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odd thing about module stacking

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Quil Evrything DUST University Ivy League 467	Posted - 2013.12.06 00:25:00 - [1] - Quote I just noticed an odd thing about module stacking. if the calculator at http://wiki.dust514.info/index.php?title=Stacking_Penalties is to be believed, a funny thing happens around 20% bonus. For two or more modules of the same power: If they are UNDER 20%, there is a penalty. If they are OVER 20%, there is a bonus. (and 20% itself, is about neutral) For example, 2x25% modules, gets not 50%, but 52%total bonus. 2x30, gives you 63% and those rare 45% bonus modules.. will give you 101% for 2 of them.
Xocoyol Zaraoul Superior Genetics 1595	Posted - 2013.12.06 00:26:00 - [2] - Quote The U.S. government has quietly become the nationGÇÖs largest landowner by funneling its real-estate investments through a shadow organization called the National Park Service Closed Beta Vet Reading the forums detracts from overall enjoyment of the game
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 381	Posted - 2013.12.06 00:31:00 - [3] - Quote Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: The U.S. government has quietly become the nationGÇÖs largest landowner by funneling its real-estate investments through a shadow organization called the National Park Service The US government owns all the land in the US already, not sure what you're trying to say there... if one "purchases" property all you're doing is getting a substitute deed from the US governmental offices. Quil Evrything wrote: I just noticed an odd thing about module stacking. if the calculator at http://wiki.dust514.info/index.php?title=Stacking_Penalties is to be believed, a funny thing happens around 20% bonus. For two or more modules of the same power: If they are UNDER 20%, there is a penalty. If they are OVER 20%, there is a bonus. (and 20% itself, is about neutral) For example, 2x25% modules, gets not 50%, but 52%total bonus. 2x30, gives you 63% and those rare 45% bonus modules.. will give you 101% for 2 of them. Bonus in regards to what? There are several types of status changes and hundreds of differing calculations. Where is this, and what are you talking about? If you can read this, it means you are reading. Unless you are skimming
Xocoyol Zaraoul Superior Genetics 1598	Posted - 2013.12.06 00:33:00 - [4] - Quote Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote: Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: The U.S. government has quietly become the nationGÇÖs largest landowner by funneling its real-estate investments through a shadow organization called the National Park Service The US government owns all the land in the US already, not sure what you're trying to say there... if one "purchases" property all you're doing is getting a substitute deed from the US governmental offices. http://www.theonion.com/articles/slowwitted-conspiracy-theorist-convinced-governmen,34749/ Closed Beta Vet Reading the forums detracts from overall enjoyment of the game
Fizzer94 L.O.T.I.S. Public Disorder. 1119	Posted - 2013.12.06 00:35:00 - [5] - Quote This got derailed fast... Also, wouldn't the Russian Gov't own the most land? [+ªa¦Ç+¦++-ö-Å94] Level 1 Forum Warrior The Plasma Cannon is not underpowered
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 382	Posted - 2013.12.06 00:39:00 - [6] - Quote Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote: Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: The U.S. government has quietly become the nationGÇÖs largest landowner by funneling its real-estate investments through a shadow organization called the National Park Service The US government owns all the land in the US already, not sure what you're trying to say there... if one "purchases" property all you're doing is getting a substitute deed from the US governmental offices. http://www.theonion.com/articles/slowwitted-conspiracy-theorist-convinced-governmen,34749/ The onion's reporters also claimed seeing vampires, werewolves and having relationships with the "Bat Boy"... Their sibling paper often has rants to return at it... http://weeklyworldnews.com/headlines/54914/the-onion-to-shut-down-after-offensive-tweet/ Both the Onion and "weekly world" are faked tabloids. Also they're notorious for being behind the times as SpaceX has taken up a few NASA missions, and they are not funded by the US government.... but of course actually doing research is not what they do so..... meh... If you can read this, it means you are reading. Unless you are skimming
Quil Evrything DUST University Ivy League 467	Posted - 2013.12.06 00:41:00 - [7] - Quote Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote: Bonus in regards to what? There are several types of status changes and hundreds of differing calculations. Where is this, and what are you talking about? I mean, generally when you use two types of module, people commonly reference, "oh look out for the stacking penalties." I just wanted to share the knowlege that if the module bonus for all of the type you are using, is above or equal to 20%, then you dont really get a "penalty", compared to just adding the module values together. and fyi, no there are not hundreds of different calculations. There is ONE standard stacking penalty formula, when using multiple modules that affect the same stat There is a nice convenient javascript calculator for effective values, at http://wiki.dust514.info/index.php?title=Stacking_Penalties
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 384	Posted - 2013.12.06 02:18:00 - [8] - Quote That value looks iffy... ingame I have 2 15% mods on my tank plus about 3 levels of additional boost (so 6%) and the result is about 33% resist on the readout. If you can read this, it means you are reading. Unless you are skimming
Sgt Buttscratch 1092	Posted - 2013.12.06 02:23:00 - [9] - Quote Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote: Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: The U.S. government has quietly become the nationGÇÖs largest landowner by funneling its real-estate investments through a shadow organization called the National Park Service The US government owns all the land in the US already, not sure what you're trying to say there... +1 loool funny suff I stick my weiner in two buns and and then give it the gas Sour cream from my spleen into Levi jeans
Sgt Buttscratch 1092	Posted - 2013.12.06 02:24:00 - [10] - Quote Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote: Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: The U.S. government has quietly become the nationGÇÖs largest landowner by funneling its real-estate investments through a shadow organization called the National Park Service The US government owns all the land in the US already, not sure what you're trying to say there... if one "purchases" property all you're doing is getting a substitute deed from the US governmental offices. http://www.theonion.com/articles/slowwitted-conspiracy-theorist-convinced-governmen,34749/ you do realize what The Onion is right? I stick my weiner in two buns and and then give it the gas Sour cream from my spleen into Levi jeans

Dunk Mujunk RestlessSpirits 365	Posted - 2013.12.06 02:34:00 - [11] - Quote I heard a conspirarcy theory recently, saying all land owned by the United States was sold to the IMF (think it was IMF, international monitary fund or something like that) after WW2 by Truman, and technically America is a corporation, not a country, and that people in America are technically employees, not citizens. True or not, I have no idea. But it honestly sounds about right. Every time I try to walk away, something makes me turn around and stay, and I can't tell you why Eagles Dust Tribute
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 526	Posted - 2013.12.06 03:21:00 - [12] - Quote Can't believe this thread went on so long without anyone being able to answer the question in the OP. To the OP: As to the accuracy of that website, I cannot speak, nor do I have the desire to check their number or yours. I will tell you how the math works and the you can determine whether or not your website is right or wrong. Here we go: Th stacking of modules works thusly with a module with a bonus of 10%, such as a damage mod: x GÇó 1.10 Where "x" is equal to the value to which the module bonus is being applied. In this case that number would be the number that represent the damage of whatever weapon the module I being aplyed to. In the next figure (figure below) this number will be represented bu the number one or x = 1. Whe the bonus from the first module is applied it is done like so: 1 GÇó 1.10 = 1.10 When the damage from the second module is applied it is done like so: (the following figure is without considering stacking penalties) (1 GÇó 1.10)1.10 = 1.21 What happend in the above figure is, first we multiplied 1 by 1.10 the we took the product of that multiplication (which was 1.10) an multiplyed that number by the second damage mod number which just happend to be 1.10 as well. So the second bit of multiplication was 1.10 GÇó 1.10 which gives a product of 1.21. Now this is of course with out considering the stacking penalties. The following is the numbers are for stacking penalties: Stacking Penalties 1st mod: 100.0% effectiveness 2nd mod: 86.9% effectiveness 3rd mod: 57.1% effectiveness 4th mod: 28.3% effectiveness-á 5th mod: 10.6% effectiveness 6th mod: 3.0% effectiveness And the following equation is how one applies the stacking penalties: 1(1.10) GÇó .869(1.10) GÇó .571(1.10) Etc, etc. Hope that that helped you out. {:)}{3GÇó>
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 526	Posted - 2013.12.06 03:42:00 - [13] - Quote Oops had to fix the math in the above post. It's correct now though. {:)}{3GÇó>
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 526	Posted - 2013.12.06 03:47:00 - [14] - Quote Another way of looking at it, that may be less confusing, would be to show you where to apply the weapons damage stat, with a std assault rifle for instance: 34.00(1.10) GÇó 1(.869GÇó.10) GÇó 1(.571GÇó.10) {:)}{3GÇó>
Harpyja DUST University Ivy League 874	Posted - 2013.12.06 03:47:00 - [15] - Quote Here's what you are noticing. Let's take an extreme example and use a 100% bonus. With a base value of 1, this bonus brings it up to 2. Since these modules are multiplicative after the previous one, even with a stacking penalty of 87%, your second module would add 87% of 2, bringing it up to 3.74, which is indeed a larger increase than from the first module. You are observing this simply because of the way these modules apply to the attributes. If they are multiplicative after the previous module, then anything with a high enough bonus will be able to negate the penalty on at least the second module, but stacking enough modules will eventually give you diminishing returns. "By His light, and His will" - The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32
DeadlyAztec11 2503	Posted - 2013.12.06 03:53:00 - [16] - Quote The guys above me do not know what you are talking about. You are talking about how instead of getting a gradually reducing value you will occasionally get a really strange and obviously false number. The addition of the individual values is iffy. Though, the actual individual values are 100% correct, I recommend adding up the individual values yourself, the ones the online calculator gives you. Madness is the emergency exit. You can just step outside, and close the door on all those dreadful things that happened.
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 526	Posted - 2013.12.06 04:01:00 - [17] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: The guys above me do not know what you are talking about. You are talking about how instead of getting a gradually reducing value you will occasionally get a really strange and obviously false number. The addition of the individual values is iffy. Though, the actual individual values are 100% correct, I recommend adding up the individual values yourself, the ones the online calculator gives you. Don't listen to this guy. My math is 100% accurate and explains everything perfectly. {:)}{3GÇó>
Quil Evrything DUST University Ivy League 472	Posted - 2013.12.06 05:49:00 - [18] - Quote Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Can't believe this thread went on so long without anyone being able to answer the question in the OP. err.. that's probably because I didnt ask a question. i made an observation :)
Doc Noah Algintal Core Gallente Federation 956	Posted - 2013.12.06 05:58:00 - [19] - Quote Did you calculate the module efficacy bonus you get from skilling up?
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 526	Posted - 2013.12.06 06:06:00 - [20] - Quote Quil Evrything wrote: Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Can't believe this thread went on so long without anyone being able to answer the question in the OP. err.. that's probably because I didnt ask a question. i made an observation :) Your question was: I cannot understand how to perform the math involved with these calculations. Can somebody who does understand the math please tell me whether or not the stat calculator is functioning properly. Now while I did mat answer your question, I did however provide you with the means to do so yourself. Though your question was implied, simply by your own ignorants of the subject matter, it is non-the-less a question. Had you known how to perform the calculations yourself, then you would never have had to raise the subject in this forum. Instead you title and subject in the OP would have been more along the lines of "the stat calculator on this website is broken" or if this calculator had been functioning properly then you would never have created this thread. I know a question when I see one thank you. Also, I found another flaw in my math, and it has been edited to be accurate now. {:)}{3GÇó>

Quil Evrything DUST University Ivy League 472	Posted - 2013.12.06 06:09:00 - [21] - Quote Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Quil Evrything wrote: Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Can't believe this thread went on so long without anyone being able to answer the question in the OP. err.. that's probably because I didnt ask a question. i made an observation :) Your question was: I cannot understand how to perform the math involved with these calculations. Can somebody who does understand the math please tell me whether or not the stat calculator is functioning properly. nope. plenty of people have already verified the calculator is valid. you, on the other hand, have not proved your 'impressive math' is valid. Quote: Also, I found another flaw in my math, and it has been edited to be accurate now. Funny how you keep saying your math is so wonderful, yet you've already made two mistakes. so far.
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 526	Posted - 2013.12.06 06:25:00 - [22] - Quote Quil Evrything wrote: Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Quil Evrything wrote: Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Can't believe this thread went on so long without anyone being able to answer the question in the OP. err.. that's probably because I didnt ask a question. i made an observation :) Your question was: I cannot understand how to perform the math involved with these calculations. Can somebody who does understand the math please tell me whether or not the stat calculator is functioning properly. nope. plenty of people have already verified the calculator is valid. you, on the other hand, have not proved your 'impressive math' is valid. Quote: Also, I found another flaw in my math, and it has been edited to be accurate now. Funny how you keep saying your math is so wonderful, yet you've already made two mistakes. so far. Performing math on a calculator (the way I usually do math) and witting it out by hand are two entirely different thing. So, you'll have to forgive me if my long form is a little rusty. If "plenty of people have already verified that the calculator is valid" then why broach the subject a possible discrepancy her? Answer: because you are concerned that the calculator is in fact not functioning properly. It is the only possible answer, out side of you being a complete morron. {:)}{3GÇó>
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 526	Posted - 2013.12.06 06:27:00 - [23] - Quote Quil Evrything wrote: if the calculator at http://wiki.dust514.info/index.php?title=Stacking_Penalties is to be believed... More proof to support my assertions. {:)}{3GÇó>


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