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Jackoun Amarthon
Federation Foreign Fighters
7
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Posted - 2014.01.07 14:59:00 -
[1] - Quote
I enjoy blaster HAV's, but i've noticed, like many others, its way to overpowered against infantry. However the blaster HAV's has no way to defend itself against vehicles of its same class fitted with other weaponry, unless the driver has the ability to outmaneuver the slow turning Rail guns, but the madrugar turns like a elephant on roller skates...
Had it been real life, you would never design a tank to take down infantry, that cant defend itself vs vehicles off its same class and size. That's were APC's and Infantry Fighting Vehicles gets in the picture... So my proposal is:
- 80GJ blaster: turn it into a short range anti-vehicle weapon. Give it a lower rate of fire, increase the damage and decrease its accuracy. It would make it harder to hit infantry, and force people to use it as a AV close range weapon, while still allow it to offer support vs infantry for your storming infantry.
Now we have crippled the Madrugars ability to fend off hords of infantry. this is were i have suggestions to change the 20GJ blaster like this:
- 20GJ blaster:: Increase its range + presision to something like the today's 80GJ blaster. But decrease the dmg output so it will be balanced.
This would make it the weapon of choice to keep infantry off the vehicle in close quarter combat... also i would like for the down angle with which the turret can shoot to be increased, so people cant hug the HAV and avoid being shot.
people with remote explosive has to be sneaky then...
What do you guys think?
Help me improve faction warfare:
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134049&find=unread
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CLONE117
planetary retaliation organisation
556
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Posted - 2014.01.07 16:30:00 -
[2] - Quote
i consider that large blaster anti infantry. the other 2 turret variants r better at anti tank turrets.
although my large blaster feels rather weak when going up against those tanked out dropsuits.
although a blaster tank doesnt have the range to hit my railgun tank from afar. so id rather have those roaming around to destroy.....with my glass cannon...
although the flaw with ur idea is the fact currently most tank cant really have both its either more armor and shields or extra turrets. |
Alena Ventrallis
The Neutral Zone
446
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Posted - 2014.01.07 17:01:00 -
[3] - Quote
A good idea that needs some tweaking.
Enact Large Blaster changes as stated.
Give small blasters some dispersion. My issue is you have to keep a pin size dot on a moving target, while you yourself are moving. Makes things really annoying to hit.
Small buff to pg/CPU to make fitting one small turret easier. And I do mean small. Perhaps a 30cpu/500pg buff, something like that.
Also, fix the damn glitch that puts my small turret on the front of the tank. I want it on top dammit. |
Harpyja
DUST University
Ivy League
1034
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Posted - 2014.01.07 17:15:00 -
[4] - Quote
No. Blasters don't need to be good at AV. Missiles finally have a good place as short range AV now. It's the railguns that need tweaking, as they are too powerful at CQC.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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Jackoun Amarthon
Federation Foreign Fighters
8
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Posted - 2014.01.07 18:53:00 -
[5] - Quote
Harpyja wrote:No. Blasters don't need to be good at AV. Missiles finally have a good place as short range AV now. It's the railguns that need tweaking, as they are too powerful at CQC.
I always thought the missiles to be Medium range weapons.. were blasters would be close quater weapons. so blasters would be short range.
Beside the missile tanks can kill tanks with 2-5 volleys depending on hardners. I just want the blasters to feel like a close quater AV brawl weapon.
CLONE117 wrote:i consider that large blaster anti infantry. the other 2 turret variants r better at anti tank turrets..
In my world it doesn't make sense to have a vehicle like the HAV to be anti- infantry.. that's the ground the MAV ((medium attack vehicle) when they come.. SoonTM) should cover.
Alena Ventrallis wrote:A good idea that needs some tweaking.
Enact Large Blaster changes as stated.
Give small blasters some dispersion. My issue is you have to keep a pin size dot on a moving target, while you yourself are moving. Makes things really annoying to hit.
Small buff to pg/CPU to make fitting one small turret easier. And I do mean small. Perhaps a 30cpu/500pg buff, something like that.
Also, fix the damn glitch that puts my small turret on the front of the tank. I want it on top dammit.
^ this, but also the 20GJ blaster has a very limited range, or at least i feel it that way when i use them... i might be wrong, i havn't seen the numbers. but i'm a machine gunner RL... and the machine gun has an effective range that is the double of the carbine i use when i'm not using the LMG. So the 20GJ blaster should have a range that makes it able to support out to long ranges.. if not its a bad support weapon.
Help me improve faction warfare:
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134049&find=unread
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CLONE117
planetary retaliation organisation
558
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Posted - 2014.01.07 19:29:00 -
[6] - Quote
first off. the MAV isnt out yet not sure how long it WILL take...
this is now. as in currently in game. not the future.
with that aside tanks r anti infantry in a way. they support infantry by providing cover from enemy gunfire. and with the large turrets they carry they can be used to destroy other vehicles and infantry.
the small turrets can be powerful if used with some decent skill. but its not going to suppress an enemy team or keep them away from u not even a large blaster turret can do that effectively.
if i recall the several times ppl have ran up trying to shoot my tank with ars.
and currently that large blaster turret isnt actually effective against vehicles or installations at all.. sure it can kill them but if u want to take them down fast your better off with a railgun or missile turret.
my anti proto bear tank that i run only when the enemy team tries to stomp in full proto. doesnt actually have hardly any cpu to fit any of the small turrets although it does have the pg.
that is probably because my single mlt dmg mod i have fitted onto it takes so much cpu. which is essential for when i do end up having to fight an enemy vehicle or take down an enemy turret.
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Harpyja
DUST University
Ivy League
1035
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Posted - 2014.01.07 20:42:00 -
[7] - Quote
Jackoun Amarthon wrote:Harpyja wrote:No. Blasters don't need to be good at AV. Missiles finally have a good place as short range AV now. It's the railguns that need tweaking, as they are too powerful at CQC. I always thought the missiles to be Medium range weapons.. were blasters would be close quater weapons. so blasters would be short range. Beside the missile tanks can kill tanks with 2-5 volleys depending on hardners. I just want the blasters to feel like a close quater AV brawl weapon.
Missiles were supposed to be medium ranged AV before 1.7 but we all saw how that worked out. Blasters were king in short range and railguns were king beyond short range. Missiles were the odd child that was average on all fronts. Railguns and blasters were superior to missiles.
Now, in 1.7, there's potential for balance. By removing the blaster's AV capabilities, you make missiles the short ranged AV weapon. Now, blasters are only good for anti infantry. Missiles are only good for CQC AV. And railguns should be only good for long range support (AV and anti-infantry with reduced killing effectiveness from blasters and missiles).
But here is where the issue arises. Railguns are good at both long and short range AV. So what's the point in missiles again where you are only effective in CQC while railguns are effective at every range?
Try firing your missiles in full auto at anything further than 100m and you will start missing. At that range, you are forced to fire one or two missiles at a time, which more than halves your burst DPS. What would have been a kill at 50m is able to limp away at 150m.
"By His light, and His will"
- The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens
League of Infamy
1496
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Posted - 2014.01.07 20:47:00 -
[8] - Quote
The only game I have seen that has a vehicle capable of killing infantry and other vehicles is that anti air light rank from bf3/bf4. But that thing is paper thin. |
KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
974
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Posted - 2014.01.08 01:13:00 -
[9] - Quote
Sure blaster can defend against and kill tanks.
Takes some planning though to go thru hardeners, it's no longer "to tanks park opposite to each other until one pops".
That was the greatest change in tank warfare 1.6->1.7.
Tank spam getting onto your nerves?
An improvement:
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Ulysses Knapse
Knapse and Co. Mercenary Firm
1052
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Posted - 2014.01.08 01:55:00 -
[10] - Quote
I'm just going to leave this right here...
What's the difference between an immobile Minmatar ship and a pile of garbage?
The pile of garbage is more lethal.
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Bojo The Mighty
L.O.T.I.S.
2574
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Posted - 2014.01.08 02:24:00 -
[11] - Quote
Harpyja wrote:No. Blasters don't need to be good at AV. Missiles finally have a good place as short range AV now. It's the railguns that need tweaking, as they are too powerful at CQC.
What? Blasters are the only Gallente Turrets available to them. It would be terrible to limit them at anti infantry abilities.
Do Not Feed The Imperfects. Feeding them may disrupt the natural setting.
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thomas mak
STRONG-ARMED BANDITS
Public Disorder.
6
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Posted - 2014.01.08 11:27:00 -
[12] - Quote
Stupid to make blaster into AV weapon which it is the last weapon on tank can actually kill some infantry, and it is non-sene to say blaster it too op, or damage too high for infantry, think about that, a weapon that design for killing infantry which SHOT BUTTET BIGGER THAN YOUR HEAD TO YOU why call it op, it is sence.
Real tanker dies with their tanks!
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Jackoun Amarthon
Federation Foreign Fighters
10
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Posted - 2014.01.08 14:25:00 -
[13] - Quote
CLONE117 wrote:first off. the MAV isnt out yet not sure how long it WILL take...
Uhuh.. so.. because MAV's aren't present yet.. we make a HAV that takes the MAV role, yep.. well fighters aren't present yet either, still people talk about them coming.. i have a good idea! Lets take the Caldari LAV and make it into a Fighter..! Then the fighter aspect is finally in the game.. and then when the MAV's and fighters arrive we can fix the Gallente HAV and Caldari LAV to their popper roles.
thomas mak wrote:Stupid to make blaster into AV weapon which it is the last weapon on tank can actually kill some infantry, and it is non-sene to say blaster it too op, or damage too high for infantry, think about that, a weapon that design for killing infantry which SHOT BUTTET BIGGER THAN YOUR HEAD TO YOU why call it op, it is sence.
If you think about it. The Madrugar is a "mercenary" version of a tank they produced for their army. As the GunLogi is the mercinary version of the tank caldari produced for their army. Now the Caldari HAV has missiles and railgun as choice.. weapons designed to kill other Tanks. But Gallente, who are in war with Caldari makes a vehicle, and designs its weapon to only kill infantry...
Well.. what would happen, which of the two nations wins?
Lets see: Gallente infantry fights caldari infantry. Caldari infantry gets the edge, Gallente drives tanks into the fight and destroyes the infantry, caldari roles in their tanks and destroy the gallente tanks. Now the gallente throws in.. wait.. they havn't designed something that is AV... aw.. bugger. - "If only the Blaster was a short range AV dps cannon. then we could use Hight-curves to hide from the rail guns, and attack them up close were they are vulnerable.. Now that would be tactics."
Also, what will we do when Minmatar get both Autocannon and Artillery HAV's or Amarr gets Pulse or Beam laser HAV's.. you have to design something that works in the future to... and if we made the small weapons 20gj blasters and small rail guns the Anti-Infantry weapon, and 80gj Blaster, Rail and the Missile launchers AV weapons.. the world of dust would make sense.
What i Suggest is only, to increase the damage slightly, to make it possible to dps through another HAV, while reducing the ROF and its precision (slower ROF + More dmg = same dps - making it less precise = you can increase dps enough to make it able to kill HAV's while making sure infantry can survive). It would not make it godly overpowered.
EX:
RPM 160-180 -- Now: 428 rpm
Damage: 200-400 area. -- Now 105
Im terrible at math, but i believe it would be about the same dps. but it would be able to dmg HAV's
The turrets are as follows (In my eyes):
80GJ Rail: Long range, High Alfa, slow turn rate.
Missile: Close-Medium Range, High Alfa, Fast turn rate
80GJ Blaster: Close range, High dps.
20GJ Blaster: Close range, anti-Infantry.
A missile tank would still be able to beat the blaster HAV, but the Blaster HAV driver would not have to be Jesus to actually outmaneuver the missile HAV long enough to kill it. If your tank is godly enough dps wont be a problem, only alpha. With the 20gj turret changes ALL hav's would be able to tackle infantry and HAV's. of course your co-gunner gets all the kills.. i don't know if thats what scares you... personally i dont mind.. i fight for the team not myself.
I don't know if its the fact that i'm a Soldier RL. but in games you don't have an cost-effective-ness idea of the ammo your using. If you had to pay for the ammo, you probably wouldn't be using the 80gj Rail to blast one man down any way. That what you use the LMG or HMG to (20GJ blaster). Plus the blaster, missile launcher, and railgun can still scatter most ppl.. even if you miss, the psychological pressure makes people abandon their position - i see it all the time, and that Gentlemen, is being support.
Help me improve faction warfare:
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134049&find=unread
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Jackoun Amarthon
Federation Foreign Fighters
10
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Posted - 2014.01.08 14:46:00 -
[14] - Quote
Go support this guy, His idea is gonna revolutionize turrets in the good way
Help me make Faction Warfare feel like conquering a planet!
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Viktor Skirov
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
52
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Posted - 2014.03.01 01:44:00 -
[15] - Quote
I'm hoping for the fix detection for small turrets to be fixed soon.
I swear by Garth sake I'm going to throw my TV off the window next time I shoot all the rounds of my lil' Railgun on a single, not moving, scout.
Screw tanks!, fix small blaster... Or give it a cookie called "Dispersion", That'll do.
¡FIRING MAH LIL' RAILGHAUN!
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Spartykins
NECROM0NGERS
The CORVOS
40
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Posted - 2014.03.01 04:49:00 -
[16] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:The only game I have seen that has a vehicle capable of killing infantry and other vehicles is that anti air light rank from bf3/bf4. But that thing is paper thin.
I actually posted a while back that it would make more sense for MAV's to kill infantry, but be weaker to AV/tanks.
Basically
MAV > Infantry
AV > Tank/MAV
Other tanks/Tank > MAV
(Insert witty phrase here)
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Gabriel Ceja
Knights of Eternal Darkness
League of Infamy
1
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Posted - 2014.03.01 08:26:00 -
[17] - Quote
Honestly the Large Blaster Turret is good the way it is, the only thing that is really killing it in the tank to tank battle is hardener stacking because when one hardener is on it can still do good enough damage(depending on the level of the turret) to put up a fight but when they are stacking hardeners the large blaster turret becomes pathetic and does virtually nothing to the other tank but i do like where you're going with the small blasters
My tank is my dropsuit, it's kinda like your dropsuit...umm Only bigger, but just a little. :)
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Derpty Derp
It's All Gone Derp
42
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Posted - 2014.03.01 08:31:00 -
[18] - Quote
Blaster turrets are fine, you can defend yourself with them against other vehicles, why the hell should it be able to kill infantry and other vehicles with ease... All I can say is 300 armour rep per second and a blaster turret still tears it away in seconds add the easier turning and you've pretty much got the best friggin turret in the game.
I once hacked a guys blaster tank, he came back at me with a rail tank of the same variety, I blew that **** up... He came back again but this time brought a friend (another damn tank) I blew him up then got the **** out before dieing... That turret is fine, if anything it needs a nerf... Nerf everything damn it! |
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