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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
970
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Posted - 2014.02.09 03:43:00 -
[1] - Quote
then balance acordingly
if you really want logis to support players instead of killing then this is the only way.
how can any assault expect logis to give up tank and damage while they cling onto their equipment slots supplying themselves.
that or remove the grenade slot and make grenades equipment. if logis should have to choose between tank or damage then so should combat classes when it comes to damage or self support
also make swarms equipment
I will logi the s* out of you
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=99075&find
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
970
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Posted - 2014.02.09 03:57:00 -
[2] - Quote
General12912 wrote: so you really think the inability to use grenades is going to stop killer bees? i highly doubt it.
i said ballance accordingly so whatever ccp decides to tip the balance. and the grenade thing i meant for everyone. so for an assault thats either carry grenades or carry a hive etc
General12912 wrote: the killer bees take time to increase damage of their gun, they really wouldnt care about grenades.
no because if balanced properly logis wouldn't need or be able to fit so much damage at least not compared with assaults. instead they get to live longer because the combat troops will protect them to keep equipment flowing to the front line.
General12912 wrote: and how is a logi going to support without equipment?
logis will have equipment?
I will logi the s* out of you
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
970
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Posted - 2014.02.09 04:09:00 -
[3] - Quote
General12912 wrote:ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:General12912 wrote: and how is a logi going to support without equipment?
logis will have equipment? understood all but this part... unless u were mocking me in some way. reword that in a less sarcastic tone please so i may understand what you are attempting to say.
you said logis won't be able to support without equipment... i said logis will have equipment. why would you think logis would not have equipment when thats the whole point of the thread, leaving equipment to support roles like logis and scouts and rebalancing suits to compensate
I will logi the s* out of you
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
972
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Posted - 2014.02.09 05:03:00 -
[4] - Quote
gone past this now.. move onto a better idea that lets assaults want to give up their equipment volenterily to fit more tank or dps while letting logis do the reverse
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=141169&find=unread
they can both potentially meet balanced to a degree in the middle but they can only excell in 1 direction. logis would excell at equipment and assaults at dps/utility
I will logi the s* out of you
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
983
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Posted - 2014.02.12 17:24:00 -
[5] - Quote
Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote:ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:then balance acordingly
if you really want logis to support players instead of killing then this is the only way.
how can any assault expect logis to give up tank and damage while they cling onto their equipment slots supplying themselves.
that or remove the grenade slot and make grenades equipment. if logis should have to choose between tank or damage then so should combat classes when it comes to damage or self support
also make swarms equipment Command suit need that equipment slot for future command specific module(that will give bonuses to squad, same as in EVE).
there is no command suit in dust
I will logi the s* out of you
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
983
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Posted - 2014.02.12 17:42:00 -
[6] - Quote
Varjac Theobroma Montenegro wrote:Shadow Archeus wrote:Do you realize that would gimp every other suit in the game except the basic heavies and sentinals
Removing slots from all other suits will make EVERYONE run logi Or play with a squad that has one and invest in a mic...
this...
you cant have the best of both worlds and expect logis not too. the new changes to suits will require logis to work with a squad but they wont require combat troops to work with a logi. only when they remove the equipment slot or do something very different as i have suggested in other threads can balance be obtained and a better overall combat experience for everyone
I will logi the s* out of you
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
984
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Posted - 2014.02.12 18:06:00 -
[7] - Quote
i went on strike a few weeks back as a logi. i removed all my equipment that could help anyone even myself. my ammo lasted a very long time and when it ran out i had to go look for it or choose who/when to shoot at someone to conserve ammo. its was a lot of fun. this whole supplying yourself thing is just game breaking in my eyes. its a battlefield. ammo doesn't grow on tree's. it is carried or brought to you not instantly created for you at will
I will logi the s* out of you
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
986
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Posted - 2014.02.12 18:14:00 -
[8] - Quote
Tallen Ellecon wrote:Removing sidearms didn't phase killer bees, why do you think removing grenades would too, you're just making logi's combat ineffective, not assaults more combat effective.
The problem is the high number of slots and high CPU/PG let them fit better modules and skip equipment all together, instead of using that extra CPU/PG to fit better equipment. An assault can still carry traige nanohives why would taking that away from them make a logi any less appealing? Take away logi hi's and low's, give the assaults a fitting boost (1.8 assault weapon bonus) and you'll see more balance.
another person who skipped the first sentence. balance accordingly.
the suggestion i made regarding grenades was to remove logi ability from assaults or keep the logi ability but loose the grenade. add this to a logi and they lose an equipment slot to gain a grenade. more damage = less equipment for everyone
like i said in the first sentence balance accordingly so thats a cpu/pg reduction for logis and a probably a cpu/pg buff for assaults etc.
with balance assaults could get a grenade bonus while a logi keeps the equipment bonus.
I will logi the s* out of you
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
987
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Posted - 2014.02.12 18:33:00 -
[9] - Quote
Varjac Theobroma Montenegro wrote:ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:i went on strike a few weeks back as a logi. i removed all my equipment that could help anyone even myself. my ammo lasted a very long time and when it ran out i had to go look for it or choose who/when to shoot at someone to conserve ammo. its was a lot of fun. this whole supplying yourself thing is just game breaking in my eyes. its a battlefield. ammo doesn't grow on tree's. it is carried or brought to you not instantly created for you at will Well, what about snipers? Hives are nearly integral to certain operations...
scout suit..see title name
I will logi the s* out of you
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
990
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Posted - 2014.02.12 20:09:00 -
[10] - Quote
Boot Booter wrote:
I am sorry but I disagree with this. The point of running a logi class is that you are support. You literally enhance players around you. The reason for running an assault is not just slaying but being versatile; able to defend and attack. Without equipment assault becomes just about slaying enemies. With updates to logi bonuses combined with higher ttk I think the interaction of the two classes will change drastically.
Currently dust is about who has the highest eHP and DPS. Obviously there was an issue with logis and that's why their bonuses are being directed towards their intended role. For assualts though, again it's all about eHP and DPS. With ttk being increased it should become more about a balance of eHP, dps, and suit regen. In the new build ammo will run out quicker people will need more healing etc. An unsupported assault will be a dead assault. Removing equipment from assaults will do nothing but make them completely dependent on a logi. Instead what I think we want to happen (assuming only assault and logis exist in this simple conceptual scenario) is that an assault plus logi > assault plus assault and/or logi plus logi. But also logi plus logi = assault plus assault. Without equipment assaults would need to suffer greatly in eHP or dps in order to maintain suit regen not to mention be constantly running to a supply depot.
Tl;dr let's see how the new ttk and suit bonuses pan out. They may be better than you think. I think removing equipment from assault would greatly UP them.
Sorry if this didn't make any sense kinda was distracted.
if the point of a logi is support then the point of an assault is to kill. logi supports assaults and assaults support logis. logis are or will be completely dependant on assault support and protection in 1.8 (im not talking about assault logis, i mean actual support logi's). how is it fair for assaults not to be dependant on logis but logis dependant on their protection.
I will logi the s* out of you
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=99075&find
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
997
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Posted - 2014.02.13 17:04:00 -
[11] - Quote
killertojo42 wrote:ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:General12912 wrote:ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:General12912 wrote: and how is a logi going to support without equipment?
logis will have equipment? understood all but this part... unless u were mocking me in some way. reword that in a less sarcastic tone please so i may understand what you are attempting to say. you said logis won't be able to support without equipment... i said logis will have equipment. why would you think logis would not have equipment when thats the whole point of the thread, leaving equipment to support roles like logis and scouts and rebalancing suits to compensate and there is nothing in the slightest sarcasting in that Seriously making equipment scout specific over assault, too many people think scouts deserve much more than they do, scouts are high speed and rapid combat, not sustained warfare and I'd say your argument had some validity if you just said only logis should be aloud to carry equipment, just so you know i run only caldari assault suits
i suggested not scouts because of better supply chain than just simple spam.
example: we have a logi repairing squad 1, squad 2 is in desperate need of ammo but the logi is too busy and if he wasnt he is too far to get there on time. so he sends a runner instead (a scout fit for ammo supply to wherever its needed). he runs over and drops a hive in seconds where it would have taken the heavy logi 10 times longer if his slow ass wasn't killed before he can get their. someone suggested snipers would have no ammo. call for a supply runner.
im talking better team play here, people needing people needing people needing the first guy and the chain continues. at the moment we are just a ridiculous mass of individuals doing our own thing in a blob carrying our own stuff when other suits are designed to do it for us. im not talking balancing individuals but balancing everyone together for a better allround battle
I will logi the s* out of you
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
997
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Posted - 2014.02.13 17:12:00 -
[12] - Quote
Ku Shala wrote:would much rather equipment be able to go into the grenade. equipment instead of a grenade then you could remove equipment from the assault, heavies could carry 1 equip if they wanted ,scouts would only need 1 equipment slot and logis could be more effective if they didnt want to use a grenade or wanted to use a more tactical explosive like proxies or remotes
that sort of takes it in the opposite direction and makes everyone more independant which is worse
I will logi the s* out of you
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
997
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Posted - 2014.02.13 17:32:00 -
[13] - Quote
Ku Shala wrote:scout will never be suppy thats the caldari logi role
like a scout will never be uplink dropper or scanner user. that logic is flawed. i just gave ammo as an example. scouts need equip as part of their role. 1 for cloak and 1 for uplinks afteral what's the point of sneaking into enemy territory if it doesn't have a purpose of getting teammates into the battle. or as i suggested they could run supplies to friendlies when infiltrating isn't needed
I will logi the s* out of you
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ADAM-OF-EVE
Dead Man's Game
998
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Posted - 2014.02.13 18:52:00 -
[14] - Quote
Justin Tymes wrote:0-Heavy 1-Assault 2-Scout 3/4-Logi
The formula is already fine as it is. While CCP should promote suits to a role, they shouldn't restrict suits to that role. This idea is as bad as Logis defending themselves with Flaylocks.
if all was fine there wouldn't be so much spam or people supplying themselves. its typical assaults would react like this. thinking logis should not be able to fight but think supplying themselves is ok.
I will logi the s* out of you
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