DUST Search - THE RAIL RIFLE IS NOT OP

emtbraincase wrote:

anyone who thinks spool time has ANY impact on how the RR is used is either fooling themselves or has never run in a squad with scanners (which I find hard to believe). I have yet to see an RR user not firing just as I'm coming around a corner. Sometimes I have my high armor Logi with a Duvolle and can win slightly more often than not, however, If I don't have 160+ shields and 450+ armor I lose EVERY TIME.

You cannot use spool time as an example of it's "equalizing factor" when a scanner will show you exactly when to start firing so that the instant an enemy shows around a corner the ammo is already on the way. I do this with every other rifle, it's just that it doesn't really assist that much, but it can entirely eliminate most of the CQC balance in the RR. Thus making it OP in comparison to everything else, since that spool time is only happening when nobody is firing back.

P.S. To all RR defenders......I know you may try to refute this, but don't lie. You know you run with SOMEONE with a scanner in sqd when you are CQC with RR, and that is EXACTLY how you run it, effectively eliminating the spool time.


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Ryme Intrinseca Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 549	Posted - 2014.01.31 21:30:00 - [1] - Quote Vermaak Doe wrote: Most of the rail rifle complaints are based in hard facts, do the math and you'll see how the rail rifle is almost identical to the Ar's dps except with 30km more optimal and an almost ignorable charge time. So you want us to do the DPS maths but then not include the maths for the spool time? Because if you do that, you'll see that the AR has a big (25%) DPS advantage over the RR for the first second of fire. The advantage for the ScR and CR is even greater. That's hard facts for you. Hand on heart, how many of the 'RR is OP' people actually use it regularly? As in, in most the battles they play? This just feels like an obvious attempt to get the RR nerfed by non-RR users, to gain an advantage over them. But I'll be happy to be proved wrong if that's not the case. I use the RR often but the AR even more. And I can tell you with absolute certainty that the AR dominates the RR in close quarters, not just a little, but a lot. If you don't think that, you must be great with the RR and/or bad with the AR/CR/ScR. As for increasing spool time to 0.5 seconds - great, now it has half the first-second DPS of the AR and <25% of that of CR/ScR. With that laser-like CQC ability you'd have another long range weapon reduced to mere novelty, and we'd go back to AR514, which I remember everyone was so fond of a few months ago
Ryme Intrinseca Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 549	Posted - 2014.01.31 22:03:00 - [2] - Quote Nirwanda Vaughns wrote: if its not OP then why is 99% of the kills in my kill feeds rail rifles from both teams? everyone is over-using it because it is op in close range. its not so much the damage but the hip fire accuracy which is smaller than my duvolle even with SS 5. The AR is virtually impossible to miss with in CQC. If the AR is landing every shot, how can the RR be more accurate? If you mean that RR users are scoring more headshots, that's skill, not the weapon. Still struggling to see any actual argument for the RR being OP in CQC. It just seems to be 'a RR killed me in CQC. It shouldn't be able to do that, it's a long range weapon!'. It's true that RR users aren't defenceless in CQC as laser users or snipers are. But they are at a big disadvantage due to spool time and mediocre DPS (especially compared to CR and ScR). That's what we call balance.
Ryme Intrinseca Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 549	Posted - 2014.01.31 22:05:00 - [3] - Quote Alaika Arbosa wrote: Ace, RR is OP, RR needs nerf Seriously though, I'd like to smoke some of whatever CCP was smoking when they decided that the racial rifle with the greatest range should have the highest damage per shot. IIRC, Rails in Eve have overall the worst DPS, but massive range. Yet here in Dust, they've got the highest damage per shot and the longest range of the racial rifles. Am I the only one this doesn't make sense to? Damage per shotGëáDPS. Once you master this concept things make much more sense.
Ryme Intrinseca Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 553	Posted - 2014.01.31 22:30:00 - [4] - Quote xSir Campsalotx wrote: Rail rifle same dps as duvolle, twice the range and thus OP. why use a gun that has the same dps but half the range. For the thousandth time, because the AR doesn't have a spool time and thus has much higher effective DPS than the RR.
Ryme Intrinseca Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 556	Posted - 2014.01.31 23:19:00 - [5] - Quote emtbraincase wrote: anyone who thinks spool time has ANY impact on how the RR is used is either fooling themselves or has never run in a squad with scanners (which I find hard to believe). I have yet to see an RR user not firing just as I'm coming around a corner. Sometimes I have my high armor Logi with a Duvolle and can win slightly more often than not, however, If I don't have 160+ shields and 450+ armor I lose EVERY TIME. You cannot use spool time as an example of it's "equalizing factor" when a scanner will show you exactly when to start firing so that the instant an enemy shows around a corner the ammo is already on the way. I do this with every other rifle, it's just that it doesn't really assist that much, but it can entirely eliminate most of the CQC balance in the RR. Thus making it OP in comparison to everything else, since that spool time is only happening when nobody is firing back. P.S. To all RR defenders......I know you may try to refute this, but don't lie. You know you run with SOMEONE with a scanner in sqd when you are CQC with RR, and that is EXACTLY how you run it, effectively eliminating the spool time. What a ridiculous argument. If someone is tracking you (as in, has his sights following your scanned red dot through the wall) before you even come round the corner, you're pretty much dead whatever weapon they're using. The one situation in which the spool time is neutralized is the one situation in which the RR user doesn't need it neutralized, because anyone with virtually any weapon would win the engagement. I run a proto scanner with a RR about 30% of the time, and with an AR 70% of the time. AR is a delight to use in CQC. I ONLY use the RR when I expect long range engagements, and rarely (maybe one in ten of the RR games) find myself in the situation you describe. 95% of my kills with RR have no pre-firing. Even in CQC there are few situations in which it is viable. As anyone who uses the RR regularly knows, spool time is a massive limitation.
Ryme Intrinseca Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 556	Posted - 2014.01.31 23:24:00 - [6] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Just look at the stats on all the weapons, and even someone who doesn't play can see it's OP. If you can't your slow. Try using any other weapon for a day and you'll see. Why do you think we haven't gotten range stats yet hmmm? That's the biggest most important stat, and we don't have it because it's incriminating evidence to the fact that the RR or any other OP weapon is in fact OP. The stats show that the RR is weak in CQC. It has easily the lowest effective DPS of the rifles. As for using 'any other weapon for a day', I mostly use AR. This is because it's a much better CQC weapon than the RR.