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I-Shayz-I
I-----I
2350
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Posted - 2014.02.18 18:23:00 -
[1] - Quote
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXIK8x4NQGg
I used to love Warhawk, especially the epic dropship fights and warhawk fighter battles.
However, the main problem in Dust is that dropship controls are so complicated that even someone like me who has played this game for more than a year now still has trouble with them...and couldn't even do so until AFTER I had to watch youtube videos about how to fly the damn things.
Someone already posted on my video that the E3 build actually had dropships that flew like this, but that players would use them to crush people going 20/0. I don't want this at all, so obviously having decent collision mechanics would be good, but being able to at least hover in the air in one spot easily and having intuitive controls would be a lot better than what we have now.
What do you think?
Links:
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I make logistics videos!
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Fire of Prometheus
Alpha Response Command
3699
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Posted - 2014.02.18 18:28:00 -
[2] - Quote
1. I love warhawk!!!!
2. Agreed, some easier controls are definitely needed but I've gotten used to the current ones so either way, I'm fine
Scout: I'm going to knife you my commando!!!
commando turns around
Commando:FAAAAALCCCOOOOONNNNNN PUUUUUUNNNCCCCHH!!
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Yan Darn
Forsaken Immortals
Top Men.
232
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Posted - 2014.02.18 18:29:00 -
[3] - Quote
On the one hand this means I could fulfil my (clone)life long dream of becoming a dropship pilot.
On the other...I've seen some pilots just do some **** hot stuff, and I can't help but have the deepest respect them...it's rare to have that in this game...
You probably don't know me. But next time you get gunned down or exploded by a Valor scout...check the name.
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Zirzo Valcyn
Kameira Lodge
Amarr Empire
109
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Posted - 2014.02.18 18:36:00 -
[4] - Quote
it negates all the effort and wasted isk that pilots have invested learning to fly on hard mode. i say just practice more, it's attainable as it is.
u can ban the troll out of the forums but u can't ban the forums out of the troll.
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Thanjac
Ruthless Chaos
6
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Posted - 2014.02.18 18:42:00 -
[5] - Quote
I agree with Fire, easier controls would be nice, but after a couple million isk I finally got the hang of them
Proud Commando/ARC Instructor
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends."
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Dunk Mujunk
RestlessSpirits
469
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Posted - 2014.02.18 18:42:00 -
[6] - Quote
The controls for the Dropships are.......unique to say the least, but overall I don't think they need to be changed. There are plenty of people (myself included) who have mastered piloting (though my DS gun game needs work). I've said it before and i'll say itvagain. The best way to learn to fly is to stack the max possible armor on a Grims and just fly. If you get an empty battle, fly under everything you can over and over, practice everything as much as possible. Don't be scared to lose the DS, and be prepared to spend a chunck of ISK, even after you have become a master pilot (seriously, 300k+ for an ADS? Its whatever, but ouch). Maybe i'm just being a greedy d*ck, but i busted my @ss learning how to fly, and I take massive pride in what i'm now able to do in a DS, and I guess I feel it would suck to watch the DS get dumbed down and have every reject in this god awful game floating around like an idiot (not refering to the OP here of course, just generalizing). It happened this past build with tanks, don't wanna see in happen to DS's.
@OP- I can offer to teach you, and fund you to an extent, but i've seen you around the forums since I started playing, I know you've been around way longer than me, so i'm not sure if there is anything i'd be able to teach that you probably haven't heard already.
I haven't failed 10,000 times, i've successfully found 10,000 ways that won't work.
Thomas Edison
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
9356
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Posted - 2014.02.18 18:50:00 -
[7] - Quote
Dropships use to be user-friendly and easy back in closed beta, then CCP Blam wanted to make things "hardcore". He no longer works are CCP.
Gû¦Gû+Supreme emperor god-kingpÇÉKAGEH¦PSHIpÇæ// Lord of threads // Forum alt Gû¦Gû+
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Oswald Rehnquist
1249
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Posted - 2014.02.18 18:54:00 -
[8] - Quote
I kind of wish there were more skill based playstyles beyond dropshipping, while there are a few techniques to making weapons perform better or scout stalking techniques in general its not as much of a skill based as piloting dropships. Its one of few choices where player mechanical skill is actually required, it would kind of kill the joy out of it if it was just as much of a breeze moving infantry around.
Being able to learn something tough that many in the community shy's away from has some feeling of prestige, even when they are good they won't be used too much because it actually takes skill to use.
Below 28 dB
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Zirzo Valcyn
Kameira Lodge
Amarr Empire
111
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Posted - 2014.02.18 18:55:00 -
[9] - Quote
cool i hope your guys crusade to dumb down flight controls brings you some happiness. with enough whining you achieve anything.
u can ban the troll out of the forums but u can't ban the forums out of the troll.
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FarQue FromAfar
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
17
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Posted - 2014.02.18 18:58:00 -
[10] - Quote
Yes most of those mechanics from warhawk would be very nice, I like the current damage when running into buildings, but that needs to be toned down, as in it needs to take damage off inertial hits, hit something hard and it takes major damage, bump into a wall and it should just bump it... not blow it away. We need counter measures to break lock on from swarms, and have limited ammo that can be resupplied same as turret ammo. Current dust dropships are ok at best, they need to reduce landing damage so you can insert mercs on the ground faster, and pick them up faster. The gun system from warhawks is nice where you can shoot them if no one is operating them. It is a fine line as to what can be allowed because the current version of dust is more about mercs, tanks are an unexpected result I am sure, but if everyone was in a dropship then the community would be QQ about that.
They need to get the stuff promised to us, like player markets, better link to EVE, PvE, and they for sure need to quit nerfing/buffing guns. Come up with a DPS system with ranges that work, and quit jacking with the guns. Every nerf or buff makes certain guns FoTM or obsolete. SoonTM is BS,and I am tired of reading about empty promises. They have another Fan Fest, and have not delivered anything worth keeping the player base interested. It is clear that the community as a whole wants battles in space on ships, wants MCC battles, wants drone battles (PvE) at the very least, we also want more options for new players, tier based battles, The list goes on and on... Pick a subject and deliver. |
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
9356
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:00:00 -
[11] - Quote
I think there needs to be at least one aerial vehicle in Dust that is easy to learn, but right now we only have the dropship. Many players like the fact that it requires such skill to pilot, hopefully perhaps the fighters will be easier.
Gû¦Gû+Supreme emperor god-kingpÇÉKAGEH¦PSHIpÇæ// Lord of threads // Forum alt Gû¦Gû+
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Fire of Prometheus
Alpha Response Command
3702
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:05:00 -
[12] - Quote
MLT dropships already have an auto balance feature, that is, they autocorrect their flight path to stay level.
It's harder to manoeuvre one I find....prob cause I'm used to flying incubus(s) (incubi?)
Scout: I'm going to knife you my commando!!!
commando turns around
Commando:FAAAAALCCCOOOOONNNNNN PUUUUUUNNNCCCCHH!!
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Zirzo Valcyn
Kameira Lodge
Amarr Empire
111
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:06:00 -
[13] - Quote
i don't have the self promotion to sit here and oppose this horrible thread. hopefully a pilot who does will pipe in
u can ban the troll out of the forums but u can't ban the forums out of the troll.
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Flix Keptick
Red Star.
EoN.
3442
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:08:00 -
[14] - Quote
I-Shayz-I wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXIK8x4NQGg
I used to love Warhawk, especially the epic dropship fights and warhawk fighter battles.
However, the main problem in Dust is that dropship controls are so complicated that even someone like me who has played this game for more than a year now still has trouble with them...and couldn't even do so until AFTER I had to watch youtube videos about how to fly the damn things.
Someone already posted on my video that the E3 build actually had dropships that flew like this, but that players would use them to crush people going 20/0. I don't want this at all, so obviously having decent collision mechanics would be good, but being able to at least hover in the air in one spot easily and having intuitive controls would be a lot better than what we have now.
What do you think?
I think the controls could be made easier again now that there is actual collision damage. Slamming into the ground to kill someone usually results in the dropship exploding.
The community is the worst thing that ever happened to this game.
Tank driver // specialized tank destroyer
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Zirzo Valcyn
Kameira Lodge
Amarr Empire
117
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:12:00 -
[15] - Quote
you already got aim bot on your little rifles, just play with those.
u can ban the troll out of the forums but u can't ban the forums out of the troll.
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Dauth Jenkins
Ultramarine Corp
57
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:14:00 -
[16] - Quote
Fire of Prometheus wrote:1. I love warhawk!!!!
2. Agreed, some easier controls are definitely needed but I've gotten used to the current ones so either way, I'm fine
I'd like some easier controls, built you'd have everyone and their mother flying a dropships, and we would have no space to fly, so -1
Sees prototompers...
Sees blueberries start to snipe...
Pulls out commando suit with laser rifle and swarm launcher...
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Christiphoros von Poe
Dead Six Initiative
Lokun Listamenn
101
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:16:00 -
[17] - Quote
I personally like the difficult controls. I used to pilot dropships and still occasionally do. It is a skill to be proud of once you have mastered it. I have seen some aerial maneuvers by some amazing pilots that have gained deep respect from me. To me flying is an art form in dust, and I will be sad if they do change it.
(1) "Exile" Assault Rifle reserved for: Fire of Prometheus
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DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
11107
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:17:00 -
[18] - Quote
We just need custom games that don't cost you any ISK if you lose assets, but you don't gain any ISK or SP for playing in them.
That way pilots can learn without wasting an absurd amount of ISK, and everyone in general can practice for the sake of practice, or just to have some fun. I for one think dropship controls are pretty much superb, but I've also been flying for almost 2 years now.
Oh, and un-nerf the Standard dropships handling so it's only a little worse than the ADS, right now there's no point in even flying them because they're so sluggish.
Videos / Fiction
Closed Beta Vet; Incubus Pilot
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L0RD CALVERT
Ancient Legion
26
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:21:00 -
[19] - Quote
a long as the dumb down comes after planetside2 releases on PS4 i won't even care. you guys can have your lol ez mode while i fly in a game where it actually matters
AKA Sock Puppet King- supporting/liking/bromancing my own posts since 2012
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Maximus Stryker
Who Are Those Guys
812
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:28:00 -
[20] - Quote
like
Faction Channels for FW Staging
PIE Ground Control | Caldari Hierarchy | Turalyon | Chosen Matari
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Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
1099
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:35:00 -
[21] - Quote
no because then i wouldnt be able to do barrel rolls and backflips anymore |
Zirzo Valcyn
Kameira Lodge
Amarr Empire
120
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:38:00 -
[22] - Quote
Ghosts Chance wrote:no because then i wouldnt be able to do barrel rolls and backflips anymore
OMG WTF bro those are too hard i want to do them also and am entitled to them with very little practice!
u can ban the troll out of the forums but u can't ban the forums out of the troll.
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DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
11113
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:38:00 -
[23] - Quote
Ghosts Chance wrote:no because then i wouldnt be able to do barrel rolls and backflips anymore
I still need to figure one thing out with my Incubus. Every now and then I'll do like a partial backflip, and I will somehow gain tremendous speed and have difficulty pulling the ship back up, but in the span of like 4 seconds I've crossed over half the map. I haven't really been able to replicate it, it just sort of happens to me, but I feel like whatever that is, is an advanced maneuver, and I would love to learn to use it reliably.
Videos / Fiction
Closed Beta Vet; Incubus Pilot
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Dunk Mujunk
RestlessSpirits
471
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:46:00 -
[24] - Quote
I think it also needs to be brought up that DSing in actual combat also requires some pretty stout AV (usually). I'm lucky to have many different types of tankers in my Corp, and one in particular has a style that works great with my DSing style. I'm usually protected from the threat of installations, tanks, and other DSs. When this is all working at its best, I can float around the map andjst absolutely destroy infantry. You don't want to make it any easier for me or pilots like me. I will say the turret needs to be able to move completely free of the DS directional controls (on the ADS that is). I'd personally like a modifier button (maybe R2, cabt remember if thats mapped to anything in a DS) that allows you to turn the turret any direction without turning the actual DS (within reason of course. I'm not asking to shoot backwards, maybe any direction up to 80 degrees from the central aim point).
I haven't failed 10,000 times, i've successfully found 10,000 ways that won't work.
Thomas Edison
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Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
1102
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:54:00 -
[25] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Ghosts Chance wrote:no because then i wouldnt be able to do barrel rolls and backflips anymore I still need to figure one thing out with my Incubus. Every now and then I'll do like a partial backflip, and I will somehow gain tremendous speed and have difficulty pulling the ship back up, but in the span of like 4 seconds I've crossed over half the map. I haven't really been able to replicate it, it just sort of happens to me, but I feel like whatever that is, is an advanced maneuver, and I would love to learn to use it reliably.
its ALOT harder in the incubus.
i suspect you would have to do a partial backflip.
- get high :P
- activate afterburner
-point nose strait up
- instead opf carrying over onto your back all the way around you have to start pointing your nose left or rtight and carry it through
- you then have to correct your dropship so that its no longer upside down and sideways.
the trick is to do it quickly in one fluid motion and with the incubus it isnt so much a backflip as it is a 180, and so if your good at 180s then use that same manuver but with your nose pointed at the sky and it should work out for you.
as for the part where you lose alot of altitude i find that instead of relying on r2 and afterburner alone you can use dusts "wind" resistance to slow you down as well, but you have to point the bottom of your dropship exactly in the direction of your momentum so that your pointed kinda completly oposite to the direction your moving in as many ways as possable, and then point the dropship sideways, this for some reason creates alot of "air" resistance and you can come to a complete standstill quite quickly that way. i use that trick for ending high speed dives into hot territory.
to be honest in a python its ALOT easyer and its also easyer to stop the thing, so i usually use a backflip to gain stupid amounts of speed then carry that speed with me at super low altitude for evasive flying.
i suspect that because of how dropships are coded, the way to arrest movement is to point your dropship in as much of an exact oposite position as you can as long as that direct isnt upside down.
so suddenly turning backwards while pointing the dropship downwards int he direction you just came from has the effect of turning the air into a solid wall of resistance because none of the dropships native flight calculations are working in the favor of your current momentum.
P.S. we need to squad up sometime and swap some manuvering tricks |
Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
1102
|
Posted - 2014.02.18 20:11:00 -
[26] - Quote
there are just too many fun and cool ways to defy gravity with dropships in the game right now and not a single dropship enthusist would give them up because they are just too much damn fun to do |
Vulpes Dolosus
SVER True Blood
General Tso's Alliance
965
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Posted - 2014.02.18 20:11:00 -
[27] - Quote
I want fighters :(
I recently picked up StarHawk again (WarHawks "sequel") and have been loving the dogfights there (not so much air-to-ground, everything's way OP and imbalanced there). I really hope there are some plans for fighters in Dust. I love aerial combat.
ADS Kills: Lost count a while ago...
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Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
1102
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Posted - 2014.02.18 20:16:00 -
[28] - Quote
a great way to learn to fly dropships is to go play kerbal space program
use the knowledge you gain from manuvering in space to improve your overall understanding of the physics invovled in manuvering in space to control your trajectory when your flying around in a dropship :P
also try building a V-TOL then take it to either minmus/mun or Duna (easyest to hardest) wich have lighter gravity then kerbal and you get closer to in game gravity effects on planet in dust.
if you can sucessfully launch a v-tol to duna, land, and return to kerbin you will instantly become a better dropship pilot. |
Pvt Numnutz
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
763
|
Posted - 2014.02.18 20:21:00 -
[29] - Quote
I see where you are coming from, but I completely disagree. The controls are good and they should stay exactly the way they are. Dropships should never be easy to fly for anyone. It took me months to learn how to fly under horrible conditions that made me learn or die. Today I can do a barrel role into a dive cut close to a building go under a bridge skim 1m off the ground then fly in just above a point and land like a delicate butterfly. My point is, like anything in dust, it should take time to learn your skill set. I am a pilot, what makes me stand out from other mercs is that I can fly a dropship, and fly it damn well, but that's because I've worked for it. |
Meeko Fent
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
1757
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Posted - 2014.02.18 20:32:00 -
[30] - Quote
I am in support of auto hover on DSs.
I am assuming this is kinda asking for maintaining altitude when not holding down the throttle, combined with deceleration when not pushing the stick forward.
Looking for a Interesting Character Name?
Why Not Zoidberg?
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DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
11116
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Posted - 2014.02.18 20:34:00 -
[31] - Quote
Ghosts Chance wrote:P.S. we need to squad up sometime and swap some manuvering tricks
I haven't been playing all that much lately, but next time I'm on I'll toss you a message and add you to contacts. I like flying formation though it's tough for me to keep up with Pythons as an armored Incubus
Videos / Fiction
Closed Beta Vet; Incubus Pilot
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Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
1104
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Posted - 2014.02.18 20:35:00 -
[32] - Quote
Meeko Fent wrote:I am in support of auto hover on DSs.
I am assuming this is kinda asking for maintaining altitude when not holding down the throttle, combined with deceleration when not pushing the stick forward.
it already auto hovers without pressing r2..... dropships naturally maintain their altitude when your level they have a set amount of thrust pointed strait down at all times, its just that we also use this as our primary forward thrust by pointing our nose down.
it doesnt decelerate ill give you that, but thats because it functions like an aircraft in that it keeps and carrys its momentum, to correct you simply have to thurst oposite your momentum like a spacecraft would to slow down. |
DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
11116
|
Posted - 2014.02.18 20:37:00 -
[33] - Quote
Ghosts Chance wrote:Meeko Fent wrote:I am in support of auto hover on DSs.
I am assuming this is kinda asking for maintaining altitude when not holding down the throttle, combined with deceleration when not pushing the stick forward. it already auto hovers without pressing r2..... dropships naturally maintain their altitude when your level they have a set amount of thrust pointed strait down at all times, its just that we also use this as our primary forward thrust by pointing our nose down. it doesnt decelerate ill give you that, but thats because it functions like an aircraft in that it keeps and carrys its momentum, to correct you simply have to thurst oposite your momentum like a spacecraft would to slow down.
Hovering was one of the first skills I learned, it just comes naturally to me now.
Videos / Fiction
Closed Beta Vet; Incubus Pilot
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Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
1104
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Posted - 2014.02.18 20:38:00 -
[34] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Ghosts Chance wrote:P.S. we need to squad up sometime and swap some manuvering tricks I haven't been playing all that much lately, but next time I'm on I'll toss you a message and add you to contacts. I like flying formation though it's tough for me to keep up with Pythons as an armored Incubus
thats fine im usually flying wingman with means the incubus would lead anyways, and the python would be able to maintain position on an incubus better then the other way around. im used to keeping up with other pythons so i imagine it would be alot easyer, plus your a left favoring pilot like myself and most pilots (aka your right handed :P) so its easyer to keep in formation. |
Zirzo Valcyn
Kameira Lodge
Amarr Empire
125
|
Posted - 2014.02.18 20:49:00 -
[35] - Quote
Ghosts Chance wrote:a great way to learn to fly dropships is to go play kerbal space program
use the knowledge you gain from manuvering in space to improve your overall understanding of the physics invovled in manuvering in space to control your trajectory when your flying around in a dropship :P
also try building a V-TOL then take it to either minmus/mun or Duna (easyest to hardest) wich have lighter gravity then kerbal and you get closer to in game gravity effects on planet in dust.
if you can sucessfully launch a v-tol to duna, land, and return to kerbin you will instantly become a better dropship pilot.
oh man i've wanted to play kerbal for ever. unfortunately my better PC is down.
how about instead of making the DS easier we focus on making the pilot suit effective.
u can ban the troll out of the forums but u can't ban the forums out of the troll.
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Dauth Jenkins
Ultramarine Corp
61
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Posted - 2014.02.18 20:52:00 -
[36] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Ghosts Chance wrote:Meeko Fent wrote:I am in support of auto hover on DSs.
I am assuming this is kinda asking for maintaining altitude when not holding down the throttle, combined with deceleration when not pushing the stick forward. it already auto hovers without pressing r2..... dropships naturally maintain their altitude when your level they have a set amount of thrust pointed strait down at all times, its just that we also use this as our primary forward thrust by pointing our nose down. it doesnt decelerate ill give you that, but thats because it functions like an aircraft in that it keeps and carrys its momentum, to correct you simply have to thurst oposite your momentum like a spacecraft would to slow down. Hovering was one of the first skills I learned, it just comes naturally to me now.
I can hover quite efficiently in my Myron, but I'm never perfectly stable while flying a python.
Sees prototompers...
Sees blueberries start to snipe...
Pulls out commando suit with laser rifle and swarm launcher...
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Broonfondle Majikthies
Dogs of War Gaming
Zero-Day
858
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Posted - 2014.02.18 20:54:00 -
[37] - Quote
I'm kinda torn
On the one hand I'd love to have a more manoeuvrable craft (I miss overdrives.  Really hope Min DS is more to my liking)
On the other I'm proud to be one of the few who can fly... sort of
*Disclaimer - any random (and catastrophic to be honest  ) fails you see me do in game are mostly down to lack of practice lately. I don't get to fly as often as I like.
Plus, as stated, my ideal DS isn't in the game yet 
"...where Bylothgar the Ill-postured was made King of the People With No Name But Decent Footwear"
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Varjac Theobroma Montenegro
PAND3M0N1UM
Lokun Listamenn
169
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Posted - 2014.02.18 20:55:00 -
[38] - Quote
It would be interesting to see an intermediate aerial vehicle that has a limited height ceiling, say 60m, and maybe has the transport capacity of two additional mercs. This vehicle could be like the ones in warhawk.
I like my ADS controls and have sunk millions into acquiring them. Changing the flight controls would definitely change the way people play, as dust would become very aerial. Plus, I would murder infantry with those controls, are you kidding me?! I could easily pop around corners and maintain the perfect cover from AV as I maximize the damage I could do.
FAME
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Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
1105
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Posted - 2014.02.18 20:56:00 -
[39] - Quote
Dauth Jenkins wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:Ghosts Chance wrote:Meeko Fent wrote:I am in support of auto hover on DSs.
I am assuming this is kinda asking for maintaining altitude when not holding down the throttle, combined with deceleration when not pushing the stick forward. it already auto hovers without pressing r2..... dropships naturally maintain their altitude when your level they have a set amount of thrust pointed strait down at all times, its just that we also use this as our primary forward thrust by pointing our nose down. it doesnt decelerate ill give you that, but thats because it functions like an aircraft in that it keeps and carrys its momentum, to correct you simply have to thurst oposite your momentum like a spacecraft would to slow down. Hovering was one of the first skills I learned, it just comes naturally to me now. I can hover quite efficiently in my Myron, but I'm never perfectly stable while flying a python.
it comes with practice :P
i can be perfectly stable in my python with my nose pointed strait down at a forge gunner, its all about canceling out momentum.
your dropship always produces thrust pointed strait down, so just point that trust oposite to your momentum and you can stall out for a few seconds in the oddest positions, it works on every direction except up :P
you shouldnt be in a dead hover for longer then 5 seconds anyways |
Skihids
Bullet Cluster
Legacy Rising
2864
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Posted - 2014.02.18 21:00:00 -
[40] - Quote
NO, NO, NO, a thousand times NO!!
That's the equivalent of walking into a bowling alley and demanding they permanently install bumpers in the gutters. Yes, the kiddies would have fun, but everyone who put some time into learning to bowl would quit in disgust. No challenge, no fun.
Dropship piloting is one of the very few player skill intensive roles in the game. Mastering the advanced maneuvers like Judge's "D" stop and "Twist stop" is intensely rewarding. Being effective because of player skill rather than high SP skills or proto fittings is the best feeling and what keeps pilots flying. It certainly isn't for the WP's or ISK!
Dumbing down the flight mechanics of dropships would transform them from a true role into an infantry accessory like a jeep or a scanner. This game is already AR/Infantry centric, we don't need to eliminate every other role so they can do everything.
DUST and New Eden are supposed to be hard core, that's one major aspect that drew me to the game. Turn it into a kiddie game and I'm gone.
Pilots are one of the proudest bunch you will ever find irl, or in game. I'm both. I've flown real airplanes in loops, spins, and hammer head turns. I've mastered instrument flight and brought my plane down in to a safe landing with a 500 ft ceiling. I want a game role that can replicate those skill demands so I can be proud of my ability. I want to be in demand in my corp as an ace pilot when the maps open up and air superiority really begins to matter. Imagine "Top Gun" where anybody could walk in off the street and do just as well as the hottest ace. Would you bother watching?
We need MORE, not fewer player skill intensive roles. Hit scan and AA mechanics have made some people so soft they expect everything to be super simple. |
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Pvt Numnutz
Black Phoenix Mercenaries
767
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Posted - 2014.02.18 21:03:00 -
[41] - Quote
Ghosts Chance wrote:Dauth Jenkins wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:Ghosts Chance wrote:Meeko Fent wrote:I am in support of auto hover on DSs.
I am assuming this is kinda asking for maintaining altitude when not holding down the throttle, combined with deceleration when not pushing the stick forward. it already auto hovers without pressing r2..... dropships naturally maintain their altitude when your level they have a set amount of thrust pointed strait down at all times, its just that we also use this as our primary forward thrust by pointing our nose down. it doesnt decelerate ill give you that, but thats because it functions like an aircraft in that it keeps and carrys its momentum, to correct you simply have to thurst oposite your momentum like a spacecraft would to slow down. Hovering was one of the first skills I learned, it just comes naturally to me now. I can hover quite efficiently in my Myron, but I'm never perfectly stable while flying a python. it comes with practice :P i can be perfectly stable in my python with my nose pointed strait down at a forge gunner, its all about canceling out momentum. your dropship always produces thrust pointed strait down, so just point that trust oposite to your momentum and you can stall out for a few seconds in the oddest positions, it works on every direction except up :P you shouldnt be in a dead hover for longer then 5 seconds anyways
Yes its all about practice and experience. I can make my python hover perfectly still when I want it to. I wasn't always able to do this, but I have flown enough that I know how, like dust fiend said its basically second nature to me now. Though I have been flying for almost a year now.
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Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
1106
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Posted - 2014.02.18 21:05:00 -
[42] - Quote
Zirzo Valcyn wrote:Ghosts Chance wrote:a great way to learn to fly dropships is to go play kerbal space program
use the knowledge you gain from manuvering in space to improve your overall understanding of the physics invovled in manuvering in space to control your trajectory when your flying around in a dropship :P
also try building a V-TOL then take it to either minmus/mun or Duna (easyest to hardest) wich have lighter gravity then kerbal and you get closer to in game gravity effects on planet in dust.
if you can sucessfully launch a v-tol to duna, land, and return to kerbin you will instantly become a better dropship pilot. oh man i've wanted to play kerbal for ever. unfortunately my better PC is down. how about instead of making the DS easier we focus on making the pilot suit effective.
yah im lucky enough that i can build a decent working computer out of random parts :P
what kind of hardware do you have to work with? becuase im only running an 8 year old dual core motherboard with 8 gigs or ram , an old $100 graphics card i got on clearance and a SSD. ive tweeked it all a little bit but its all pretty old hardware thats fairly cheap nowadays.
i can generally rebuild computers from whatever old parts people have laying around for about 300-400 bucks worth of new parts and they end up compairable in power to the 900-1200 dollar machines you can buy off the shelf.
with a little caution and some create use of google you can rebuild nearly any computer for very little cost and get quite alot of performance out of it.
half the parts in my amchine were traded for my tech servaces so i cheated :P my SSD and my ram were all traded parts so my computer cost me about 120 bucks since i used old scrap computers to fill everything but the graphics card (wich is the part thats hardest to get as scrap) |
Zirzo Valcyn
Kameira Lodge
Amarr Empire
126
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Posted - 2014.02.18 21:31:00 -
[43] - Quote
Ghosts Chance wrote:Zirzo Valcyn wrote:Ghosts Chance wrote:a great way to learn to fly dropships is to go play kerbal space program
use the knowledge you gain from manuvering in space to improve your overall understanding of the physics invovled in manuvering in space to control your trajectory when your flying around in a dropship :P
also try building a V-TOL then take it to either minmus/mun or Duna (easyest to hardest) wich have lighter gravity then kerbal and you get closer to in game gravity effects on planet in dust.
if you can sucessfully launch a v-tol to duna, land, and return to kerbin you will instantly become a better dropship pilot. oh man i've wanted to play kerbal for ever. unfortunately my better PC is down. how about instead of making the DS easier we focus on making the pilot suit effective. yah im lucky enough that i can build a decent working computer out of random parts :P what kind of hardware do you have to work with? becuase im only running an 8 year old dual core motherboard with 8 gigs or ram , an old $100 graphics card i got on clearance and a SSD. ive tweeked it all a little bit but its all pretty old hardware thats fairly cheap nowadays. i can generally rebuild computers from whatever old parts people have laying around for about 300-400 bucks worth of new parts and they end up compairable in power to the 900-1200 dollar machines you can buy off the shelf. with a little caution and some create use of google you can rebuild nearly any computer for very little cost and get quite alot of performance out of it. half the parts in my amchine were traded for my tech servaces so i cheated :P my SSD and my ram were all traded parts so my computer cost me about 120 bucks since i used old scrap computers to fill everything but the graphics card (wich is the part thats hardest to get as scrap)
i had a dell xps 8100 but the motherboard fried. i kinda suspect it was from this one build in EVE the carbon engine was rumored to be frying machines and mine crashed around this time. i should really look into what you said , at the time around 2011 it was around $350 to fix but that was with labor. it was some kinda big deal to order that kinda motherboard back then. i keep coming back to dust because i'm hooked on the current flight but would rather be playing PC more especially planetside, kebal and world war II online.
u can ban the troll out of the forums but u can't ban the forums out of the troll.
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Ranger SnakeBlood
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
300
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Posted - 2014.02.18 21:33:00 -
[44] - Quote
Why do they think dropships are hard to fly in this game its easy enough after you figure out what each stick and shoulder button does away you go simple, then again this could just be me its much harder to fly in say Battlefield or if you really like torture Arma series now thats fun to fly in even flying from point A to B can go really wrong in a hurry its actually funny.
Either way i do like warhawk it was a good game back in the day also i notice you had fly by wire or what ever it was called in warhawk. The white thing is called chaff its a counter measure for ordinance that uses laser guided lock on to track a target so it can break the lock of a missile that is chasing you it would be nice to have something like this in dust chaff, flares so on but how to resupply it wouldnt make sense for them to be hovering in the air like in wh in battlefield flare regen over time which also makes no sense perhaps supply depots or some nano hive variant could resupply them this of course would require the pilot to do a trip home to resupply this method would make sense.
It would not hurt the dropship to be a little more like the dropship in warhawk big targets with a slow moving gunship mode and point defence turrets that passengers can make use of for AA, also the broadside guns on those things are awsome it actually a good way of doing it as it has to chose weather to be attack or run away mode and because its a broadside its more exposed while in attack (bigger target). one thing that could prove a issue is how quickly you can go from attack to run away perhaps if there is a set amount of time that you were in attack mode basicly power to the guns before you can switch to power to engines to stop people from being able to being able to run away before something can break its tank simular to how bastion or seige mods work in eve only this things engines aint cut completely. |
I-Shayz-I
I-----I
2354
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Posted - 2014.02.18 21:44:00 -
[45] - Quote
Oh geez.
I forgot to mention about a possible "hover mode" instead of just changing controls.
I don't want to completely change the dropships to the warhawk dropships if it wasn't a good idea, but having some sort of mode that completely leveled out your dropship and stablized thing when you got close to the ground or needing to move quickly and manuverably through small tight gaps.
This would be similar to the hover/flight mode of the warhawks themselves.
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Ranger SnakeBlood
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
300
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Posted - 2014.02.18 22:06:00 -
[46] - Quote
I-Shayz-I wrote:Oh geez.
I forgot to mention about a possible "hover mode" instead of just changing controls.
I don't want to completely change the dropships to the warhawk dropships if it wasn't a good idea, but having some sort of mode that completely leveled out your dropship and stablized thing when you got close to the ground or needing to move quickly and manuverably through small tight gaps.
This would be similar to the hover/flight mode of the warhawks themselves.
Technically the dropships are already in hover mode when the main rear thrusters are pointed down or even at a angle, it is already hovering its just not limited so you cant over do it and loose altitude same thing happens with choppers to move foward it had to lean forward if you lean foward too much your going to ram the ground as you dont have sufficient momentum to keep the angle.
One thing that could be limited to make them easier to hover is to add a max limiter to all manner of pitch role and yaw basicly cant put the ship into a situation where its going to going to loose altitude this would come at a cost of not being able to be as fast and as manoeuvrable as someone using the raw out put of the ship and their own knowledge of flight to fly however if they make a mistake they can loose controle and ram into the ground if this was implemented in current dropships i have a funny feeling they would be slow as hell. |
Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
1107
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Posted - 2014.02.18 22:38:00 -
[47] - Quote
Zirzo Valcyn wrote:Ghosts Chance wrote:Zirzo Valcyn wrote:Ghosts Chance wrote:a great way to learn to fly dropships is to go play kerbal space program
use the knowledge you gain from manuvering in space to improve your overall understanding of the physics invovled in manuvering in space to control your trajectory when your flying around in a dropship :P
also try building a V-TOL then take it to either minmus/mun or Duna (easyest to hardest) wich have lighter gravity then kerbal and you get closer to in game gravity effects on planet in dust.
if you can sucessfully launch a v-tol to duna, land, and return to kerbin you will instantly become a better dropship pilot. oh man i've wanted to play kerbal for ever. unfortunately my better PC is down. how about instead of making the DS easier we focus on making the pilot suit effective. yah im lucky enough that i can build a decent working computer out of random parts :P what kind of hardware do you have to work with? becuase im only running an 8 year old dual core motherboard with 8 gigs or ram , an old $100 graphics card i got on clearance and a SSD. ive tweeked it all a little bit but its all pretty old hardware thats fairly cheap nowadays. i can generally rebuild computers from whatever old parts people have laying around for about 300-400 bucks worth of new parts and they end up compairable in power to the 900-1200 dollar machines you can buy off the shelf. with a little caution and some create use of google you can rebuild nearly any computer for very little cost and get quite alot of performance out of it. half the parts in my amchine were traded for my tech servaces so i cheated :P my SSD and my ram were all traded parts so my computer cost me about 120 bucks since i used old scrap computers to fill everything but the graphics card (wich is the part thats hardest to get as scrap) i had a dell xps 8100 but the motherboard fried. i kinda suspect it was from this one build in EVE the carbon engine was rumored to be frying machines and mine crashed around this time. i should really look into what you said , at the time around 2011 it was around $350 to fix but that was with labor. it was some kinda big deal to order that kinda motherboard back then. i keep coming back to dust because i'm hooked on the current flight but would rather be playing PC more especially planetside, kebal and world war II online.
it fried because its a dell :P they use parts that havnt passed quality control from the main production lines from high end motherboards but are still good enough quality to be used, they just rebrand the board and buy in huge bulk anything that falls below a certain quality level.
my board was from an old custom build machine a small time computer parts store was using for a floor model, i picked it and its original hardware up for about 250 bucks way back in the day , you can get really good starter machines that way.
basically avoid anything thats store branded or is MDG or Dell (and by association alienware)
buying parts is cheaper then paying someone else, as labor is a good 60% of the cost.
the exact same thing happened to my roomate and i fixed her machine for $150 with BETTER parts, so that it would essentially be an invulintary upgrade and i only charged her a $50 set of ram :P
find someone who builds PCs as a hobby and bribe them with new parts for cheap computer maintainance :P
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Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
6812
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Posted - 2014.02.18 23:04:00 -
[48] - Quote
I absolutely love Warhawk, but something to keep in mind with their dropship is that it is the heaviest vehicle in the game. It has far more hit points than even the tanks. Therefore it's flight mechanics were appropriate. If you use those flight mechanics for a dropship in Dust you're essentially removing all it's maneuverability and it will die instantly.
That said, I've absolutely love for the heavy aircraft to be very close to the design of Warhawk's dropship.
And Aero said unto his children, "LET THERE BE A REGISTRY"
CPM Info and Q&A -Status: Open
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