450
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Posted - 2014.04.04 19:22:00 -
[5] - Quote
Cotsy8 wrote:Ok here we go,
@d1ck - SG + cloak are FOTM chasers because the combo is OP. Not because shotguns or speed SG or tanked SG are but because cloaks are. Nerf'ing cloaks would not hurt scouts for many reasons, but would solve two huge problems. As mentioned 1000 times scouts received a significant boost in 1.8 (and cloaks) which made them more viable, stronger , more flexible, more adaptable due to additional classes (their new roles), increases to slot layout (hi/low on current suits), and a second equipment slot.
There is no disputing scouts have a unique role, a cloak is not required to play that role but rather skill, good decision making, strategy, patience and being selective (don't chase a 1600 heavy, don't take on 3 guys etc..). Quick recap, cloaks reward poor play and provide offensive and defensive advantage to player whose gameplay doesn't deserve such high rewards. Cloaks are low risk, high reward, no drawback easy buttons.
@toby - people who don't care aren't using precision and range mods... Okay so if you spec'd into a cal scout you can be a 220 eHP scout who sees people coming but due to 2 lows can't avoid being seen himself, or due to 650-850 eHP scouts and 1600 eHP heavies can't do much in a battle outside place a remote or hide. You aren't going to see many scouts regardless, cloak + 1 complex damp (plus Gal scout racial bonus), check the chart. A Cal scout need 4 precision to pick up a cloaked scout using 1 complex damp, and can't find a Gal. That means you are required to be a Proto Cal scout with no eHP, no stealth, no speed, just to stand around and passively scan.. Sounds fun being a fragile useless guy who has to be high enough SP (12-14m SP) to avoid being able to do this, sounds like NPE is great, sounds like its a fun time doing **** all and still not seeing 1/2 the scouts.
You say it protects you from minja's, yes the least used scout class who due to their **** 3-2 adv slot layout and lack of PG can't avoid to use stealth and speed or anything but NK which insanely high PG to screw the rest of their suit. Yea protect against a class which is so niche and low in numbers, and whose suits are the weakest in its class.
What you are saying requires too much SP, doesn't protect against 1/2 of the scouts, and turns your char into a boob that isn't exactly having fun.
The only thing I was thinking while reading your response to me was get gud. That's what I run. All of it. I have all 3 scouts mentioned above and I can with the help of a cloak, you don't need hardly any hp. Heavies don't have a clue when you come up behind them with no a knives. Caldari shouldn't be able to see everything, especially a scout who is using complex dampening and cloaks. But the thing is, if you're a scout using complex dampeners, you deserve to be invisible. You are complaining that they are all so fragile if they run scan mods and I agree. Just because you can't imagine being able to play this game without 600+ hp doesn't mean no one can. Seriously you just sound like an idiot crying about how you can't do something that a lot of us can pull off.
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