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@CCP: Reporting bugs feels largely pointless

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Duran Lex Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 466	Posted - 2014.01.31 04:19:00 - [1] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Me and several others reported a bunch of bugs in the past few days and weeks, and its frustrating to see them ignored by devs; they could have mentioned it in this week. The bi-weekly bug/updates. XxGhazbaranxX's thread on bugged small railgun damage application RDV yoyoing vehicle drops MCC interior issues Cant press square to return to MQ after battle Spawning with black screens Squad vehicles not appearing green as they should Enemies spawning on destroyed uplinks Scrambler rifle charge shot looks like regular shot, this happened shortly after they changed the charge shot visuals to something better, no its just gone. The indicator of being repaired by a repair tool has stopped working These are just the threads that I visited/made/commented on; many bugs that have been made have yet to be acknowledged at all. I'm not a payed QA tester, but I'm taking time to point out bugs with YOUR game, at least acknowledge them every 2 weeks. Other than the "square not working" and "RDV yoyoing", these should be pretty easy to reproduce. I don't need you guys to tell me its being fixed, or when its being fixed, or even that its being fixed; I just want some sort of indication that you actually read it, know about it, and that I'm not just wasting my time trying to point out these issues. It shouldn't be that hard to say "we know about" to more than 4 threads every 2 weeks. Just like it's not your job to spot the bugs, it's not theirs to acknowledge your efforts. You and CCP are "working as intended".
Duran Lex Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 466	Posted - 2014.01.31 04:44:00 - [2] - Quote mollerz wrote: Duran Lex wrote: Just like it's not your job to spot the bugs, it's not theirs to acknowledge your efforts. You and CCP are "working as intended". False. They always ask for evidence. They do use us as QA. We are, in fact, gracefully helping as intended. CCP is not working at all. So they always ask for evidence? Which in turn, means they are always acknowledging you? I see. /thread
Duran Lex Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 466	Posted - 2014.01.31 04:50:00 - [3] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Duran Lex wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Me and several others reported a bunch of bugs in the past few days and weeks, and its frustrating to see them ignored by devs; they could have mentioned it in this week. The bi-weekly bug/updates. XxGhazbaranxX's thread on bugged small railgun damage application RDV yoyoing vehicle drops MCC interior issues Cant press square to return to MQ after battle Spawning with black screens Squad vehicles not appearing green as they should Enemies spawning on destroyed uplinks Scrambler rifle charge shot looks like regular shot, this happened shortly after they changed the charge shot visuals to something better, no its just gone. The indicator of being repaired by a repair tool has stopped working These are just the threads that I visited/made/commented on; many bugs that have been made have yet to be acknowledged at all. I'm not a payed QA tester, but I'm taking time to point out bugs with YOUR game, at least acknowledge them every 2 weeks. Other than the "square not working" and "RDV yoyoing", these should be pretty easy to reproduce. I don't need you guys to tell me its being fixed, or when its being fixed, or even that its being fixed; I just want some sort of indication that you actually read it, know about it, and that I'm not just wasting my time trying to point out these issues. It shouldn't be that hard to say "we know about" to more than 4 threads every 2 weeks. Just like it's not your job to spot the bugs, it's not theirs to acknowledge your efforts. You and CCP are "working as intended". If they don't want us to spot bugs, they shouldn't have a bug report section. I don't want my efforts acknowledged, I want the bugs themselves acknowledged; just some indication that they know about them. Lol that's bulshit in it's entirety. The only conclusion i came to after reading your post, is that you want YOUR efforts acknowledged. If you know the bug exists, and you proved it to CCP the bug exists, guess what. The bug exists. CCP will now know it if they previously didn't, and you can set your mind at ease without them "acknowledging" the bug. Cause it's fuckin there in front of your eyes. I simply don't see a reason other then self gratification for wanting CCP to acknowledge something you know to be entirely true.
Duran Lex Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 466	Posted - 2014.01.31 04:51:00 - [4] - Quote mollerz wrote: Duran Lex wrote: mollerz wrote: Duran Lex wrote: Just like it's not your job to spot the bugs, it's not theirs to acknowledge your efforts. You and CCP are "working as intended". False. They always ask for evidence. They do use us as QA. We are, in fact, gracefully helping as intended. CCP is not working at all. So they always ask for evidence? Which in turn, means they are always acknowledging you? I see. /thread Well.. if I were simple, I'd have come to that conclusion too. Forgive my lack of anticipation of the wherewithal of intellect to extrapolate... :) There I go again!! sheesh. I'll just leave it to others to look at our conversation and pat your head and send you off. Unless you want to take another stab at it? Try a little bit harder and I'll respond. Or not That was the point. A stupid answer to a stupid statement.
Duran Lex Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 466	Posted - 2014.01.31 04:53:00 - [5] - Quote mollerz wrote: Duran Lex wrote: I simply... Exactly. Yep.
Duran Lex Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 466	Posted - 2014.01.31 05:08:00 - [6] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Duran Lex wrote: Just like it's not your job to spot the bugs, it's not theirs to acknowledge your efforts. You and CCP are "working as intended". If they don't want us to spot bugs, they shouldn't have a bug report section. I don't want my efforts acknowledged, I want the bugs themselves acknowledged; just some indication that they know about them. Lol that's bulshit in it's entirety. The only conclusion i came to after reading your post, is that you want YOUR efforts acknowledged. If you know the bug exists, and you proved it to CCP the bug exists, guess what. The bug exists. CCP will now know it if they previously didn't, and you can set your mind at ease without them "acknowledging" the bug. Cause it's fuckin there in front of your eyes. I simply don't see a reason other then self gratification for wanting CCP to acknowledge something you know to be entirely true. [/quote] False. From the OP: "I just want some sort of indication that you actually read it, know about it" Without any word from them, its impossible to know that CCP knows the bug exists, or even read the thread. All I want is confirmation that they know it exists.[/quote] I never said they didn't want you to spot bugs, for you are correct, that is why they have a bug section. Why do you feel you deserve an indication that they read it? It was never your job to find the bug in the first place. You took it upon yourself to do something that wasn't mandatory. But you did perform an act of generosity by finding the bugs and reporting it. I just can't understand why you aren't satisfied with that being the end of it. No matter how are trying to word it, you are still coming off as wanting something from CCP that isn't necessary for them to provide.
Duran Lex Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 466	Posted - 2014.01.31 05:18:00 - [7] - Quote mollerz wrote: Sorry Duran.. hard to tell if it's your utter lack of understanding how to properly edit quotes, or if you have CCP so far in your mouth it's just plain hard to understand you. Are you getting angry? These crazy long poorly edited responses are getting to be a bore. You can white knight CCP all day. They definitely care about you, and your efforts far less than they do about half ass fixing bugs in their product. Yes, im so angry I've resorted to childish one line responses, then followed up with insults when that didn't get the attention I wanted. You got me. I despise CCP if truth be told. They should have never have started Dust on the PS3. It should have been made on the PC using Carbon then ported to PS4 when they were able to actually implement their ideas. And their constant inability to provide balanced updates irks me to no end. Now you know, and knowing is half the battle.
Duran Lex Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 466	Posted - 2014.01.31 05:23:00 - [8] - Quote mollerz wrote: So you just like to contradict yourself? Compulsively play devil's advocate? I would enjoy hearing how i contradicted myself. No where did i say i liked CCP. Or do your assumptions count as my contradiction?
Duran Lex Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 467	Posted - 2014.01.31 05:41:00 - [9] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Duran Lex wrote: I never said they didn't want you to spot bugs, for you are correct, that is why they have a bug section. Why do you feel you deserve an indication that they read it? It was never your job to find the bug in the first place. You took it upon yourself to do something that wasn't mandatory. But you did perform an act of generosity by finding the bugs and reporting it. I just can't understand why you aren't satisfied with that being the end of it. No matter how are trying to word it, you are still coming off as wanting something from CCP that isn't necessary for them to provide. I never claimed that I deserved it, don't put words in my mouth. I recognize reporting bugs is completely optional, but they clearly benefit from having us play and test their game and but ultimately benefits them. It is to CCP's benefit if the players are helping them spot issues have some indication that they know about the bug; if you have no indication that they actually know about the problems you report, it feels like its in vain, meaning you are less like to report more bugs, which ultimately hurts the game. You are right, i used "deserved" for that was my personal interpretation of you listing links to your work then complaining that CCP wasn't telling you they read it and acknowledge the bugs existence, so my apologies. I guess that's just where our mindsets differ. When i perform acts of kindness or charity, i don't care if i get a thankyou or not. I don't mind holding the door open for someone that will simply walk past without so much as a glance in my direction. The knowledge of my efforts was enough for me. So I suppose I'll leave your thread, since opposing opinions that will never change doesn't merit clogging it with repetition. Goodluck to you sir. Edit - After reading it over, my post could easily be viewed as sarcasm. It was not.
Duran Lex Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 469	Posted - 2014.01.31 05:56:00 - [10] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Duran Lex wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Duran Lex wrote: I never said they didn't want you to spot bugs, for you are correct, that is why they have a bug section. Why do you feel you deserve an indication that they read it? It was never your job to find the bug in the first place. You took it upon yourself to do something that wasn't mandatory. But you did perform an act of generosity by finding the bugs and reporting it. I just can't understand why you aren't satisfied with that being the end of it. No matter how are trying to word it, you are still coming off as wanting something from CCP that isn't necessary for them to provide. I never claimed that I deserved it, don't put words in my mouth. I recognize reporting bugs is completely optional, but they clearly benefit from having us play and test their game and but ultimately benefits them. It is to CCP's benefit if the players are helping them spot issues have some indication that they know about the bug; if you have no indication that they actually know about the problems you report, it feels like its in vain, meaning you are less like to report more bugs, which ultimately hurts the game. You are right, i used "deserved" for that was my personal interpretation of you listing links to your work then complaining that CCP wasn't telling you they read it and acknowledge the bugs existence, so my apologies. I guess that's just where our mindsets differ. When i perform acts of kindness or charity, i don't care if i get a thankyou or not. I don't mind holding the door open for someone that will simply walk past without so much as a glance in my direction. The knowledge of my efforts was enough for me. So I suppose I'll leave your thread, since opposing opinions that will never change doesn't merit clogging it with repetition. Goodluck to you sir. I still think the central argumet is from a misunderstanding; I don't want a thank you, this is not about wanting kindness repaid. I just want to know that my help is actually received. If you send money to a friend in need, wouldn't you want to know that the friend actually received the money? Same principle applies with wanting them to know CCP actually received the report and know about the bug. Yet the principles aren't the same. CCP is not your friend. Your analogy is more like this. "You sent your money to someone you don't know. They took your money and wrote nothing in return". I agree that if CCP had some sort of personal reason to respond, they should. But being as they have no personal reasons, i just don't see the need for them to say anything to you or about those bugs. That's why i can't help but feel you just want a thankyou. We have two completely different opinions on what CCP needs to do or not. Those opinions aren't changing throughout this thread, and probably won't. And thats okay. As this repetition is continuing on longer i would like to say good day sir, and again, goodluck.

Duran Lex Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 469	Posted - 2014.01.31 06:17:00 - [11] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: It may not be at all like a friendship, but there is definitely a business relationship in which both the paying customer and creator are invested in the success of the product, so comparing it to just sending money to a stranger is who doesn't right back is not a good analogy. I still don't see how wanting confirmation that they are aware of an issue a "thank you", especially since the confirmation of knowledge on an issue does not even have to reference the identify of the person who originally reported it. In either your or my analogies, saying "I got the money" is not a thank you. A thank you is an expression of gratitude, not an acknowledgement of receiving something; and the acknowledgement of receiving something doesn't even have to acknowledge the sender. Seriously, in what world is "we know about X issue" a thank you? Then lets make this easy for you to grasp. My opinion : I don't fee their lack of acknowledgement of the bug is problem. End of story. Your opinion : You feel it's a problem. End of story. Bye now. Keep up the good work .(?)
Duran Lex Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 470	Posted - 2014.01.31 06:58:00 - [12] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Duran Lex wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: It may not be at all like a friendship, but there is definitely a business relationship in which both the paying customer and creator are invested in the success of the product, so comparing it to just sending money to a stranger is who doesn't right back is not a good analogy. I still don't see how wanting confirmation that they are aware of an issue a "thank you", especially since the confirmation of knowledge on an issue does not even have to reference the identify of the person who originally reported it. In either your or my analogies, saying "I got the money" is not a thank you. A thank you is an expression of gratitude, not an acknowledgement of receiving something; and the acknowledgement of receiving something doesn't even have to acknowledge the sender. Seriously, in what world is "we know about X issue" a thank you? Then lets make this easy for you to grasp. My opinion : I don't fee their lack of acknowledgement of the bug is problem. End of story. Your opinion : You feel it's a problem. End of story. Bye now. Keep up the good work .(?) Well if your opinion is basically "we know about the bug" = "thank you", then your opinion is objectively incorrect, and contradicts the definition of what an expression of gratitude means. Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but some opinions are incorrect if they are provably false, as is with your definition of what a "thank you". Bye. My opinion was stated above. Read it. Says nothing about a thank you there. Please don't tell me not to put words in your mouth, then attempt to do so. Just because i can have multiple opinions on why i feel you are asking for a thankyou, doesn't mean you get to choose which of the opinions I've stated gets to be twisted to your liking. My last post went as follows. Pay attention now. My opinion based on CCP acknowledging if bugs is exist, is that they don't have to say a word about it. It won't change a thing on CCP's end if they acknowledge the bug exists or not, so i don't see why they should. It's not a problem in my eyes. Your opinion is that you would like them say something about it because they haven't. This is a problem in your eyes. Now to clarify for you on the "thank you". My opinion of feeling you are asking for a thank you stems from the way you have presented yourself in the OP, and throughout this discussion, which was further solidified with the phrase, and i quote "I would like to know my help was received". That to me sounds like you want personal acknowledgement for your efforts not just for the bugs themselves. See how opinions can differ depending on the topic? In the future i suggest you read a sentences subject and predicate before filling in the blanks with opinions said in different sentences, under entirely different context.

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