DUST Search - Maximum WP cap per battle.

TYCHUS MAXWELL wrote:

I think this is more an issue of logistics getting absurd wp bonuses then needing a cap. If WP rewards for logis were curtailed to be more like dropship points and equipment destruction, things would be better. One guy reloading his gun once on a nanohive shouldn't give twice as much WP as said nanohive being destroyed.

If:
Triage: 10
Guardian: 5
Spawn link: 10
Resupply: 5

Logis wouldn't have such broken WP gain.

You might say what do you care? I care because I don't want to be taking objectives and killing redberries only to lose 50k-100k isk on my pay out because some logi on my team equipment spammed to get a huge piece of the isk pie on our team. Payouts are based on the teamplayers contribution to the team as a whole, which the game bases on WPs only. Those newberries dying and spawning to die again on your uplinks while pew pew eating armor and ammo resupplies isn't helping the team.

I know logis will probably go "Well see if we logi you!" Having half your team logi when they have no killing power is pretty much a quick way to lose and I would show logis to the door next to the snipers if they won't logi without broken WP gains. Logi slayers don't count, but logi slayers usually aren't all that good on the logi part.

We don't need a lot of logis or snipers, that's why I am an advocate of multiple role capability over specialize in one thing until you have 15 mil into it build which is suggested by everyone under the sun because its easier for vets to deal with players who are cookie cutter builds. This is why blueberries are considered "useless", because you only need so many auxiliary roles which tend to be in abundance on the field when people can't swap roles.

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Heavenly Daughter the Aurum Grinder and Company 320	Posted - 2014.02.06 00:37:00 - [1] - Quote Discuss... would this stop corps from abusing a broken system. One game i was in tonight the top ten opposition had an average of almost 2000 WP each, 2 corps. I don't think CCP intended a squad to be able to earn so many WP, almost 10K each. Game was Dom. So should there be in place a mechanism to limiting the abusive corps from obtain huge WP. The Organ Grinder & Co. EVE Heavenly Daughter-Merc Records
Kigurosaka Laaksonen DUST University Ivy League 247	Posted - 2014.02.06 00:40:00 - [2] - Quote AFAIK, this already exists in some form. DUST 514 Recruit Code - https://dust514.com/recruit/zluCyb/ EVE Buddy Invite - Too damn long. Ask me for it.
Heavenly Daughter the Aurum Grinder and Company 320	Posted - 2014.02.06 00:42:00 - [3] - Quote Kigurosaka Laaksonen wrote: AFAIK, this already exists in some form. What does. ? If you mean a WP cap, I don't think there is. The Organ Grinder & Co. EVE Heavenly Daughter-Merc Records
Kigurosaka Laaksonen DUST University Ivy League 247	Posted - 2014.02.06 00:46:00 - [4] - Quote SOURCE DUST 514 Recruit Code - https://dust514.com/recruit/zluCyb/ EVE Buddy Invite - Too damn long. Ask me for it.
Meee One The dyst0pian Corporation Zero-Day 300	Posted - 2014.02.06 00:50:00 - [5] - Quote Heavenly Daughter wrote: Discuss... would this stop corps from abusing a broken system? would meee one become my man? One game i was in tonight the top ten opposition had an average of almost 2000 WP each, 2 corps. I don't think CCP intended a squad to be able to earn so many WP, almost 10K each. Game was Dom. So should there be in place a mechanism to limiting the abusive corps from obtain huge WP. Something similar to capping the repair to for instance. Lolno,there have been times where i've been the only logi on my team and i've broken 4k wp for it...while everyone else barely scraped together 1.2k. Limiting WP would make some logis go "well i've capped,may as well stop trying so hard" which would make the whole team suffer. I personally feel i should keep being rewarded for as long as i put in the effort for it. -1 For WP cap And sure i would. Sexy jutsu Time to jaaam!
Abe Foster BlackWater Liquidations INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS 32	Posted - 2014.02.06 00:53:00 - [6] - Quote I know that the game will prevent you from farming off of a dude that keeps on dying so you can keep on reviving and healing him. "These are not the mercenaries you are looking for. Turn around and walk away. We can both pretend this never happened."
Heavenly Daughter the Aurum Grinder and Company 320	Posted - 2014.02.06 00:59:00 - [7] - Quote Kigurosaka Laaksonen wrote: SOURCE Ok, WP limit per minute is ok, but when you get 10 players earning nigh 20WP in 2 squads, there is something fishy going on, get my drift. ? Personally I think it way to high for a pub game and exactly the think CCP was trying to stop in your source tag. The Organ Grinder & Co. EVE Heavenly Daughter-Merc Records
Heavenly Daughter the Aurum Grinder and Company 320	Posted - 2014.02.06 01:02:00 - [8] - Quote Meee One wrote: Heavenly Daughter wrote: Discuss... would this stop corps from abusing a broken system? would meee one become my man? One game i was in tonight the top ten opposition had an average of almost 2000 WP each, 2 corps. I don't think CCP intended a squad to be able to earn so many WP, almost 10K each. Game was Dom. So should there be in place a mechanism to limiting the abusive corps from obtain huge WP. Something similar to capping the repair to for instance. Lolno,there have been times where i've been the only logi on my team and i've broken 4k wp for it...while everyone else barely scraped together 1.2k. Limiting WP would make some logis go "well i've capped,may as well stop trying so hard" which would make the whole team suffer. I personally feel i should keep being rewarded for as long as i put in the effort for it. -1 For WP cap And sure i would. I think you missed the point, you even say it yourself , all the rest struggle to get XXX, while 10 managed it in this game. not 1 like you did. The Organ Grinder & Co. EVE Heavenly Daughter-Merc Records
TYCHUS MAXWELL Ghosts of Dawn General Tso's Alliance 5	Posted - 2014.02.06 02:11:00 - [9] - Quote I think this is more an issue of logistics getting absurd wp bonuses then needing a cap. If WP rewards for logis were curtailed to be more like dropship points and equipment destruction. One guy reloading his gun once on a nanohive shouldn't give twice as much exp as said nanohive being destroyed. If: Triage: 10 Guardian: 5 Spawn link: 10 Resupply: 5 Logis wouldn't have such broken WP gain. You might say what do you care? I care because I don't want to be taking objectives and killing guys only to lose 50k-100k isk on my pay out because some logi on my team equipment spammed to get a huge piece of the isk pie on our team. Payouts are based on the teamplayers contribution to the team as a whole, which the game bases on WPs only. Those newberries dying and spawning to die again on your uplinks while pew pew eating armor and ammo resupplies isn't helping the team. I know logis will probably go "Well see if we logi you!" Having half your team logi when they have no killing power is pretty much a quick way to lose and I would show logis to the door next to the snipers if they won't logi without broken WP gains. Logi slayers don't count, but logi slayers usually aren't all that good on the logi part. We don't need a lot of logis or snipers, that's why I am an advocate of multiple role capability over specialize in one thing until you have 15 mil into it build which is suggested by everyone under the sun because its easier for vets to deal with players who are cookie cutter builds. This is why blueberries are considered "useless", because you only need so many auxiliary roles which tend to be in abundance on the field when people can't swap roles.
abarkrishna WarRavens 290	Posted - 2014.02.06 03:18:00 - [10] - Quote The root of the problem is that it is far easier for logis to get a ton of Wp because most actions that reward WP are equipment based. I would hardly call it exploitation and I certainly think the game could use more orbitals. Not gunna lie I am tired of being the only squad getting orbitals in games. That being said they already have caps set in place to avoid exploitations of the sort you are talking about. Such as limits to how many Wp you receive while healing, or resupplying. Generally speaking from my experience games with lots of Wp are far more active and have a lot more casualties for both sides. Personally I prefer that to often redlines like we currently have extremely often. It would also help new guys because they would be able to get orbitals making the game more fun for them as well. So they have caps in place but there still seems to be some exploitation. Now we must ask is it an exploit, or is it a disparity between roles. To those on the ****** end of the stick it will certainly seem like exploitation and I can understand why. It is not fair that someone should make 3 times the Wp and isk just because of a broken mechanic. This is also why there has been so much logi hate for the last while. More often than not I see people suggesting lowering Wp gain for Logis but that leaves a big problem. The problem being with a lower reward compared to the risk of a logi people will stop using logis. As it stands tanks have almost ruined risk/reward in the game. For example it is much cheaper to run a militia tank than a proto logi suit. I sometimes run a madruger with advanced fittings,as well as guns. It costs me 175 000 One proto suit costs over 210 000. Why should I run a logi when I can sit in a tank and lose half the isk. Why should anyone? But back to my point, What we have is terrible risk/reward coupled with skewed Wp gain. What do we do? I feel the answer is simple. What I propose is that we as a community come up with a list of ways to reward WP without the use of equipment therefore balancing WP accrual more evenly for all classes. For example savior points, revenge points, double kills, There are so many options for non equipment based Wp rewards. I strongly encourage people to post any suggestions to my previously posted thread about the very subject. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1549690#post1549690 No you kill this blueberry hacking the CRU we are camping. I already killed the last 2. When will they learn!

TYCHUS MAXWELL Ghosts of Dawn General Tso's Alliance 5	Posted - 2014.02.06 03:54:00 - [11] - Quote I'll agree with you when I see slayers who are wrecking the enemy team with 30/0 get more points then a logi equipment spamming and going 0/6. Yes they have caps, but tanks also can be damaged by AV! This doesn't mean tanks are balanced because they can take damage. Likewise, this doesn't mean logi WP gain is balanced just because they placed an arbitrary speed cap to make sure logis don't instead go 10000-12000 WP a match.
abarkrishna WarRavens 290	Posted - 2014.02.06 04:08:00 - [12] - Quote You mean to tell me you do not think it is a good idea to add in more non equipment based Wp rewards? I suggest you read what I wrote again and maybe get some help understanding it because clearly you did not get it the first time No you kill this blueberry hacking the CRU we are camping. I already killed the last 2. When will they learn!
Twelve Guage Death Firm. Canis Eliminatus Operatives 53	Posted - 2014.02.06 04:46:00 - [13] - Quote I'm looking at this thread topic and thinking to myself wow just wow I'm really loving how this is solely being blamed on the logistics class. It is as if people have completely forgotten that other suits like assault and scout class can use +¬quipement to and I don't mean just active scanner. Ten people getting 2000 war points each is rare in a single match. It sounds to me like and don't freak out here cuz I know this is going to blow some people's minds but it sounds like maybe just maybe the squads in question may have actually balanced out their equipment before going into the match so that the logi's were not the only ones getting ponits. I personally love seeing good balance squads on the field and think people need to stop trying to find everything they can to nerf the logistics class. Death Firm recruiter and sandwiches maker.
Meee One The dyst0pian Corporation Zero-Day 306	Posted - 2014.02.06 05:57:00 - [14] - Quote Twelve Guage wrote: I'm looking at this thread topic and thinking to myself wow just wow I'm really loving how this is solely being blamed on the logistics class. It is as if people have completely forgotten that other suits like assault and scout class can use +¬quipement to and I don't mean just active scanner. Ten people getting 2000 war points each is rare in a single match. It sounds to me like and don't freak out here cuz I know this is going to blow some people's minds but it sounds like maybe just maybe the squads in question may have actually balanced out their equipment before going into the match so that the logi's were not the only ones getting ponits. I personally love seeing good balance squads on the field and think people need to stop trying to find everything they can to nerf the logistics class. It's jealousy pure and simple. Support is a very valuable role and gets rewarded as such. Sexy jutsu Time to jaaam!
KalOfTheRathi Nec Tributis 952	Posted - 2014.02.06 11:56:00 - [15] - Quote I have seen several earning over 2kWP in public skirmishes. I know the Mercs involved and they were hacking and killing. No logistics going on. Just a standard, everyday murder spree. Like Mercs were meant to be. Tankers and their gunners can do it as well, given the right conditions. Just like many Mercs can break 2K WP, given the right conditions. WP in excess of 1500 WP is possible without it being a logistics only affair. So lighten up on the Logis. Now, what would limiting the WP accomplish? Nothing. WP is only one input to SP. Don't forget that SP is capped per week and limited to 1k SP per battle after that. Get 5kWP and make ... 1k SP. Same old, same old. If you personally care about getting beat in WP than step it up. If you cannot do that then ask CCP for help. You already know the answer Kittens, HTFU. And so it goes. And so it goes.
Mad Syringe Black Phoenix Mercenaries Legacy Rising 67	Posted - 2014.02.06 12:45:00 - [16] - Quote I don't get it guys, Is it so important for you to be top of the board? The warpoint board is important for the payout after the game. The equipment we drop is quite expensive. If we do not get compensation for this it is not viable. Recently I dropped most of my equipment and went with heavy or scout fits. Guess what, we lost more matches because there where no friggin uplinks anywhere. All those assaults who bring a compact hive at most, got stomped by crews with good logistics support... Guess what, I'm back to putting down equipment because I'm tired of running through the hills instead of spawning near the objective. I'm really tired of the selfish assault divas, who think they need to be top of all stats just because they are the better killers. Some of you don't even get that you survived the last fight because a logi had his rep tool on you. There are logis who suicide a perfectly good clone, just to get more supplies to you ASSaults, and the best thing you have to say, is nerf logis? Well you're selfish crybabies, who deserve to be stomped by players who consider logis to be a valuable asset. cheers Mad
Fizzer94 L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 1926	Posted - 2014.02.06 13:17:00 - [17] - Quote TYCHUS MAXWELL wrote: I think this is more an issue of logistics getting absurd wp bonuses then needing a cap. If WP rewards for logis were curtailed to be more like dropship points and equipment destruction, things would be better. One guy reloading his gun once on a nanohive shouldn't give twice as much WP as said nanohive being destroyed. If: Triage: 10 Guardian: 5 Spawn link: 10 Resupply: 5 Logis wouldn't have such broken WP gain. You might say what do you care? I care because I don't want to be taking objectives and killing redberries only to lose 50k-100k isk on my pay out because some logi on my team equipment spammed to get a huge piece of the isk pie on our team. Payouts are based on the teamplayers contribution to the team as a whole, which the game bases on WPs only. Those newberries dying and spawning to die again on your uplinks while pew pew eating armor and ammo resupplies isn't helping the team. I know logis will probably go "Well see if we logi you!" Having half your team logi when they have no killing power is pretty much a quick way to lose and I would show logis to the door next to the snipers if they won't logi without broken WP gains. Logi slayers don't count, but logi slayers usually aren't all that good on the logi part. We don't need a lot of logis or snipers, that's why I am an advocate of multiple role capability over specialize in one thing until you have 15 mil into it build which is suggested by everyone under the sun because its easier for vets to deal with players who are cookie cutter builds. This is why blueberries are considered "useless", because you only need so many auxiliary roles which tend to be in abundance on the field when people can't swap roles. Logistics fittings are more expensive than other suits by a wide margin. They pay more money, they get more WP to earn that money back, this is only sensible. Equipment prices are actually getting increased in 1.8 as well. A Prototype Equipment will run somewhere between 25-35K ISK. You are just another 'salt player mad that their kills didn't place them at the #1 spot. This isn't a slayer based game. Its a team based game, whoever pitches in the most and provides the most to the team here rewarded the most. Yours Truly, Reginald Fizzer94 Delafontaine III, Esquire MAG ~ Seryi Volk Executive Response
Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL Top Men. 788	Posted - 2014.02.06 13:25:00 - [18] - Quote "Abusive" corps earning more than 2k per each squad member? Really? Teamwork is OP. Always has been and always will be. There is no "abuse" going on here. CCP just skews the game so that teamwork is rewarded with WP. If you have a problem with that, then what you should be petitioning for is a removal of WP for intel assists, kill assists, triage, nanohives, guardian points, uplinks, etc. Basically all the ways to earn WP other than directly killing your enemy.


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