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Draco Cerberus
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
569
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Posted - 2013.12.06 17:04:00 -
[1] - Quote
I learn to be a better player by playing against the same level or better players, I am sure that the players below my level do the same. How would this help noobs or vets learn and teach?
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Draco Cerberus
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
584
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Posted - 2013.12.08 00:26:00 -
[2] - Quote
The-Errorist wrote:Draco Cerberus wrote:I learn to be a better player by playing against the same level or better players, I am sure that the players below my level do the same. How would this help noobs or vets learn and teach? I would make them "learn to be a better player by playing against the same level or better players". Playing against a team of highly skilled organized proto-stompers when you and your team are the opposite, gives no room for trying out new tactics as those vets your playing against would quickly stop that and push you back even more.
What do you mean? In one sentence you are agreeing with me and in the next you are saying that there is an issue...could you explain a bit?
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Draco Cerberus
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
584
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Posted - 2013.12.08 00:33:00 -
[3] - Quote
The-Errorist wrote:deepfried salad gilliam wrote:I do believe a player effectiveness formula is the only way to get a good matchmaking
It should also have different tiers that separate the player base just 2 at first then if games are filled quick a 3rd or 4th
The tiers should split the player base evenly
The tiers should effect isk gain
Pay x .9 + x where x is you're tier
Only applied to pubs
Maybe register certain people as vehicle users, and put them in their own tier system(still evenly split and and then matched into appropriate infantry tiers)
It could simply check if someone has spent 60% of time in a vehicle for that weak
Ithat way no one gets screwed (too hard ) I think teirs would divide the player base too much and is unnecessary. Also, I think the pay should more based on the cost of gear destroyed in battle and have a bonus for winning.
As I understand it, Pay for battle is already based on gear destroyed as well as WP in battle. This produces the end result total.
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Draco Cerberus
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
584
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Posted - 2013.12.08 00:42:00 -
[4] - Quote
The-Errorist wrote:Draco Cerberus wrote:The-Errorist wrote:Draco Cerberus wrote:I learn to be a better player by playing against the same level or better players, I am sure that the players below my level do the same. How would this help noobs or vets learn and teach? I would make them "learn to be a better player by playing against the same level or better players". Playing against a team of highly skilled organized proto-stompers when you and your team are the opposite, gives no room for trying out new tactics as those vets your playing against would quickly stop that and push you back even more. What do you mean? In one sentence you are agreeing with me and in the next you are saying that there is an issue...could you explain a bit? There's a difference between playing against players at the same level with some better players sprinkled here and there and playing against a team of players that are just plain better than yours that results in completely one sided battles.
I know there are players far above my level, I also know there are players far below my level. Where does this leave me? In a place where I enjoy playing against AE and TP, DDB, and other AAA teams, because that is where I learn, IDC if I have a team of 0 day players or a team of proto bears, either way I feel ok with being the best opposition for the enemy team that I can be. It may be very one sided but I do learn what works and what doesn't from what the enemy and my team both do. Having lower skilled players on one side or the other allows matches to be over quicker, allowing more suits to be destroyed and more matches played in a sitting.
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Draco Cerberus
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
584
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Posted - 2013.12.08 01:00:00 -
[5] - Quote
Are you comfortable having a formula that decides who you fight and who you are beyond fighting? The problem with this solution is that it is so far out from the New Eden way of battle it is ludicrous, in fact just having a lobby is also ludicrous. Lobbys don't make sandboxes, don't allow for creative problem solving other than what is involved within the structure of 16 man team. New Eden battles in Eve are usually a vastly superior force vs a small force. The current lobby structure doesn't allow for this, rather it lets equal numbers queue up for a "planned" fight, with no surprise factor or need for intel gathering, both of which have become good practice in Eve.
Open World gameplay is the solution, hang Scotty from the rafters, he has served his time, put him out of his misery.
Open World Thread #1
Open World Thread #2
Open World Thread #3
There are plenty more suggestions on this, I think that exploring these options would allow for the flexibility of battles to be more the way you want and more the way I want at the same time.
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Draco Cerberus
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
584
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Posted - 2013.12.08 01:06:00 -
[6] - Quote
The-Errorist wrote:Draco Cerberus wrote:Are you comfortable having a formula that decides who you fight and who you are beyond fighting? Yes, as long as it's only for pub matches
In Eve, all matches are "Pub" matches. Lets do away with the pub, and allow emergent gameplay into the game.
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Draco Cerberus
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
584
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Posted - 2013.12.08 01:17:00 -
[7] - Quote
Can you imagine your whole corp online at once going after some people that were poaching prime ratting land while they were busy? Having a reason to fight other than just SP? Getting the jump on someone in true ambush style? This is what drew me to the game, I can play Quake anytime I want to load into a Lobby match, or COD, or whatever other Lobby game not dependent on learning how to use gear there is available. I spend my isk on suits, weapons and vehicles because I want to have an advantage that means something, not to be just gambling that my 16 man team is better than the other 16 man team (yes I know how many there are on the other side as do you). I'd like to take a 50 man or 75 man or 200 man army up against a group of proto bears that are in the wrong place at the wrong time. At that point it's not a matter of who is better than whom but rather tactics, communication and planning. I want to play in a sandbox.
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Draco Cerberus
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
584
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Posted - 2013.12.08 01:18:00 -
[8] - Quote
The-Errorist wrote:Draco Cerberus wrote:The-Errorist wrote:Draco Cerberus wrote:Are you comfortable having a formula that decides who you fight and who you are beyond fighting? Yes, as long as it's only for pub matches In Eve, all matches are "Pub" matches. Lets do away with the pub, and allow emergent gameplay into the game. This is dust. Side note: This would only affect High sec matches.
I **** noobs and vets in High Sec on Eve, Low Sec and Null Sec, I'm not sure you are understanding the concept I am trying to show you.
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Draco Cerberus
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
584
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Posted - 2013.12.08 01:21:00 -
[9] - Quote
The-Errorist wrote:
Dust doesn't have teircide soo noobs aren't a threat in dust as they are in EVE, but that's besides the point.
So the Militia AR is not able to do 425dps?
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Draco Cerberus
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
584
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Posted - 2013.12.08 01:24:00 -
[10] - Quote
A noob in Eve is not as big a threat as a vet either sir, that doesn't mean they can't get kills, exactly the same as in dust, in fact more often new players in Eve have less than 1/2 the damage capabilities of a 1 year vet in Eve.
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Draco Cerberus
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
584
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Posted - 2013.12.08 01:30:00 -
[11] - Quote
QKC Nemesis wrote:The dark cloud wrote:No the Dust ecconomy is based on pub stomping. Vets who run 100% ISk suits stomp n00bs who then buy in frustration AUR gear to have a somewhat better chance. Which means CCP is making money. i highly doubt that CCP will cripple their income source. Wanna know why? Cause its a "sandbox" game where the strong prey on the weak. This is how eve works and it has beeing implemented on dust at the beginning. in eve you have different security status area' s where noob player can learn to play, this works very well in eve. something similar in dust is necessary if the game is to survive the next year because the player base will keep shrinking otherwise and rightfully so as ccp alienates more and more vets with the updates that screw one group of people and award another! It would not take much to kill the game at this point. new players are not buying arum gear they are just not playing and moving onto something with a more enjoyable polished game experience worth their time. There are many other games out there and over the next year there are many long awaited big games coming out. CCP Your actions have consequences too! i would like to see this game succeed but it is getting harder and harder to keep playing as they are constantly screwing their player base over!.
I think there would be room for this in an Open World Dust environment. Many more options would be open to us.
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Draco Cerberus
Brutor Vanguard
Minmatar Republic
589
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Posted - 2013.12.09 06:40:00 -
[12] - Quote
Sitting in High sec at a market hub I spent a few hours watching battle after battle. The vets winning every time as they would challenge one noob after another to come fight them. Their reason for winning? Vastly superior forces undocking in support of the "solo" pvper, tricking many noobs to fight whilst backup was but an undock away. This whole sec status idea really doesn't separate anyone in eve as any player can buy tags to "fix" any security status issues they are having. This allows them to return to high sec and take advantage of the carebears more. It could be that it would help solve issues of team killing but scotty still will not function properly to balance matches with the small number of players this game has.
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Draco Cerberus
BurgezzE.T.F
General Tso's Alliance
804
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Posted - 2014.03.05 19:24:00 -
[13] - Quote
Altus Nox wrote:Doesn't seem like a bad idea as long as it could be implemented.
I think a separate section of space where anything goes is still a necessary part of this game but having a place for people who want a fair challenge to go would be great.
how do you really think this will work with at max only around 3500 players on at a time? Thats 1000 ppl in basic or militia, 1000 in advanced and 1000 in proto with about 500ish that will swing between all three grades of eq/suits/weapons. Even then there doesn't seem like a large enough group of people that there will be options about what you are playing without 1/2 empty battles. The numbers are ofc estimated to take into varying skill levels and may not reflect the actual values.
Keep in mind also the options for 3 types of battles plus FW and PC that should not be included in this as they are special types outside of strictly PUB matches.
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