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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1414
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Posted - 2013.12.08 15:45:00 -
[1] - Quote
Yeah I like how they haven't justified why they're only doing a vehicle respec. Although that is only because they can't justify it.
They're letting pilots skill out of vehicles, but not infantry into vehicles. Sounds really legit.
Changes are major enough for pilots to get a second chance to decide to skill into vehicles or not, that's fine, however since the changes are this major infantry should get the same chance. How could people know what vehicles would be like in 1.7 when they spent their SP?
If people say infantry shouldn't be able to skill into vehicles, then don't allow pilots to skill out of vehicles either. It's that simple.
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1415
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Posted - 2013.12.08 15:58:00 -
[2] - Quote
low genius wrote:the devs have answered several times.
ccp doesn't do respecs. zipper does. Funnily enough this isn't even about being for or against respecs, it's about giving everyone the same options and treatment.
Remember when they made these skill tree changes and gave everyone a (optional) full respec? I don't see any difference in this situation.
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1415
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Posted - 2013.12.08 16:03:00 -
[3] - Quote
Roger Cordill wrote:Message from Godin: Stop being such self-entitled pricks and be lucky they aren't resetting you for being dicks to them all the time........ Self-entitled? For trying to give equal options and treatment to everybody instead of some people getting advantages?
More like CCP being dicks to their players.
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1415
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Posted - 2013.12.08 16:04:00 -
[4] - Quote
Roger Cordill wrote:Message from Godin: So a complete redo of the skill tree, not just a reduced skill level change, plus a complete overhaul of said vehicles, and you don't see the difference? Riiight So you missed my post about infantry should get the chance to skill into the heavily changed vehicles just as pilots get the chance to skill out of the heavily changed vehicles?
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1415
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Posted - 2013.12.08 16:15:00 -
[5] - Quote
Harpyja wrote:The problem I see with giving everyone a respec is that a lot of players would abuse it. Only those that deserve a respec are vehicle pilots that will remain vehicle pilots and infantry that want to become vehicle pilots. But of course, nobody can prove that they fall under either of these two categories. A lot of infantry players would use this respec to either skill into the new FOTM or further improve their skills because they made a mistake with a skill or two. In the first case, it's not healthy for players to spec into the FOTM and in the latter case, their decisions to skill up an unnecessary skill would not be consequential.
This respec for vehicle skills only is not perfect, but it won't be as disastrous as if everyone were given a respec. There's just no way to differentiate between those that need a respec and those that will abuse it to their own advantage. There's a lot more infantry than pilots, and pilots skilling out of vehicles into the new FOTM won't be as terrible as allowing everyone to skill into the new FOTM. Reasonable arguments, thank you for that.
FOTM: Perhaps CCP should get better at balancing, so we wouldn't have this probem? Also this comes back to my post about how this vehicle respec gives advantages to pilots, why should pilots be able to skill into FOTM, but not infantry as well? CCP should be treating all of their players fairly, and a vehicle respec won't do that.
Players getting to re-do mistakes: Again, why should pilots get to spend their SP (in infantry skills) based on the current situation, while infantry can't? Again, this is an unfair advantage to pilots.
CCP HAS to do a full respec unless they're forcing the refunded SP to be used where it came from (I don't support this option).
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1415
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Posted - 2013.12.08 16:19:00 -
[6] - Quote
Roger Cordill wrote:Well, most infantry didn't have to suffer for 6 months straight, and most infantry wouldn't want to be pilots in the first place. And if they did, they would've skilled into it. Plus, It's not like we have a choice; many of the skills inside of the vehicle skill trees are either getting removed, or getting completely changed, so We needed to get a respec, or lose SP due to said skills being removed, or skills completely changing due to said changes.
Like I said, stop being self-entitled pricks, and stop asking. Pilots chose to be pilots, so why can they now skill into infantry when infantry can't skill into vehicles?
Edit: Pilots suffered for 6 months? Me looks at Scouts and Heavies?
Edit 2: Also, who's really the self-entitled prick? The one that cares about equal options and treatment for everyone or the one that doesn't? Just asking.
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1415
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Posted - 2013.12.08 16:26:00 -
[7] - Quote
Aikuchi Tomaru wrote:They do care what we think. But in case you didn't notice: Not everybody is in favor of a respec. There are at least as many people who are against it as there are people who want one. Then there are the ones who just don't care. And then there is the point that the last skill respec was because the game got officially released. And the point that you get SP all the time and instead of QQing you can just wait a few weeks. Read my earlier post where I said:
"Funnily enough this isn't even about being for or against respecs, it's about giving everyone the same options and treatment."
Pilots can skill out of vehicles, but infantry can't skill into vehicles. That's unfair treatment and has nothing to do with the usual for or against respecs arguments.
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1415
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Posted - 2013.12.08 16:32:00 -
[8] - Quote
Aikuchi Tomaru wrote:Pilots can skill out of vehicles because the whole vehicle tree was changed. They didn't have another choice because some of the old skills don't even exist anymore. That wouldn't translate to 1.7 without a respec.
And well: Everybody still has the same options. You can, even as an infantrist, just wait a few weeks and spend your next SP into vehicles. Nothing is stopping you from doing this. Why do you think you should instantly be able to spec the whole vehicle tree to level 5 even though you only played as an infantrist so far? Because pilots can go all infantry? How should infantry have known what vehicles would be like in 1.7 months ago when they skilled into infantry?
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1415
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Posted - 2013.12.08 16:44:00 -
[9] - Quote
Roger Cordill wrote:Message from Godin: Look, it's already been decided. You're not getting one, nor is any other infantry player. It doesn't matter what you say, they're not giving you one. And seeing this, if you skilled mostly into medium frames (seeing how you're acting, I'm assuming so), then you're not getting one when they bring in the racial Light Frames and Heavy Frames. The only time you'll probably get one is when tiercide happens in the year 2020. Just stop asking........ I don't know why people always feel the need to make assumptions, especially not when I'm just trying to get equal options and treatment for everyone.
If you really want to know though, I can say that I'm getting about 2.5 million SP refunded from vehicles that I chose to skill into months ago. I don't think it's fair I get to pump that into infantry when they can't go the other way.
I'm also more than satisfied with my infantry SP, which is mostly in medium suits yes, but I also recently skilled a bit into Scouts (which I don't regret).
I also didn't skill into any FOTM, I have 0 SP in Caldari Logi for example.
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1415
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Posted - 2013.12.08 17:12:00 -
[10] - Quote
Bethhy wrote:Everyone had basic Proto suit's then because you had to. This wasn't an optional choice to go into a specific weapon or FOTM.
This wass a forced choice by CCP to make everyone spend over 1 million skill point's on a skill point sink for something no one could escape from leveling into. It was a respec for 99% of the people who where affected.
A respec now would cater to a very small percentage of people that would even "need" it. Refunding the SP used for level 4 and 5 is what CCP would usually do in that situation.
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1419
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Posted - 2013.12.08 21:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
Lanius Pulvis wrote: This argument falls apart soon as you start talking about player mistakes. This isn't a case of pilots spending SP without forethought and then crying about it til they get a respec. If it was I'd just say HTFU. This respec is because CCP apparently created skills without forethought and is now trying to rectify that by removing some of the skills we've already invested in
Ehm, I've never said anything about pilots shouldn't get a respec. I'm saying that unless everyone else get a respec as well, pilots will be getting unfair advantages.
It's not about infantry wanting a respec because they messed up their skills. It's about getting a respec so that infantry has a chance and a choice (not neccesarily taking it) to skill into vehicles, just as pilots have the chance and choice to skill out of vehicles.
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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Bendtner92
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
1419
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Posted - 2013.12.08 21:27:00 -
[12] - Quote
Mobius Wyvern wrote:Yeah, so maybe they plan to redo infantry and then offer them the same deal in 1.8 or 1.9? In that case, there'd be no issue. There is no plan to redo infantry, not for the foreseeable future at least, plus it took them what, 4 months to redo vehicles? I'm sure it would take more than that to redo infantry completely then.
Also then we'd just be back at the same issue as infantry then would get unfair advantages over pilots...
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
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