DUST Search - I still think Shields are better than armor

Jackof All-Trades wrote:

DeadlyAztec11 wrote:

Jackof All-Trades wrote:

DeadlyAztec11 wrote:

I simply believe that the speed penalty of armor plates negates their extra HP benefit. If I get caught out of cover with shields I can usually jump and either use evasive tactics to dodge attacks and fight or jump to cover. In an armor centered suit I usually find that I become severely slow and an easier to track target.

It's true that point for point armor centered suits tend to have more HP. Though in real applications, shield tankers tend to have an advantage. I don't even run plates on my heavy anymore, cardiac regulators are far more valuable.

They also take an eternity to refill, which means that if you barely survived one fight, you will not survive the next.

I do not mean shields are too good at what they do. No, I mean to say that the belief that Shields are underpowered is unfounded, at least at complex level. I do believe that basic modules should be 33 instead of 22 and advanced should be 44 instead of 33.

Shield are great. It's just sad that most people would stack plates along side them too.

Why is this wrong?

I use a basic reactive plate because it has no speed penalty and gives both armor in addition to armor repair.

EVE mentality. Dual tanking is the crowning moment of fail there. It just seems so fundamentally wrong.

But that's just me.

2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter mlt frame, Templar set

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DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 3826	Posted - 2014.02.02 05:43:00 - [1] - Quote I simply believe that the speed penalty of armor plates negates their extra HP benefit. If I get caught out of cover with shields I can usually jump and either use evasive tactics to dodge attacks and fight or jump to cover. In an armor centered suit I usually find that I become severely slow and an easier to track target. It's true that point for point armor centered suits tend to have more HP. Though in real applications, shield tankers tend to have an advantage. I don't even run plates on my heavy anymore, cardiac regulators are far more valuable. They also take an eternity to refill, which means that if you barely survived one fight, you will not survive the next. I do not mean shields are too good at what they do. No, I mean to say that the belief that Shields are underpowered is unfounded, at least at complex level. I do believe that basic modules should be 33 instead of 22 and advanced should be 44 instead of 33. My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Anarchide, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior
TheAmazing FlyingPig Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 5609	Posted - 2014.02.02 05:55:00 - [2] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I simply believe that the speed penalty of armor plates negates their extra HP benefit. If I get caught out of cover with shields I can usually jump and either use evasive tactics to dodge attacks and fight or jump to cover. In an armor centered suit I usually find that I become severely slow and an easier to track target. It's true that point for point armor centered suits tend to have more HP. Though in real applications, shield tankers tend to have an advantage. I don't even run plates on my heavy anymore, cardiac regulators are far more valuable. They also take an eternity to refill, which means that if you barely survived one fight, you will not survive the next. I do not mean shields are too good at what they do. No, I mean to say that the belief that Shields are underpowered is unfounded, at least at complex level. I do believe that basic modules should be 33 instead of 22 and advanced should be 44 instead of 33. Hears the "BUFF MAI SHIYELDZ" mob coming towards the thread and searches for cover Can't get to cover fast enough because armor Never forget May 14, 2013: Beta 2.0
Logi Bro Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 2783	Posted - 2014.02.02 06:01:00 - [3] - Quote Your speed to take to cover is irrelevant when militia forge guns one shot you from no-where land with no warning. Or railguns Or glitched invisible remote explosives Or Core Locus Grenades Or .5s of sustained fire from an RR Or .5s of sustained fire from an ACR Or .5s of sustained fire from an AScR Or basically anything, with the exception of plasma cannons, because lolPlCs. You may notice that I don't hold speed to a very high standard when TTK is so pathetically low. Shield Recommendations
Th3rdSun L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 573	Posted - 2014.02.02 06:01:00 - [4] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I simply believe that the speed penalty of armor plates negates their extra HP benefit. If I get caught out of cover with shields I can usually jump and either use evasive tactics to dodge attacks and fight or jump to cover. In an armor centered suit I usually find that I become severely slow and an easier to track target. It's true that point for point armor centered suits tend to have more HP. Though in real applications, shield tankers tend to have an advantage. I don't even run plates on my heavy anymore, cardiac regulators are far more valuable. They also take an eternity to refill, which means that if you barely survived one fight, you will not survive the next. I do not mean shields are too good at what they do. No, I mean to say that the belief that Shields are underpowered is unfounded, at least at complex level. I do believe that basic modules should be 33 instead of 22 and advanced should be 44 instead of 33. If you ran primarily Caldari assault,you wouldn't have made this thread. EVERYTHING in this game eats shields for breakfast.
KIRSTY j The Walking Targets 46	Posted - 2014.02.02 06:06:00 - [5] - Quote Th3rdSun wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I simply believe that the speed penalty of armor plates negates their extra HP benefit. If I get caught out of cover with shields I can usually jump and either use evasive tactics to dodge attacks and fight or jump to cover. In an armor centered suit I usually find that I become severely slow and an easier to track target. It's true that point for point armor centered suits tend to have more HP. Though in real applications, shield tankers tend to have an advantage. I don't even run plates on my heavy anymore, cardiac regulators are far more valuable. They also take an eternity to refill, which means that if you barely survived one fight, you will not survive the next. I do not mean shields are too good at what they do. No, I mean to say that the belief that Shields are underpowered is unfounded, at least at complex level. I do believe that basic modules should be 33 instead of 22 and advanced should be 44 instead of 33. If you ran primarily Caldari assault,you wouldn't have made this thread. EVERYTHING in this game eats shields for breakfast. I know right. my suit is terrible, goes down so quick.
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 2994	Posted - 2014.02.02 06:08:00 - [6] - Quote Yea, there's a reason why I dual tank. Shields aren't that viable. Maybe I have not learned the way but from my experiments, I'm going for the dual tank. Especially in today's war with today's TTK Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 3828	Posted - 2014.02.02 06:21:00 - [7] - Quote Th3rdSun wrote: If you ran primarily Caldari assault,you wouldn't have made this thread. EVERYTHING in this game eats shields for breakfast. I ran around in a Caldari Logi and Advanced Caldari Medium all day today. Put up the best scores I've put pup in the last three months. Was pulling 5 & 8 KD's from out of nowhere. My Gallante Medium has almost twice the HP and even a Complex Damage mod, but I still can't get even half the scores I got today. I regret giving up the Caldari Medium all those months ago. My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Anarchide, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior
Jackof All-Trades The Black Renaissance 422	Posted - 2014.02.02 06:23:00 - [8] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I simply believe that the speed penalty of armor plates negates their extra HP benefit. If I get caught out of cover with shields I can usually jump and either use evasive tactics to dodge attacks and fight or jump to cover. In an armor centered suit I usually find that I become severely slow and an easier to track target. It's true that point for point armor centered suits tend to have more HP. Though in real applications, shield tankers tend to have an advantage. I don't even run plates on my heavy anymore, cardiac regulators are far more valuable. They also take an eternity to refill, which means that if you barely survived one fight, you will not survive the next. I do not mean shields are too good at what they do. No, I mean to say that the belief that Shields are underpowered is unfounded, at least at complex level. I do believe that basic modules should be 33 instead of 22 and advanced should be 44 instead of 33. Shield are great. It's just sad that most people would stack plates along side them too. "Pulvis et umbra sums." We are but dust and shadow GÇò Horace, The Odes of Horace \ Omni-Specialist / Focus: Gallente
Ghost Kaisar Titans of Phoenix Legacy Rising 2551	Posted - 2014.02.02 06:28:00 - [9] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I simply believe that the speed penalty of armor plates negates their extra HP benefit. If I get caught out of cover with shields I can usually jump and either use evasive tactics to dodge attacks and fight or jump to cover. In an armor centered suit I usually find that I become severely slow and an easier to track target. It's true that point for point armor centered suits tend to have more HP. Though in real applications, shield tankers tend to have an advantage. I don't even run plates on my heavy anymore, cardiac regulators are far more valuable. They also take an eternity to refill, which means that if you barely survived one fight, you will not survive the next. I do not mean shields are too good at what they do. No, I mean to say that the belief that Shields are underpowered is unfounded, at least at complex level. I do believe that basic modules should be 33 instead of 22 and advanced should be 44 instead of 33. Depends on your playstyle. I flank and move constantly, so armor tanking never works for my mentality. If I start taking damage, my first reflex is to fall back and return fire from a more defensible location. When I get shot in my armor tank suits (which I'll try from time to time), I normally end up dead before reaching cover. Nothing says "F**K YOU!" like a direct Flaylock to the face. Minmatar. In Rust we trust.
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 3829	Posted - 2014.02.02 06:30:00 - [10] - Quote Jackof All-Trades wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I simply believe that the speed penalty of armor plates negates their extra HP benefit. If I get caught out of cover with shields I can usually jump and either use evasive tactics to dodge attacks and fight or jump to cover. In an armor centered suit I usually find that I become severely slow and an easier to track target. It's true that point for point armor centered suits tend to have more HP. Though in real applications, shield tankers tend to have an advantage. I don't even run plates on my heavy anymore, cardiac regulators are far more valuable. They also take an eternity to refill, which means that if you barely survived one fight, you will not survive the next. I do not mean shields are too good at what they do. No, I mean to say that the belief that Shields are underpowered is unfounded, at least at complex level. I do believe that basic modules should be 33 instead of 22 and advanced should be 44 instead of 33. Shield are great. It's just sad that most people would stack plates along side them too. Why is this wrong? I use a basic reactive plate because it has no speed penalty and gives both armor in addition to armor repair. My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Anarchide, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior

TODDSTER024 Revive Repair Resupply 166	Posted - 2014.02.02 06:30:00 - [11] - Quote You can have four complex shield extenders but, my proto flux nade wont care ....
Shiruba Ryou Molon Labe. 188	Posted - 2014.02.02 06:35:00 - [12] - Quote You guys say that shields suck, but fail to realize the 2 most common weapons right now eat Armor in no time. RR and CR. I've abandoned Damage mods on my Gallente Assault for that extra shield just so I can survive long enough to use my AR in range. And my Caldari Assault has it so Easy-Mode in this build (minus the tanks) it makes me sad to be Gallente. It can stay out of optimal range of ARs and CRs and by playing to the range of it's RR, SCR wont get the required time to charge or finish the job after by playing to cover at that distance while picking them off, You have the option of using dampeners to giive you some extra breathing room in positioning. You can toss some regulators and armor plates if you know you'll be sticking it to a certain place for a while. Point being, shield tankers need to stfu, I wish I was Caldari right now. "Not to worry. The cards say you loved it." `- Ryoutoshi`
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 3829	Posted - 2014.02.02 06:42:00 - [13] - Quote TODDSTER024 wrote: You can have four complex shield extenders but, my proto flux nade wont care .... I only have two, and because I'am not weighed down by plates I can safely hop out of the way. My alts: General John Ripper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Anarchide, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior
KingBabar The Rainbow Effect 1739	Posted - 2014.02.02 07:15:00 - [14] - Quote The whole point of armor tanking is the dude with 800 armor tossing down 2 rep hives recharging at 140 hp per interval. There lies the strenght in armor. Passive armor rep? LOL http://s1286.photobucket.com/user/KingBabar/media/BannerKingbabarcopy.png.html
Bunny Demon Capital Acquisitions LLC Renegade Alliance 76	Posted - 2014.02.02 07:24:00 - [15] - Quote KingBabar wrote: The whole point of armor tanking is the dude with 800 armor tossing down 2 rep hives recharging at 140 hp per interval. There lies the strenght in armor. Passive armor rep? LOL This does make armour very powerful but it's also then fixed to a single point as the user is unlikely to want to leave his little spot of invincibility So.....when are the um......new dropsuits coming out CCP.....it's been a few weeks now.... ;)
Vicious Minotaur Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 641	Posted - 2014.02.02 07:25:00 - [16] - Quote Shiruba Ryou wrote: You guys say that shields suck, but fail to realize the 2 most common weapons right now eat Armor in no time. RR and CR. I've abandoned Damage mods on my Gallente Assault for that extra shield just so I can survive long enough to use my AR in range. And my Caldari Assault has it so Easy-Mode in this build (minus the tanks) it makes me sad to be Gallente. It can stay out of optimal range of ARs and CRs and by playing to the range of it's RR, SCR wont get the required time to charge or finish the job after by playing to cover at that distance while picking them off, You have the option of using dampeners to giive you some extra breathing room in positioning. You can toss some regulators and armor plates if you know you'll be sticking it to a certain place for a while. Point being, shield tankers need to stfu, I wish I was Caldari right now. Shields get eaten in no time by rail rifles and combat rifles as well. But what would I know... I only have four characters dedicated to each race and their tech. And nevermind that everything gets eaten in no time by everything with the current TTK.
Viktor Hadah Jr Critical-Impact 2315	Posted - 2014.02.02 07:26:00 - [17] - Quote Armor > Shield in PC Shield > Armor in Pub Just my personal opinion Rare Templar BPO's on sale 250Mil ISK
NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 212	Posted - 2014.02.02 08:28:00 - [18] - Quote If you're playing ambush with no vehicles and have alot of cover, shields have the advantage a little bit shields have helped me, but you still die very very fast, 401 shields. 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter mlt frame, Templar set Caldari Master Race
I-Shayz-I I-----I 2144	Posted - 2014.02.02 08:32:00 - [19] - Quote Shields are getting a HUGE stealth buff in 1.8 I can't wait. Just look at the stats if you're confused by what I mean... Sentinels with shield recharge delays of 4-5 seconds is awesome. Buff to shield recharge of caldari suits, so many more shield oriented suits added... Should be interesting. I'm hoping I can bring back my ASCR. Links: List of Most Important Threads I make logistics videos!
COVERT SUBTERFUGE PSU GHOST SYNDICATE DARKSTAR ARMY 106	Posted - 2014.02.02 08:42:00 - [20] - Quote IIRC CCP Remnant said that weapon proficiency may no longer give blanket damage to both armor and shields but rather only that which the weapon is strong against. This may also extend over to damage mods; while there's been no mention of it that I've seen, the bonuses on sentinels and commandos indicates that damage mechanics are being tweaked. He did mention a blanket nerf toall weapons too. I think 1.8 is going to alleviate the TTK situation somewhat (hopefully). In any case, it will be interesting to see how things pan out if these things come to pass. Subterfuge and terrorist GOD in the making Proud Minmatar - Alt of THE GREY CARDINAL Love the Art of War

NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 213	Posted - 2014.02.02 08:42:00 - [21] - Quote I-Shayz-I wrote: Shields are getting a HUGE stealth buff in 1.8 I can't wait. Just look at the stats if you're confused by what I mean... Sentinels with shield recharge delays of 4-5 seconds is awesome. Buff to shield recharge of caldari suits, so many more shield oriented suits added... Should be interesting. I'm hoping I can bring back my ASCR. Which is overpowered still Its too powerful vs shields I hate games where whoever has a certain thing has a insta win button, your damage boost should be ajusted to give a advantage instead of a iwin button vs shields 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter mlt frame, Templar set Caldari Master Race
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 4400	Posted - 2014.02.02 08:48:00 - [22] - Quote For straight-up fights, armour has the advantage. For hit-and-run tactics, shields have the advantage. That's why Scouts have the best shields.
Vulpes Dolosus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 838	Posted - 2014.02.02 08:51:00 - [23] - Quote Shield vehicles are superior. #Pythons4lyfe Dropship Specialist Kills- Incubus: 4; Pythons: 2; Other DS: 29 Gêå1; Tanks: 31 Gêå3 1/26
Lynn Beck Granite Mercenary Division Top Men. 642	Posted - 2014.02.02 08:52:00 - [24] - Quote Shiruba Ryou wrote: You guys say that shields suck, but fail to realize the 2 most common weapons right now eat Armor in no time. RR and CR. I've abandoned Damage mods on my Gallente Assault for that extra shield just so I can survive long enough to use my AR in range. And my Caldari Assault has it so Easy-Mode in this build (minus the tanks) it makes me sad to be Gallente. It can stay out of optimal range of ARs and CRs and by playing to the range of it's RR, SCR wont get the required time to charge or finish the job after by playing to cover at that distance while picking them off, You have the option of using dampeners to giive you some extra breathing room in positioning. You can toss some regulators and armor plates if you know you'll be sticking it to a certain place for a while. Point being, shield tankers need to stfu, I wish I was Caldari right now. Doesn't matter when shields have half the shield cieking as armor. 677 or so on callogi, 980 somthing on gallogi. Does that warrant a 10% resist to the quickest killing gun in the game? 677+(10%) is 740-ish EHP againts rails. 980-(10%) is 890. Big ******* whoop. Under 28db Officially nerfproof (predicting CR nerf February '14) Selling SP: 10k SP per 100k ISK.
Jackof All-Trades The Black Renaissance 423	Posted - 2014.02.02 09:02:00 - [25] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Jackof All-Trades wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I simply believe that the speed penalty of armor plates negates their extra HP benefit. If I get caught out of cover with shields I can usually jump and either use evasive tactics to dodge attacks and fight or jump to cover. In an armor centered suit I usually find that I become severely slow and an easier to track target. It's true that point for point armor centered suits tend to have more HP. Though in real applications, shield tankers tend to have an advantage. I don't even run plates on my heavy anymore, cardiac regulators are far more valuable. They also take an eternity to refill, which means that if you barely survived one fight, you will not survive the next. I do not mean shields are too good at what they do. No, I mean to say that the belief that Shields are underpowered is unfounded, at least at complex level. I do believe that basic modules should be 33 instead of 22 and advanced should be 44 instead of 33. Shield are great. It's just sad that most people would stack plates along side them too. Why is this wrong? I use a basic reactive plate because it has no speed penalty and gives both armor in addition to armor repair. EVE mentality. Dual tanking is the crowning moment of fail there. It just seems so fundamentally wrong. But that's just me. "Pulvis et umbra sums." We are but dust and shadow GÇò Horace, The Odes of Horace \ Omni-Specialist / Focus: Gallente
8213 Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 1577	Posted - 2014.02.02 09:04:00 - [26] - Quote Shields and Armor are NOT supposed to be counterpart equal. Armor -fits better (CPU/PG) -More HP -Slow repair -Armor repair tools & hives Shields -Fits harder -Less HP -Fast repair -No healing sources They are different for different playstyles and each have their benefits. I don't think one is better than the other. I prefer Shields, because that's my playstyle. But I also can use armor plenty effectively. Fish in a bucket! Darken's Testament SKIPPY
NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 213	Posted - 2014.02.02 09:13:00 - [27] - Quote Jackof All-Trades wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Jackof All-Trades wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I simply believe that the speed penalty of armor plates negates their extra HP benefit. If I get caught out of cover with shields I can usually jump and either use evasive tactics to dodge attacks and fight or jump to cover. In an armor centered suit I usually find that I become severely slow and an easier to track target. It's true that point for point armor centered suits tend to have more HP. Though in real applications, shield tankers tend to have an advantage. I don't even run plates on my heavy anymore, cardiac regulators are far more valuable. They also take an eternity to refill, which means that if you barely survived one fight, you will not survive the next. I do not mean shields are too good at what they do. No, I mean to say that the belief that Shields are underpowered is unfounded, at least at complex level. I do believe that basic modules should be 33 instead of 22 and advanced should be 44 instead of 33. Shield are great. It's just sad that most people would stack plates along side them too. Why is this wrong? I use a basic reactive plate because it has no speed penalty and gives both armor in addition to armor repair. EVE mentality. Dual tanking is the crowning moment of fail there. It just seems so fundamentally wrong. But that's just me. Why cant you fit a dual tanking ship with nothing but a Armor plate Armor rep Shield booster Adaptive invulnerability field 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter mlt frame, Templar set Caldari Master Race
Spectral Clone Dust2Dust. Top Men. 1152	Posted - 2014.02.02 09:53:00 - [28] - Quote Wow, I didnt even realize caldari assault were getting 40 shield/s. Slap on a complex shield energizer: 401.151.6 = 73.6 shield/s ~ 74 shield/s. Recharge tanking will be a thing again. Prepare for 1.8: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPhISgw3I2w
NK Scout Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 213	Posted - 2014.02.02 10:16:00 - [29] - Quote Spectral Clone wrote: Wow, I didnt even realize caldari assault were getting 40 shield/s. Slap on a complex shield energizer: 401.151.6 = 73.6 shield/s ~ 74 shield/s. Recharge tanking will be a thing again. Link people, where was this posted 2 exiles assault rifles, Skinweave caldari frame, Staff recruiter mlt frame, Templar set Caldari Master Race
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 560	Posted - 2014.02.02 11:16:00 - [30] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I simply believe that the speed penalty of armor plates negates their extra HP benefit. If I get caught out of cover with shields I can usually jump and either use evasive tactics to dodge attacks and fight or jump to cover. In an armor centered suit I usually find that I become severely slow and an easier to track target. It's true that point for point armor centered suits tend to have more HP. Though in real applications, shield tankers tend to have an advantage. I don't even run plates on my heavy anymore, cardiac regulators are far more valuable. They also take an eternity to refill, which means that if you barely survived one fight, you will not survive the next. I do not mean shields are too good at what they do. No, I mean to say that the belief that Shields are underpowered is unfounded, at least at complex level. I do believe that basic modules should be 33 instead of 22 and advanced should be 44 instead of 33. I strongheartl agree but folks get blended by the amount of HP armor tankers have and can't imagine to change their playstyle to make use of shields advantage... But I have to agree to the scaling (although scaling is weird for armor modules as well)...



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