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Monkey MAC
Lost Millennium
1576
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Posted - 2014.01.15 22:47:00 -
[1] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:ReGnYuM wrote:Firstly, If you cannot understand why it is detrimental to game design and diversity, when someone spends approximately 2.7 million SP on a Proto suit for specific variant of a weapon, then you're part of the problem.
Secondly as it stands, the AK.0+ScR combo is the poster boy child for broken. What the Assault AK.0 bonus allows, is for the ScR to be proficient at CQC and range... remind you of another Gun(First one to guess correct get 5mill ISK).
Thirdly, the whole. "Gun takes skill because of the overheat mechanic" argument is so stupid. Its a long range weapon, and therefore it should require pacing.
Either way the weapon was due for a re-tuning. Just be happy they did not hit it with the nerf bat I don't understand your bitching ReGnYuM. The ScR will always be good even without the heat bonus in CQC, all the bonus mean was that players who made use of a specific weapon type were benefitted in its use.
No offence True, but your statement their, highlighted in bold for convenience, is the exact problem.
What if I wanna use something like a Mass Driver or Sniper Rifle?
That's why I never liked the Amarr Assault bonus and why I don't agree with the currently proposed logistics racial bonuses. You are effectively penalised for not using the equipment.
Tanks 514
I told you, I bloody well told you.
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.1
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Monkey MAC
Lost Millennium
1576
|
Posted - 2014.01.15 23:06:00 -
[2] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:Monkey MAC wrote:True Adamance wrote:ReGnYuM wrote:Firstly, If you cannot understand why it is detrimental to game design and diversity, when someone spends approximately 2.7 million SP on a Proto suit for specific variant of a weapon, then you're part of the problem.
Secondly as it stands, the AK.0+ScR combo is the poster boy child for broken. What the Assault AK.0 bonus allows, is for the ScR to be proficient at CQC and range... remind you of another Gun(First one to guess correct get 5mill ISK).
Thirdly, the whole. "Gun takes skill because of the overheat mechanic" argument is so stupid. Its a long range weapon, and therefore it should require pacing.
Either way the weapon was due for a re-tuning. Just be happy they did not hit it with the nerf bat I don't understand your bitching ReGnYuM. The ScR will always be good even without the heat bonus in CQC, all the bonus mean was that players who made use of a specific weapon type were benefitted in its use. No offence True, but your statement their, highlighted in bold for convenience, is the exact problem. What if I wanna use something like a Mass Driver or Sniper Rifle? That's why I never liked the Amarr Assault bonus and why I don't agree with the currently proposed logistics racial bonuses. You are effectively penalised for not using the equipment. Why would one nations technology be designed to be used to compliment foreign technology? hence you see the EVE side bonuses affecting, on ships, that nations racial proclivities. Even then when it comes to manufacturing a product you never make a product without a market intended for it, the case of say Carthum or Viziam, amarrian corporations, why would they produce Amarrian designs to complement Minmatar or Gallentean guns? If CCP wanted generic suits with generic bonuses why did they not model a corporate dropsuit system?
First of all, this isn't EvE so certain things are going to be mirrored. While I see your point about target audience, don't forget you build a product for as many people as possible.
Secondly even in lore races buy and use each others gear. The broker sold 2 amarrians both caldari and gallante weaponry. Finally the dropsuits aren't generic, but the skills need to be generic so as to avoid,
1) Overpowered Suits (Gallante Scanner Bonus)
2) Suits used for Spam ( Caldari, Amarrian Bonus)
3) Penalising for having a specific playstyle (Amarrian Assault Bonus)
Finally in an FPS a lot of things are generic, it is going to happen. Why would we have 4 weapons that do the same thing?
4 ARs
2 SMGs
2 Light AV
Tanks 514
I told you, I bloody well told you.
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.1
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Monkey MAC
Lost Millennium
1576
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Posted - 2014.01.15 23:42:00 -
[3] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:Monkey MAC wrote:True Adamance wrote:Monkey MAC wrote:True Adamance wrote:
I don't understand your bitching ReGnYuM.
The ScR will always be good even without the heat bonus in CQC, all the bonus mean was that players who made use of a specific weapon type were benefitted in its use.
No offence True, but your statement their, highlighted in bold for convenience, is the exact problem. What if I wanna use something like a Mass Driver or Sniper Rifle? That's why I never liked the Amarr Assault bonus and why I don't agree with the currently proposed logistics racial bonuses. You are effectively penalised for not using the equipment. Why would one nations technology be designed to be used to compliment foreign technology? hence you see the EVE side bonuses affecting, on ships, that nations racial proclivities. Even then when it comes to manufacturing a product you never make a product without a market intended for it, the case of say Carthum or Viziam, amarrian corporations, why would they produce Amarrian designs to complement Minmatar or Gallentean guns? If CCP wanted generic suits with generic bonuses why did they not model a corporate dropsuit system? First of all, this isn't EvE so certain things are going to be mirrored. While I see your point about target audience, don't forget you build a product for as many people as possible. Secondly even in lore races buy and use each others gear. The broker sold 2 amarrians both caldari and gallante weaponry. Finally the dropsuits aren't generic, but the skills need to be generic so as to avoid, 1) Overpowered Suits (Gallante Scanner Bonus) 2) Suits used for Spam ( Caldari, Amarrian Bonus) 3) Penalising for having a specific playstyle (Amarrian Assault Bonus) Finally in an FPS a lot of things are generic, it is going to happen. Why would we have 4 weapons that do the same thing? 4 ARs 2 SMGs 2 Light AV These same ship builders make our gear. Your point is moot, there will always be features of the suits that compliment their own racial groups technology. Again as you said all races used each other gear, that doesn't mean that a Mass driver designed to be compatible with an Gallente Medium frame suit. simply put suit bonuses should not simply be generic RoF buffs or Shield armour buffs. I fail to understand how you classify using the main assault rifle of the amarr is considered spamming. I only gain 7 shots on you tops, if anything racial tech should be more penalising and favour racial styles, if CCP want to make more generic and racial dropsuits I would recommend the consider a corporate line of suits requiring non racial skills. Frankly speaking the last thing we want in this game is more generic and boring content, that's not what dust promised, its not what people who play dust to the greater part of my understanding want. Why do you want to accommodate generic play styles and reward players for not sacrificing anything? That just makes them more entitled. The lasting thing we need is a dumbing down of gameplay to garner the favour of a casual audience while sacrificing the things that more hardcore player want. Speaking plainly again....we need more eve side aspects in Dust, we need to be a part of the universe, work off a combined set of rules and scenarios, etc.
Depends what you consider generic.
Which is more generic?
An Amarrian using Amarrian Weaponry, Caldari using Caldari Weaponry?
OR
An Amarrian using Gallante Weaponry, Minmatar using Amarrian Weapinry?
To give you some examples of other games that changed from the first to the second scenario. Mass Effect 2 --> Mass Effect 3.
In 2 you could only have certain weapins to each class, vanguards were forced to use shotguns, you played the class and were given only 1 playstyle.
In 3 you can equip ANY weapon you feel like to ANY class, that vanguard only limited to shotguns . . . Suddenly becomes a powerful long range class, something never orginally possible.
Here in DUST we can make an equivalent, your class is dependant on your type and race of suit. But just because your a minnie assault doesn't mean you HAVE to be short-medium range engagements.
Finally in EvE there is more choice elsewhere, you can get EvE ships from all 4 races that have similar roles and abilities, more so than our suits. You get more choice into your via your ship then it's weapons. In DUST the majority of your role on the battlefield is determined by the gun you carry, not the suit you wear.
Tanks 514
I told you, I bloody well told you.
Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.1
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