I would tend to assert shotguns are fine.

In PC really good players using them do just as well if not better than really good players using other weapons. This isn't the end all be all, but you certainly see shotguns getting more kills than a lot of other weapons.

All i've ever heard about complaint wise from my particular shotties is not the range but the hit detection...even in pubs, being spotty at times.

Shotguns are fine. If you need tips on "How to Shotgun" feel free to message me in game. =^_^=

If it gets Buffed, it will get Nerfed... really hard. People really don't like 1 shot weapons. Besides, me and a lot of other people do great with Shotguns. Maybe you need better Tactics?

Exactly my point. Although I agree lol... I just don't want my favorite weapon Nerfed. It's in a pretty good place now anyway. Well... besides hit detection. I hope they fix it again.

When hit detection was fixed it dramatically increased applied DPS for automatic weapons. It did not change the DPS for high Alpha weapons. It did make High Alpha weapons not miss as much, but missing due to bad hit detection was always more apparent in high alpha weapons than in automatic weapons.

The result was that when hit detection was fixed all automatic weapons got increased DPS, while Shot Guns, Sniper Rifles, Nova Knives etc stayed the same.

Because Automatic weapons got more applied DPS, most people started fitting as much Plate as they possibly could to increase their health pool, in order extend the TTK against them so they might have time to react. The result of this was an overall increase to the health of most dropsuits, due to brick tanking becoming by far the most common fit.

The end result of all this, is that Shotguns can no longer 1 shot most medium frame suits.

However, if the TTK is extended the brick-tank fit will no longer be so essential, and other more versatile fits will take its place. The result will be that Shotguns will once again be able to 1-shot most medium frame suits.

Therefore, I would advocate not doing anything to the shotgun until we see how it performs after players have had a few weeks to adjust to the changes in 1.8.

I think it's fine. Maybe y'all just need more practice with it.

I don't find the aiming to be too slow (I use the DS3 and my sensitivity is at 90 for everything). Then again, in most of my encounters the enemy is caught unawares and therefore I can take my time to get close and line up a good shot properly.

So maybe you're doing it wrong?

If you are expecting the shotgun to 1vs1 an enemy who is aware of you in a strafe duel, you will be disappointed. It excels as a high alpha surprise weapon, meant for dispatching an enemy who is caught off guard and disoriented while trying to locate where you are shooting from.

Aiming is too slow in Dust. I do agree there. PS3 controller with all sensitive's 100% its still too slow.

Fix spotty hit-detection issue wherein the shield glitches and the enemy takes no damage. It seems to happen mainly with the high alpha damage weapons more than any other weapons. Maybe a range increase and less spread also, otherwise, they're fine. The other part is skill and tactics. See Roner General, Marauder, or Fusion Commander.

/thread

More spread <> OHK


I do sense the frustration with using the shotgun - I have personally seen myself miss with my CRG-3/Creoden shotguns more times than I can count. I did find that raising the sensitivity did not help my cause, so I put it back to the default setting.

What I have found that works, is rather than attempt to stay on them like glue, I let them backpeddle/strafe, while I too, move back just a bit. This allows me a chance to turn at the same rate they move (and keeps them in my sights). 2nd shot generally kills everything, 3rd shot will always kill whatever is left, assuming they haven't killed me first.

Deadzones are a controller hardware problem bro- I experience 0 of this issue that you're talking about with a stock DS3.

Put it away mate, aiming with the DS3 is fine. Take away aim assist and put it back to how it was in chromosome, at least then the aiming was predictable. I have my controller settings on 50/60 and the speed is more than adequate. Do you want to be able to do insta-spins? is that it? I have no problems killing strafing enemies with the shotgun (or at least getting my reticle on them). No, it doesn't have AA, but neither should it.

RE the shotgun damage; adding the 2% damage per proficiency level and a slight range buff (1-2m) would balance it up. Having said that though, I wouldn't want to lose the decrease in dispersion either. Maybe an additional skill for one of those skills would be appropriate. To qualify this, I'll just say that currently the ADV Combat Rifle is presently more effective in CQC than my CreoDron. I can't count the number of times I've got the drop on someone, pumped a round into their back, only dropped their shields and they have proceeded to jump forward, look at me and I'm dead.

I find this ridiculous because I run my fit with a complex damage mod and upwards of 600 hp. Surely enough to get 2-3 shots off before I die? Nope.

Nova knives can kill in one go, they are the closest range there is, it only makes sense the further way you go the more shots it should take. Sounds like you just want an "I win" button once cloaks come out.

Um you do know this was in reply to the OP right, not you. You just made yourself look like an idiot. Thanks though for the attempt at an insult. As for my response for aiming being too slow, I do believe the ADS for SGs are too slow compared to other weapons and other games, especially for a weapon u want to mainly go for head shots with to get the most bang for your buck. When you can't reliably do that, you flank, hip-fire, and strafe.

The Shotgun aims slowly because it is one of the most massive light weapons. It is quite a bit more chunky than any of the infantry rifles. While the pistols can be aimed quickly, and the Infantry Riles are still fairly light to handle, the Shotgun is a ponderous thing for a light or medium suit to be carrying. Only the heavy weapons are slower to aim, and slower to bring to bare when coming out of a sprint.

That of course is the RP explanation. From a game play perspective the slow aiming of the shotgun is one of the many balance features which keeps the ShotgunGÇÖs high alpha damage from being overpowered. Now wether these factors are properly in balance is another matter. Lets look at what they are.

Damage is balanced by:
- Short rang
- Slow aim & time required to bring to bare coming out of a sprint.
- Rate of fire
- Ammo capacity
- Reload speed

Hit detection is not a balancing factor, and if there is a problem, then it needs to be fixed.

Currently the balance has been thrown off due to the popularity of Brick tanking to compensate for the short TTK. Normally brick tanking would be far less common due to having to sacrifice mobility to get that extra health, and because normally it would not be as needed. However, with such a short TTK mobility is less beneficial and larger health pools are vastly more helpful.

Essentially automatic weapons became more powerful, the community compensated by brick tanking their suits, and the shotgun got left behind.

It may be that the Shotgun has too short a range, is ponderously slow when aiming, and needs a faster rate of fire. Or it may be that buffing any of these things at the same time that people are switching from brick tank fits to speed or shield recharge fits, could make the Shotgun suddenly Over Powered. You saw what happened when AV was nerfed and Tanks were buffed at the same time.

I would favour leaving the Shotgun unchanged for 1.8, and then assessing the state of the Shotgun two weeks after 1.8 drops. Then determining if the Shotgun needs a buff for the following patch.

And of course, hit detection is not a Balance factor, so they should fix any problems there at their first opportunity.

Edit: RP explanation for Shotguns having a short range:
The Shotgun in DUST is a Plasma weapon. It fires a number of small supper heated pellets of plasma that are held in electromagnetic suspension until fired. (Otherwise the shotgun would melt into slag.) These superheated pellets contain an immense amount of energy in an unstable state. When they impact the target they release that heat energy, vaporizing the surface they impact, causing an explosive out-gassing of vaporized material. Very deadly at close range, but as the pellets travel through the air they out-gas and cool, losing much of that stored energy. At 15m they impact like hot paint balls and by 25m they would have literally evaporated.

I think what he meant was that player skill can compensate for gear deficiencies and that you, therefore, can't tell if a weapon is balanced just because one player does well with it. So yes, you're right. Shotguns require more player skill, but it's because the player need to make up for its deficiencies. Thus, shotguns are under powered.

well 2 shots to kill someone in the 3m range, only 1 hit kill is at pointblank range, and that means touch them with your barrel, low rate of fire, hit detection, and some other things make the shotgun not only underpowered but almost impossible to use, i used it before and it just repulses me now, only good against unaware heavies