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Bro-metheus
Storm Wind Strikeforce
Caldari State
79
   |
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:24:00 -
[1] - Quote
It seems like hardeners should just protect the front of the tank and the front of its turret. and that the sides and rear should have weaker protection from the hardeners (ontop of the side weakness and rear intrinsicts) or none at all. This would force tanks to be far more aware of their positioning and how they can advance and engage targets, and adds in far more tactical play. you could put hardeners back up to their old values or more but remove them from protecting the sides of the tank and rear. |
Patrick57
Holdfast Syndicate
Amarr Empire
6272
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:26:00 -
[2] - Quote
The whole tank, now that hardeners are being nerfed. |
Leadfoot10
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
959
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:26:00 -
[3] - Quote
I really like that idea. |
Bro-metheus
Storm Wind Strikeforce
Caldari State
79
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:29:00 -
[4] - Quote
Patrick57 wrote:The whole tank, now that hardeners are being nerfed.
Try thinking dynamically, the values right now are a hotfix to alleviate a current game imbalance. its a tourniquet not a law. we can find other far more beneficial ways to improve the game play long term. I said in my OP that they could have their values increased. |
Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star.
EoN.
3137
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
I would say right now they dont protect that much
25% armor hardener is easily bypassed by swarms since they deal an extra 20% to armor
40% shield hardener seem more useless since again swarms which are supposed to do 80% damage to shields still stops the shield regen even if you have 1 active hardener on
Right now im not sure what they are supposed to do because simply put they aint working that well now
Intelligence is OP
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Dingleburt Bangledack
Knights Of Ender
Galactic Skyfleet Empire
87
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:32:00 -
[6] - Quote
Not just the front but if hardeners affected the front, sides, and back at diminishing values respectively, that might be pretty good.
For Example:
Shield - Front 60%, Sides 45%, Back 30%
Armor - Front 45%, Sides 30%, Back 15%
(These are just example values. No balancing attempt was made.)
As shown, the hardener nerf would HAVE to be reversed were this to ever be implemented. |
Bro-metheus
Storm Wind Strikeforce
Caldari State
79
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:33:00 -
[7] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:I would say right now they dont protect that much
25% armor hardener is easily bypassed by swarms since they deal an extra 20% to armor
40% shield hardener seem more useless since again swarms which are supposed to do 80% damage to shields still stops the shield regen even if you have 1 active hardener on
Right now im not sure what they are supposed to do because simply put they aint working that well now
Has the shield hardener hotfix nerf been applied? I thought it has yet to be deployed. |
Leonid Tybalt
Inner.Hell
391
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:36:00 -
[8] - Quote
Bro-metheus wrote:It seems like hardeners should just protect the front of the tank and the front of its turret. and that the sides and rear should have weaker protection from the hardeners (ontop of the side weakness and rear intrinsicts) or none at all. This would force tanks to be far more aware of their positioning and how they can advance and engage targets, and adds in far more tactical play. you could put hardeners back up to their old values or more but remove them from protecting the sides of the tank and rear.
Should your infantry shields protect your entire body, or just the front? 
I think I've made my point....
Also, the rear of the tank is already more vulnerable. With hardeners or without. |
Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star.
EoN.
3137
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:36:00 -
[9] - Quote
Dingleburt Bangledack wrote:Not just the front but if hardeners affected the front, sides, and back at diminishing values respectively, that might be pretty good.
For Example:
Shield - Front 60%, Sides 45%, Back 30%
Armor - Front 45%, Sides 30%, Back 15%
(These are just example values. No balancing attempt was made.)
As shown, the hardener nerf would HAVE to be reversed were this to ever be implemented.
It reminds me of WOT
How they do it is armor thickness and the angle and where the shell hits the armor and at what angle and that determines if the shell bounces or gets through and how much damage is caused and if it hits anything
Problem is swarms hit the middle of the tank everytime, FG and PLC you can aim but also you forgot about the top
I think it would require another overhaul
Intelligence is OP
|
Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star.
EoN.
3137
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:36:00 -
[10] - Quote
Bro-metheus wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:I would say right now they dont protect that much
25% armor hardener is easily bypassed by swarms since they deal an extra 20% to armor
40% shield hardener seem more useless since again swarms which are supposed to do 80% damage to shields still stops the shield regen even if you have 1 active hardener on
Right now im not sure what they are supposed to do because simply put they aint working that well now Has the shield hardener hotfix nerf been applied? I thought it has yet to be deployed.
Today
It does have the potential to ruin shield vehicles
Intelligence is OP
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Bro-metheus
Storm Wind Strikeforce
Caldari State
79
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:37:00 -
[11] - Quote
Dingleburt Bangledack wrote:Not just the front but if hardeners affected the front, sides, and back at diminishing values respectively, that might be pretty good.
For Example:
Shield - Front 60%, Sides 45%, Back 30%
Armor - Front 45%, Sides 30%, Back 15%
(These are just example values. No balancing attempt was made.)
As shown, the hardener nerf would HAVE to be reversed were this to ever be implemented.
I agree the hardener nerf would have to be reversed at the implementation of this, numbers would have to be figured out. another option is that you have different moduals for hardeners that protect different parts of the tank to different levels like one is F80S20R10 and another is F40S40R30 (numbers for reference only not balance) or something so tankers have decisions to make about what they want to protect more or less and they have to think about how they want to play their tanks and the risk reward of each dif modual.
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Bro-metheus
Storm Wind Strikeforce
Caldari State
79
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:38:00 -
[12] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:Bro-metheus wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:I would say right now they dont protect that much
25% armor hardener is easily bypassed by swarms since they deal an extra 20% to armor
40% shield hardener seem more useless since again swarms which are supposed to do 80% damage to shields still stops the shield regen even if you have 1 active hardener on
Right now im not sure what they are supposed to do because simply put they aint working that well now Has the shield hardener hotfix nerf been applied? I thought it has yet to be deployed. Today It does have the potential to ruin shield vehicles
today is in this next upcoming downtime? because there is no mention on the announcements. |
Bro-metheus
Storm Wind Strikeforce
Caldari State
79
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:41:00 -
[13] - Quote
Leonid Tybalt wrote:Bro-metheus wrote:It seems like hardeners should just protect the front of the tank and the front of its turret. and that the sides and rear should have weaker protection from the hardeners (ontop of the side weakness and rear intrinsicts) or none at all. This would force tanks to be far more aware of their positioning and how they can advance and engage targets, and adds in far more tactical play. you could put hardeners back up to their old values or more but remove them from protecting the sides of the tank and rear. Should your infantry shields protect your entire body, or just the front? I think I've made my point.... Also, the rear of the tank is already more vulnerable. With hardeners or without.
Not really, we are talking about hardeners not shields or armor. But the resistance moduals for those shields and armor. If a heavy had a active/passive hardener or something then yeah its sides/head/rear should be far weaker and exploitable.
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Bro-metheus
Storm Wind Strikeforce
Caldari State
79
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:46:00 -
[14] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:Dingleburt Bangledack wrote:Not just the front but if hardeners affected the front, sides, and back at diminishing values respectively, that might be pretty good.
For Example:
Shield - Front 60%, Sides 45%, Back 30%
Armor - Front 45%, Sides 30%, Back 15%
(These are just example values. No balancing attempt was made.)
As shown, the hardener nerf would HAVE to be reversed were this to ever be implemented. It reminds me of WOT How they do it is armor thickness and the angle and where the shell hits the armor and at what angle and that determines if the shell bounces or gets through and how much damage is caused and if it hits anything Problem is swarms hit the middle of the tank everytime, FG and PLC you can aim but also you forgot about the top I think it would require another overhaul
Yeah swarm launchers need changes anyway so maybe they should lock on with like a retical about where on they tank they are going to strike? like a laser is the exact spot. the swarms are going for bar the tank turning around or shifting is pos.
I would think top of the tank turret would be like its head so a good direct shot their would do more dmg, but only for a small very top of its tank turret. same dmg as rear or so the rest of the tanks top would have the same protection as that section of the tank. dont want overcomplicate it. but a more WOT style would be cool. |
Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star.
EoN.
3142
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:47:00 -
[15] - Quote
Bro-metheus wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:Bro-metheus wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:I would say right now they dont protect that much
25% armor hardener is easily bypassed by swarms since they deal an extra 20% to armor
40% shield hardener seem more useless since again swarms which are supposed to do 80% damage to shields still stops the shield regen even if you have 1 active hardener on
Right now im not sure what they are supposed to do because simply put they aint working that well now Has the shield hardener hotfix nerf been applied? I thought it has yet to be deployed. Today It does have the potential to ruin shield vehicles today is in this next upcoming downtime? because there is no mention on the announcements.
It was ment to be yday but issues so they did it today
Its in effect now
Intelligence is OP
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Bro-metheus
Storm Wind Strikeforce
Caldari State
79
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:48:00 -
[16] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:Bro-metheus wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:Bro-metheus wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:I would say right now they dont protect that much
25% armor hardener is easily bypassed by swarms since they deal an extra 20% to armor
40% shield hardener seem more useless since again swarms which are supposed to do 80% damage to shields still stops the shield regen even if you have 1 active hardener on
Right now im not sure what they are supposed to do because simply put they aint working that well now Has the shield hardener hotfix nerf been applied? I thought it has yet to be deployed. Today It does have the potential to ruin shield vehicles today is in this next upcoming downtime? because there is no mention on the announcements. It was ment to be yday but issues so they did it today Its in effect now
Can you link me a dev post please? I cant find ****.
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Roy Ventus
Axis of Chaos
1538
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 21:53:00 -
[17] - Quote
Whole tank, not the front. Besides that I feel like it wouldn't be worth it, I feel that it'll be too difficult of a coding. We'd end up with enough bugs to make something that's a primary module for tankers, useless.
"There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all."
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Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star.
EoN.
3145
|
Posted - 2014.03.28 22:03:00 -
[18] - Quote
Bro-metheus wrote:Takahiro Kashuken wrote:Dingleburt Bangledack wrote:Not just the front but if hardeners affected the front, sides, and back at diminishing values respectively, that might be pretty good.
For Example:
Shield - Front 60%, Sides 45%, Back 30%
Armor - Front 45%, Sides 30%, Back 15%
(These are just example values. No balancing attempt was made.)
As shown, the hardener nerf would HAVE to be reversed were this to ever be implemented. It reminds me of WOT How they do it is armor thickness and the angle and where the shell hits the armor and at what angle and that determines if the shell bounces or gets through and how much damage is caused and if it hits anything Problem is swarms hit the middle of the tank everytime, FG and PLC you can aim but also you forgot about the top I think it would require another overhaul Yeah swarm launchers need changes anyway so maybe they should lock on with like a retical about where on they tank they are going to strike? like a laser is the exact spot. the swarms are going for bar the tank turning around or shifting is pos. I would think top of the tank turret would be like its head so a good direct shot their would do more dmg, but only for a small very top of its tank turret. same dmg as rear or so the rest of the tanks top would have the same protection as that section of the tank. dont want overcomplicate it. but a more WOT style would be cool.
Requires another complete shake up of vehicles and AV
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=150302&find=unread
Intelligence is OP
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