DUST Search - Profile Dampeners

Son-Of A-Gun wrote:

Crimson Cerberes wrote:

BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote:

Crimson Cerberes wrote:

[quote=BuTtHuRtPEepZ]The numbers don't exactly make sense. Assuming you have lv5 skill (10% damp), does the skill stack with the module? or is the skill applied first?

Example 1: Stacking

50db x (10% + Militia/Basic 15%) = 50 x 25% = 12.5 damp.
Thus 50 - 12.5 = 37.5

OR

Example 2: Multiplicative

50db x 10% x (militia/basic 15%)

The thread posted implies that it is multiplicative as opposed to additive. does this calculation follow the same model as damage modifiers and weapon proficiency?

Skills get multiplied outside of modules, and multiple skills get multiplied independently of each other

For instance, Core upgrades (+1% per lvl to CPU/PG) gets multiplied to the original PG figure along with engineering (+5% per lvl) in order to give you a max of 1.05*1.25=131.25% PG, instead of 130%.

Also, modules of the same type get added together:

1 cmpl dmg mod = 110% damage
2 complex damage mod = (1.10+1.087)=118.7% damage

with lvl 3 and adv dampner thats 50 * (1-0.2) * (1-0.06) = 37.6

For equivelent skill/module slots taken, you would need to increase adv scanners to 38 dB

This is not acurate. CCP rounds up at .6, so 37.6 becomes 38. Would need to increase to 39.

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BuTtHuRtPEepZ Raging Pack of Homosapiens 121	Posted - 2013.12.30 21:45:00 - [1] - Quote I've been getting really annoyed at things in this game recently including excessive tanks and scanners (seriously, f*ck scanners, they're cheap as hell) and have been trying different fits in order to go around them. How efficiently does profile dampeners prevent scanning? It sometimes works for me and sometimes doesnt. Anyone else trying out profile dampeners and getting success?
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 3051	Posted - 2013.12.30 22:09:00 - [2] - Quote It depends on what suit your wearing, what type of dampeners you have and how many you use. Can someone post the math lol I'm feeling lazy. My alts: GeneralJohnRipper, Draxus Prime, MoonEagle A, Long Evity And this is why I am the #1 forum warrior.
Lucrezia LeGrand 142	Posted - 2013.12.30 22:24:00 - [3] - Quote In a nutshell: let's say your profile is 45 (scout). a militia profile dampner will drop your profile 15%. 15% of 45 is 6.75. So your new profile is now 38.25. You are now invisible on radar to anyone that has a passive profile scan 39 or higher. however, if someone, for some reason, has the exact profile scan as your profile or lower, you pop up on their radar. Adv scanners have a profile scan of 36. so in order to drop below adv scanners you need to figure out how to drop your profile to 35 or lower. Easier to do on scouts, too much of a pain to bother with heavies. Proto scanners have a scan of 28. By this point you're either going to have to run complex dampners and/or have a ton of sp dropped into dampening your profile or you WILL be pinged on radar. btw, small tip, a scout at lvl 3 dropsuit with lvl 4 in profile dampening will be below 36 without any profile dampening modules.
trraacx Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 51	Posted - 2013.12.30 22:25:00 - [4] - Quote With a Dren Scout and lvl 3 profile dampening I've been able to chase people down halls and walk up behind a lot of people without being detected. It is very situational though. If It is a strong squad that is paying attention to their sorrounding it won't matter how much dampening you have.
Lucrezia LeGrand 142	Posted - 2013.12.30 22:32:00 - [5] - Quote yeah, forgot to mention, if someone sees you in game, then you will appear on their radar for as long as she/ he keeps you in their sights. If you hide behind a building or wall, you will still be a little red blip on their screen. Eventually, your blip will disappear if you continue to hide and stay out of their sights. How long this takes depends on how low your profile is relative to their profile scan.
ratamaq doc Edge Regiment 324	Posted - 2013.12.30 22:37:00 - [6] - Quote Medium Frames - Full skills + 1 complex will keep you away from all vehicles and the advanced scanner. Medium Frames - Full skills + 2 complex dampeners will keep you away from all but the 15 dB Proto scanner. Support this feedback post to have CCP correct either a rounding or stacking mistake with profile dampeners. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1645987#post1645987 Maths are in the thread To answer your question, Vehicle scanners have never been a problem for me because I have at least 1 complex dampener on all my fittings to avoid advance scanners. Yes. They work wonders for your game play. YouTube 30D Recruiting
ratamaq doc Edge Regiment 325	Posted - 2013.12.30 22:39:00 - [7] - Quote Lucrezia LeGrand wrote: ...Clip Proto scanners have a scan of 28. By this point you're either going to have to run complex dampners and/or have a ton of sp dropped into dampening your profile or you WILL be pinged on radar. Clip.. If you can fit complex dampeners, you have the skill maxed. There is no AUR version of this item YouTube 30D Recruiting
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 607	Posted - 2013.12.30 22:50:00 - [8] - Quote BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: I've been getting really annoyed at things in this game recently including excessive tanks and scanners (seriously, f*ck scanners, they're cheap as hell) and have been trying different fits in order to go around them. How efficiently does profile dampeners prevent scanning? It sometimes works for me and sometimes doesnt. Anyone else trying out profile dampeners and getting success? Profile Dampening 5 Complex profile dampener to block out ADV scanners, Need two to block out proto scanners. There isn't any parity between the two modules. Active Scanner +Suit> Profile Dampening + Any suit. When we where already hurting for NPE... They released the scanners and hurt them even more. Before they even fixed their maps Flow and reasoning and purpose.. its just a consistent practice of shooting oneself in the foot with CCP in DUST.
Drapedup Drippedout 0uter.Heaven 148	Posted - 2013.12.30 23:02:00 - [9] - Quote ratamaq doc wrote: Medium Frames - Full skills + 1 complex will keep you away from all vehicles and the advanced scanner. Medium Frames - Full skills + 2 complex dampeners will keep you away from all but the 15 dB Proto scanner. Support this feedback post to have CCP correct either a rounding or stacking mistake with profile dampeners. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1645987#post1645987 Maths are in the thread To answer your question, Vehicle scanners have never been a problem for me because I have at least 1 complex dampener on all my fittings to avoid advance scanners. Yes. They work wonders for your game play. ^ This. And read the linked thread, ratamaq makes some good points. It also highlights the not mentioned stacking penalty.
Piercing Serenity Fatal Absolution 484	Posted - 2013.12.30 23:13:00 - [10] - Quote I'm on my phone right now, so linking is a chore. But here is what you need to do (simply put) - With Profile Dampening L3, you will need both an enhanced dampener and a basic dampener to dodge advanced active scanners on a Med-frame (I can confirm this for assault, and I'm pretty sure this is true for logis). - With Profile Dampenening L5, you can beat Advanced active scanners with one complex dampener, and beat proto active scanners with two complex dampeners - Witg Profile Dampening L5, Galente Scout L5, and four complex dampeners, you can beat all active scanners DUST 514 BETA VET 16.2M Lifetime SP SH4T --> PFBHz --> PFB --> SH4T --> Fatal

DozersMouse XIII Ultramarine Corp 73	Posted - 2013.12.30 23:18:00 - [11] - Quote medium suits need dampening level 5 with 1 complex damp to get below 35db (vehicle scanners) imagine the s#!t you can kill from a throne.... fu@#!n Rome.
N1ck Comeau Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 1706	Posted - 2013.12.30 23:19:00 - [12] - Quote i use an assault suit (Minmatar) and i use one complex damp. It's rare that i get scanned. Minmatar Assault. Confused on what weapons i should use :/
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 6154	Posted - 2013.12.30 23:27:00 - [13] - Quote If you're trying to avoid scanners in anything other than a scout suit, you're doing something wrong. OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Scheneighnay McBob Bojo's School of the Trades 3353	Posted - 2013.12.30 23:51:00 - [14] - Quote Minmatar scout lv 4 with an enhanced profile dampener- I don't think I've ever been successfully scanned yet while wearing that. We used to have a time machine
Sylwester Dziewiecki Interregnum. 223	Posted - 2013.12.31 00:15:00 - [15] - Quote I have all skills related to hiding/detecting on 5. What pissing me off is that when your victim some how manage to notice you by luck, He knows that you are there, he may not see you on radar but he is absolutely sure that you are out there and he is prepared for encounter, he may call his colleagues and start searching you. In that kind of situation all that skill points that you invested in electronics have no real value. If you would invested them in armor or shield, they would work for you all the time. Electronics skill works for you once in a while, and they never guarantee 100% undetectable. Cloaking systems would change that . I meant that you should consider other ways to dominate on battlefield, because beining Scout it's pretty bumpy road. I'm here since may 2012, my EVE alter ego is Nosum Hseebnrido.
BuTtHuRtPEepZ Raging Pack of Homosapiens 124	Posted - 2013.12.31 00:31:00 - [16] - Quote Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote: I have all skills related to hiding/detecting on 5. What pissing me off is that when your victim some how manage to notice you by luck, He knows that you are there, he may not see you on radar but he is absolutely sure that you are out there and he is prepared for encounter, he may call his colleagues and start searching you. In that kind of situation all that skill points that you invested in electronics have no real value. If you would invested them in armor or shield, they would work for you all the time. Electronics skill works for you once in a while, and they never guarantee 100% undetectable. Cloaking systems would change that . I meant that you should consider other ways to dominate on battlefield, because beining Scout it's pretty bumpy road. Thats different. He is using tactical thinking to address the situation. A scanner is a cheap piece of equipment that gives away your position and removes thinking from the battlefield. I hate it. it allows the user to engage in battle, that doesnt make sense. It is a recon equipment, it should be for scout exclusively
deepfried salad gilliam Sanguine Knights 358	Posted - 2013.12.31 00:42:00 - [17] - Quote BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote: I have all skills related to hiding/detecting on 5. What pissing me off is that when your victim some how manage to notice you by luck, He knows that you are there, he may not see you on radar but he is absolutely sure that you are out there and he is prepared for encounter, he may call his colleagues and start searching you. In that kind of situation all that skill points that you invested in electronics have no real value. If you would invested them in armor or shield, they would work for you all the time. Electronics skill works for you once in a while, and they never guarantee 100% undetectable. Cloaking systems would change that . I meant that you should consider other ways to dominate on battlefield, because beining Scout it's pretty bumpy road. Thats different. He is using tactical thinking to address the situation. A scanner is a cheap piece of equipment that gives away your position and removes thinking from the battlefield. I hate it. it allows the user to engage in battle, that doesnt make sense. It is a recon equipment, it should be for scout exclusively no welcome to new eden and exclusivity shouldn't happen "May God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ give you grace and peace" - Second Corinthians chapter one verse two.
hgghyujh Expert Intervention Caldari State 203	Posted - 2013.12.31 00:46:00 - [18] - Quote BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote: I have all skills related to hiding/detecting on 5. What pissing me off is that when your victim some how manage to notice you by luck, He knows that you are there, he may not see you on radar but he is absolutely sure that you are out there and he is prepared for encounter, he may call his colleagues and start searching you. In that kind of situation all that skill points that you invested in electronics have no real value. If you would invested them in armor or shield, they would work for you all the time. Electronics skill works for you once in a while, and they never guarantee 100% undetectable. Cloaking systems would change that . I meant that you should consider other ways to dominate on battlefield, because beining Scout it's pretty bumpy road. Thats different. He is using tactical thinking to address the situation. A scanner is a cheap piece of equipment that gives away your position and removes thinking from the battlefield. I hate it. it allows the user to engage in battle, that doesnt make sense. It is a recon equipment, it should be for scout exclusively ............. then caldari and minm shouldn't be able to fit armor or amarr and gallent sheild, only logis should be able to carry rep tools nano hives and uplinks, heavys shouldn't be able to carry light weapons, only scouts can wear dampers, range mods, precision mods, kincats, and cardregs. ******* hell kinda missing the design of this game aren't you.
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 747	Posted - 2013.12.31 01:05:00 - [19] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: It depends on what suit your wearing, what type of dampeners you have and how many you use. Can someone post the math lol I'm feeling lazy. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=115709 There you go. {:)}{3GÇó> "I came here to chew bubblegum and kick @$$, and I'm all out of bubblegum."
One Eyed King Eyniletti Rangers Minmatar Republic 107	Posted - 2013.12.31 01:33:00 - [20] - Quote Some more maths here too. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1349781#post1349781 Nova knifing scout masochist. I would be a sadist, but CCP won't let me.

BuTtHuRtPEepZ Raging Pack of Homosapiens 124	Posted - 2013.12.31 02:07:00 - [21] - Quote The numbers don't exactly make sense. Assuming you have lv5 skill (10% damp), does the skill stack with the module? or is the skill applied first? Example 1: Stacking 50db x (10% + Militia/Basic 15%) = 50 x 25% = 12.5 damp. Thus 50 - 12.5 = 37.5 OR Example 2: Multiplicative 50db x 10% x (militia/basic 15%) The thread posted implies that it is multiplicative as opposed to additive. does this calculation follow the same model as damage modifiers and weapon proficiency?
Crimson Cerberes Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance 153	Posted - 2013.12.31 02:10:00 - [22] - Quote BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: The numbers don't exactly make sense. Assuming you have lv5 skill (10% damp), does the skill stack with the module? or is the skill applied first? Example 1: Stacking 50db x (10% + Militia/Basic 15%) = 50 x 25% = 12.5 damp. Thus 50 - 12.5 = 37.5 OR Example 2: Multiplicative 50db x 10% x (militia/basic 15%) The thread posted implies that it is multiplicative as opposed to additive. does this calculation follow the same model as damage modifiers and weapon proficiency? Skills get multiplied outside of modules, and multiple skills get multiplied independently of each other For instance, Core upgrades (+1% per lvl to CPU/PG) gets multiplied to the original PG figure along with engineering (+5% per lvl) in order to give you a max of 1.05*1.25=131.25% more PG, instead of 130%. Also, modules of the same type get multiplied together: 1 cmpl dmg mod = 110% damage 2 complex damage mod = (1.10+1.087)=118.7% damage
BuTtHuRtPEepZ Raging Pack of Homosapiens 124	Posted - 2013.12.31 02:29:00 - [23] - Quote Crimson Cerberes wrote: BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: The numbers don't exactly make sense. Assuming you have lv5 skill (10% damp), does the skill stack with the module? or is the skill applied first? Example 1: Stacking 50db x (10% + Militia/Basic 15%) = 50 x 25% = 12.5 damp. Thus 50 - 12.5 = 37.5 OR Example 2: Multiplicative 50db x 10% x (militia/basic 15%) The thread posted implies that it is multiplicative as opposed to additive. does this calculation follow the same model as damage modifiers and weapon proficiency? Skills get multiplied outside of modules, and multiple skills get multiplied independently of each other For instance, Core upgrades (+1% per lvl to CPU/PG) gets multiplied to the original PG figure along with engineering (+5% per lvl) in order to give you a max of 1.05*1.25=131.25% PG, instead of 130%. Also, modules of the same type get added together: 1 cmpl dmg mod = 110% damage 2 complex damage mod = (1.10+1.087)=118.7% damage that doesnt seem entirely fair that it requires a complex module to neutralize an advanced equipment. I would think it would make more sense that modules/equipment/weapons of the same tier should balance each other out. I propose moving the scan profile of adv. active scanners from 36 to 37
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 748	Posted - 2013.12.31 02:35:00 - [24] - Quote Crimson Cerberes wrote: 2 complex damage mod = (1.10+1.087)=118.7% damage this is inaccurate. Sould be: 110.00% GÇó 108.69% = 119.559% Also, the modules do not have to be from the same tier to stack. Stacking is applied by affect, so if you have multiple modules applying the same affect then stacking applies to all. The best example of this would be with the old tank shield passive/active hardeners and the damage control unit. Stacking applies to all. Equally stacking also applies with same modules across teirs. {:)}{3GÇó> "I came here to chew bubblegum and kick @$$, and I'm all out of bubblegum."
Crimson Cerberes Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance 153	Posted - 2013.12.31 02:37:00 - [25] - Quote BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: Crimson Cerberes wrote: BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: The numbers don't exactly make sense. Assuming you have lv5 skill (10% damp), does the skill stack with the module? or is the skill applied first? Example 1: Stacking 50db x (10% + Militia/Basic 15%) = 50 x 25% = 12.5 damp. Thus 50 - 12.5 = 37.5 OR Example 2: Multiplicative 50db x 10% x (militia/basic 15%) The thread posted implies that it is multiplicative as opposed to additive. does this calculation follow the same model as damage modifiers and weapon proficiency? Skills get multiplied outside of modules, and multiple skills get multiplied independently of each other For instance, Core upgrades (+1% per lvl to CPU/PG) gets multiplied to the original PG figure along with engineering (+5% per lvl) in order to give you a max of 1.051.25=131.25% PG, instead of 130%. Also, modules of the same type get added together: 1 cmpl dmg mod = 110% damage 2 complex damage mod = (1.10+1.087)=118.7% damage that doesnt seem entirely fair that it requires a complex module to neutralize an advanced equipment. I would think it would make more sense that modules/equipment/weapons of the same tier should balance each other out. I propose moving the scan profile of adv. active scanners from 36 to 37 Well lets check the math on medium frames with lvl 3 and adv dampner thats 50 (1-0.2) * (1-0.06) = 37.6 For equivelent skill/module slots taken, you would need to increase adv scanners to 38 dB
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 748	Posted - 2013.12.31 02:48:00 - [26] - Quote Crimson Cerberes wrote: BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: Crimson Cerberes wrote: [quote=BuTtHuRtPEepZ]The numbers don't exactly make sense. Assuming you have lv5 skill (10% damp), does the skill stack with the module? or is the skill applied first? Example 1: Stacking 50db x (10% + Militia/Basic 15%) = 50 x 25% = 12.5 damp. Thus 50 - 12.5 = 37.5 OR Example 2: Multiplicative 50db x 10% x (militia/basic 15%) The thread posted implies that it is multiplicative as opposed to additive. does this calculation follow the same model as damage modifiers and weapon proficiency? Skills get multiplied outside of modules, and multiple skills get multiplied independently of each other For instance, Core upgrades (+1% per lvl to CPU/PG) gets multiplied to the original PG figure along with engineering (+5% per lvl) in order to give you a max of 1.051.25=131.25% PG, instead of 130%. Also, modules of the same type get added together: 1 cmpl dmg mod = 110% damage 2 complex damage mod = (1.10+1.087)=118.7% damage with lvl 3 and adv dampner thats 50 (1-0.2) * (1-0.06) = 37.6 For equivelent skill/module slots taken, you would need to increase adv scanners to 38 dB This is not acurate. CCP rounds up at .6, so 37.6 becomes 38. Would need to increase to 39. {:)}{3GÇó> "I came here to chew bubblegum and kick @$$, and I'm all out of bubblegum."
Crimson Cerberes Hammer Of Light Covenant of the Phoenix Alliance 156	Posted - 2013.12.31 02:48:00 - [27] - Quote Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Crimson Cerberes wrote: BuTtHuRtPEepZ wrote: Crimson Cerberes wrote: [quote=BuTtHuRtPEepZ]The numbers don't exactly make sense. Assuming you have lv5 skill (10% damp), does the skill stack with the module? or is the skill applied first? Example 1: Stacking 50db x (10% + Militia/Basic 15%) = 50 x 25% = 12.5 damp. Thus 50 - 12.5 = 37.5 OR Example 2: Multiplicative 50db x 10% x (militia/basic 15%) The thread posted implies that it is multiplicative as opposed to additive. does this calculation follow the same model as damage modifiers and weapon proficiency? Skills get multiplied outside of modules, and multiple skills get multiplied independently of each other For instance, Core upgrades (+1% per lvl to CPU/PG) gets multiplied to the original PG figure along with engineering (+5% per lvl) in order to give you a max of 1.051.25=131.25% PG, instead of 130%. Also, modules of the same type get added together: 1 cmpl dmg mod = 110% damage 2 complex damage mod = (1.10+1.087)=118.7% damage with lvl 3 and adv dampner thats 50 (1-0.2) * (1-0.06) = 37.6 For equivelent skill/module slots taken, you would need to increase adv scanners to 38 dB This is not acurate. CCP rounds up at .6, so 37.6 becomes 38. Would need to increase to 39. OH I didn't know that, thanks.
Ghost Kaisar Titans of Phoenix 1398	Posted - 2013.12.31 03:01:00 - [28] - Quote Lucrezia LeGrand wrote: btw, small tip, a scout at lvl 3 dropsuit with lvl 4 in profile dampening will be below 36 without any profile dampening modules. However, it is not enough to avoid Vehicle active scanners, which detect at 35 dB. Annoying as hell. Now I HAVE to get scout lvl 4. Minmatar Faction Warfare: Let's get Organized


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