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The Keyboard/mouse MYTH and it's underlying problems

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Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 569	Posted - 2013.12.29 01:37:00 - [1] - Quote Stinker Butt wrote: The turn speed and movement with a mouse is many times faster and has more precision than the DS3. It's more difficult to make fine movements quickly with a DS3 than a mouse. I use a move controller. But on the rare occasion that I'm not using the move, I use a kb/mouse because for me it is still superior - with or without aim assist. If the average player stats are the same with kb/mouse vs DS3, then any argument would be invalid. unfortunately we don't have that information available to us. Edit: that guy in the video doesn't even move. that's not realistic at all. shooting while dancing makes all the difference. The more the guy shoots the stronger the aim assist... the more you move your straffing on a DS3 and the less you touch your aim joystick... the better the aim assist locks on... that straffy moving fight your talking about is benefited even more by aim assist. M/KB isn't a precision device in anyway... frame skips and drops will throw off any consistency with using your mouse... So muscle memory under any lag is useless... and considering the state of the frame rate and lag issues currently in DUST... DS3 will at least track skipping and stop frame targets... and has a consistency with a competition controller where you can match the full moving speed targets with little no no input into the DS3... even with the best aim out there on mouse... its near impossible to track a moving target that isn't 70m away.. Basically all this isn't really true... But you use the Move right? and have a giant opinion on mouse and keyboard
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 569	Posted - 2013.12.29 01:55:00 - [2] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: XxGhazbaranxX wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: Bullet Magnetism? You mean Aim Assit curves bullets? Yes. Although not "as extreme", bullet magnetism is still present in Dust 514. The first day of AA you could shoot right next to the target and still hit him as if you where aiming right at his face. Now it's less but still present. Enough so that if you look closely at recent footage you can notice it and if you test it you can see it for yourself ^^. You realise that its hit detection, don't you? Also good job at skirting my main point. Stop with this hit detection crap Monkey. It isn't even close to that being the issue. We have had good Hit detection. We have had Aim assist like this in dust. Guess what the problem was then? Aim assist... The entire community at that time mostly hand picked by CCP(for gamer credentials) or actually payed to play DUST beta... knew this..its was a giant community protest AGAINST aim assist. still this problem will always happen in DUST with Aim assist...always will be the problem and no matter how much you don't feel like you should have to Aim in a FPS..... or that not having to worry about aiming makes this a tactical shooter...This game suffers, every time we cater to this lazy idea players have at playing a FPS, DUST takes a hit. Games are not supposed to be easy... and Casual's don't expect games to be easy. If everyone was dieing to bullets that are actually aim'ed by that player... then TKK is not an issue in anyway... all the OP weapons complained about are no longer OP.... its player skill. But everyone praising Aim assist wants DUST to be a game where everyone hides behind boxes... All we have is a giant cowards game right now everytime a new player leaves a box 3 new players lock on with aim assist and hes dead in half a second.. So we just have a bunch of new players cowering behind the very few boxes and structures in DUST... and we have lost any challenge... and any real sense of achievement that made DUST magical in the moment to moment gameplay.
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 569	Posted - 2013.12.29 02:04:00 - [3] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: KBM uses digital input, you are always maximum one way or maximum the other. This allows for what I like to call the texan 2 step, which is the rapid strafing with in a confined area. Now before 1.4, before Aim Assist and Hit detection fixes, it was possibly to texan 2 step THROUGH bullets. You would literally do a matrix. What you are talking about is Stutter stepping on the DS3... and the fact that you can't recognize it speaks pretty loudly.. .to why u get face rolled by the players that know it. This was always a straffy tracky shooter... if a target simply moving makes aiming to hard for you... ... wtf are you playing a FPS for? My gawd... these forums and the stupidity its breeding.
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 569	Posted - 2013.12.29 02:21:00 - [4] - Quote gg JKl wrote: http://gizmodo.com/5593116/were-pc-gamers-too-good-for-microsofts-cross+platform-gaming-project Welcome to something done near what a decade ago? then Unreal tournament and gears of wars was talking about CROSS PLATFORM Meaning one player on a crazy hardware improved PC and mouse and keyboard... and one on a console with a game pad... Stop this propaganda bullshit that has nothing to do with this situation. This is accurate information regrarding being M/KB support on a console... Quote: When bringing Counter-Strike to PS3 and Xbox, we wanted to make sure we weren't 'noobing' it, or dumbing it down. The game has an entry point for new players in its Casual Mode, but it's not ticking off the top players," he said. "We think that if you're really good with the controller, and you can match the fidelity of movement of the mouse and keyboard, then you'll hold your own. If not, well, you'll just be matched with people who play like you," Faliszek said, adding that PS3 players can also use a mouse and keyboard if they choose. Valve Software
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 571	Posted - 2013.12.29 02:31:00 - [5] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: Bethhy wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: XxGhazbaranxX wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: Bullet Magnetism? You mean Aim Assit curves bullets? Yes. Although not "as extreme", bullet magnetism is still present in Dust 514. The first day of AA you could shoot right next to the target and still hit him as if you where aiming right at his face. Now it's less but still present. Enough so that if you look closely at recent footage you can notice it and if you test it you can see it for yourself ^^. You realise that its hit detection, don't you? Also good job at skirting my main point. Stop with this hit detection crap Monkey. It isn't even close to that being the issue. We have had good Hit detection. We have had Aim assist like this in dust. Guess what the problem was then? Aim assist... The entire community at that time mostly hand picked by CCP(for gamer credentials) or actually payed to play DUST beta... knew this..its was a giant community protest AGAINST aim assist. still this problem will always happen in DUST with Aim assist...always will be the problem and no matter how much you don't feel like you should have to Aim in a FPS..... or that not having to worry about aiming makes this a tactical shooter...This game suffers, every time we cater to this lazy idea players have at playing a FPS, DUST takes a hit. Games are not supposed to be easy... and Casual's don't expect games to be easy. If everyone was dieing to bullets that are actually aim'ed by that player... then TKK is not an issue in anyway... all the OP weapons complained about are no longer OP.... its player skill. But everyone praising Aim assist wants DUST to be a game where everyone hides behind boxes... All we have is a giant cowards game right now everytime a new player leaves a box 3 new players lock on with aim assist and hes dead in half a second.. So we just have a bunch of new players cowering behind the very few boxes and structures in DUST... and we have lost any challenge... and any real sense of achievement that made DUST magical in the moment to moment gameplay. Stutter Stepping, Chop Strafing call it what you like, it can't be done on a standard DS3 contoller due to its analogue input medium. To stutter strafe requires the user to rapidly switch between left and right on the joystick, this causes acceleration. A physical delay between moving in different directions stops stutter strafing working on the joystick, instead you get a rather lazy sway. ????????????????????????????????????????? AHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH so you really are just that... ahahahahah You really don't know a thing about what your talking about. And even worse you have no idea about DUST... Aim assist was the 1.4 patch in September. Hit detection revamps was done in 1.5. And one day you will get stutter stepping.. and its a very real skill in DUST. The absolute bullshit you spew over and over to defend your will to not actually aim for yourself... to the point where you want to give keyboard and mouse aim assist is sick... GO play checkers you hurt this community and the game.
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 575	Posted - 2013.12.29 03:02:00 - [6] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: Bethhy wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: Bethhy wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: You realise that its hit detection, don't you? Also good job at skirting my main point. Stop with this hit detection crap Monkey. It isn't even close to that being the issue. We have had good Hit detection. We have had Aim assist like this in dust. Guess what the problem was then? Aim assist... The entire community at that time mostly hand picked by CCP(for gamer credentials) or actually payed to play DUST beta... knew this..its was a giant community protest AGAINST aim assist. still this problem will always happen in DUST with Aim assist...always will be the problem and no matter how much you don't feel like you should have to Aim in a FPS..... or that not having to worry about aiming makes this a tactical shooter...This game suffers, every time we cater to this lazy idea players have at playing a FPS, DUST takes a hit. Games are not supposed to be easy... and Casual's don't expect games to be easy. If everyone was dieing to bullets that are actually aim'ed by that player... then TKK is not an issue in anyway... all the OP weapons complained about are no longer OP.... its player skill. But everyone praising Aim assist wants DUST to be a game where everyone hides behind boxes... All we have is a giant cowards game right now everytime a new player leaves a box 3 new players lock on with aim assist and hes dead in half a second.. So we just have a bunch of new players cowering behind the very few boxes and structures in DUST... and we have lost any challenge... and any real sense of achievement that made DUST magical in the moment to moment gameplay. Stutter Stepping, Chop Strafing call it what you like, it can't be done on a standard DS3 contoller due to its analogue input medium. To stutter strafe requires the user to rapidly switch between left and right on the joystick, this causes acceleration. A physical delay between moving in different directions stops stutter strafing working on the joystick, instead you get a rather lazy sway. ????????????????????????????????????????? AHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH so you really are just that... ahahahahah You really don't know a thing about what your talking about. And even worse you have no idea about DUST... Aim assist was the 1.4 patch in September. Hit detection revamps was done in 1.5. And one day you will get stutter stepping.. and its a very real skill in DUST. The absolute bullshit you spew over and over to defend your will to not actually aim for yourself... to the point where you want to give keyboard and mouse aim assist is sick... GO play checkers you hurt this community and the game. Yes of course because the guy who went to university and did coursework on input methods and their pros and cons in games for his computer games module is wrong. My sincerest Apologies o All knowing master! The OP said he doesn't understand why KBM doesn't have Aim Assist, there is no reason why it can't? Oh and here are the patch notes for 1.4 notice the 'EVEN MORE HIT DETECTION IMPROVEMENTS' 1.4 Patch notes And finally you may call it rubbish but I can explain what you blindly believe to be false. Its like playing chess with a pigeon, no matter what logic I use, no matter what tactics I use, in the end the pigeon will **** on the board, knock over a few pieces and strut around like owns the place. Read the forums hit detection was ABYSMAL in 1.4 ask anyone check the history of the forum rants... you just have to actually know whats going on in DUST. "Dat Hit detection" didnt even start entering peoples profiles on PSN until 1.6 because hit detection sucked... we all thought aim assist was the band aid for hit detection. EVERYONE. and most said CCP would band aid hit detection. You can goto school; and assume some professor will tell you the pros and cons and teach you how to competitively play a FPS on a gamepad with stutter stepping... or the FACT that it is USED and actively taught... in DUST... and some of the best in the game know and use it... then you say it doesn't exist? Welcome to the thing used since chromosome that apparently is impossible.??????????? clueless much. Stutter stepping is fact in DUST no matter what your teacher told you. Yet again even discussing a keyboard and mouse having aim assist should make you throw up in your mouth a little... The fact that players are buying a 60 dollar peice of hardware and actively using a Aim assist on the keyboard and mouse should leave you outraged as a FPS player... Instead we get this response for 3 months from you monkey "there is no problem everything is ok because my teacher told me so" FML .......... *Edit 100% right 1.6 was hit detection fixes, thought i put or meant 1.6? but clearly was a mistake regardless.
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 577	Posted - 2013.12.29 03:29:00 - [7] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: I love how your argument against me has absolutely no logic in it. I have attempted to educate you as I have been, but like the pigeon you ignore fact and logic. Because you say it is, it must be so. If the OP wants Aim Assist let him have, if you realy are as elite as you say you are, you would understand the need for a condensed skill base, you would welcome the challenge of going against aim assissted players, without aim assisst. Edit: CEOPyrex complaing about Aim Assist and Hit detection. http://youtu.be/6QI4wmuzjmU If your quoting Pyrex about anything it says a lot... to everyone. http://www.pcgamer.com/2013/03/13/call-of-duty-red-orchestra-2-interview/ Compressed player skill gaps are one thing... and actually something almost every major FPS title is actively moving away from. besides CoD and and BF4 which are building terrible reputations in the FPS community. There is a reason Kill zone has no aim assist. If this was a fast 1 shot headshot deaths with near every gun sure aim assist could help? still very debatable... Aim assist hasn't compressed player skill gapsin DUST. Its made the gap from a new player to a Veteran player with skill points and health even bigger... now that there is no personal aiming skill involved.. This game isn't one with finite health points and everyone is on a even playing field and we need Aim assist to condense the player skill on the battlefield so it apeals to everyone better.. If you give both parties super aim, then give one party massive bonus's in health and damage... and expect player skill to be to be condensed? Its a hilarious thought. and makes no sense in practicality.. Yet again so you understand Stutter stepping is fact in DUST. no matter what your trying to pretend. its fact.

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