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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
4046
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Posted - 2013.11.26 15:16:00 -
[1] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Mobius Wyvern wrote:Master Jaraiya wrote:I was pondering today, how exactly would this work.
If the market is controlled only by players, where would players acquire the Items to be sold in the Market?
In order to have a sustainable economy in DUST, players would need a method harvesting resources, researching technology, and producing the infantry gear and vehicles we would expect to see in the market.
Is the goal to only have EVE players manufacture DUST infantry Vehicles and Gear? What happens when EVE players decide to arbitrarily drive up the cost of Infantry Items to the Point of DUST players not being able to afford them? Would everyone without EVE contacts or Corp Members, or a PC ISK farm be forced to use only Starter fits? This would elevate the current Epidemic of Protostomping into Pandemic status.
What are some of your thoughts on this, CCP? What direction are you taking when the implementation of a Player market becomes a reality? EVE Online, man. Why would anyone in their right mind want to build things in a shooter? Just let the EVE players do it. And please don't anyone start spouting ******** bullshit about how EVE players will make GEK's 3 million each just to spite us. People who do industry are in it for the MONEY. If they don't make MONEY they go bankrupt. Therefore it is in the best interest of all the players producing assets to make them affordable so that we will buy them and they will make money. This is ground-floor basic economics people. Stop being scared of getting worked over and look at the big picture. With the disparity between DUST and EVE ISK, you'd have to imagine that the cost to produce items in EVE would end up being more than they're worth in DUST, thus making it so that, at least for a while, no one would bother manufacturing for DUST unless it was for their alliance / corp and they were being compensated EVE side, since DUST side would only lose them money. We need PvE and real salvage, is what we need.
Dust mercs go through their gear much faster.
Losing 10 proto suits (battleships) within the space of 15 minutes is extremely rare.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
4046
|
Posted - 2013.11.26 15:23:00 -
[2] - Quote
Soldner VonKuechle wrote:Mobius Wyvern wrote:Master Jaraiya wrote:I was pondering today, how exactly would this work.
If the market is controlled only by players, where would players acquire the Items to be sold in the Market?
In order to have a sustainable economy in DUST, players would need a method harvesting resources, researching technology, and producing the infantry gear and vehicles we would expect to see in the market.
Is the goal to only have EVE players manufacture DUST infantry Vehicles and Gear? What happens when EVE players decide to arbitrarily drive up the cost of Infantry Items to the Point of DUST players not being able to afford them? Would everyone without EVE contacts or Corp Members, or a PC ISK farm be forced to use only Starter fits? This would elevate the current Epidemic of Protostomping into Pandemic status.
What are some of your thoughts on this, CCP? What direction are you taking when the implementation of a Player market becomes a reality? EVE Online, man. Why would anyone in their right mind want to build things in a shooter? Just let the EVE players do it. And please don't anyone start spouting ******** bullshit about how EVE players will make GEK's 3 million each just to spite us. People who do industry are in it for the MONEY. If they don't make MONEY they go bankrupt. Therefore it is in the best interest of all the players producing assets to make them affordable so that we will buy them and they will make money. This is ground-floor basic economics people. Stop being scared of getting worked over and look at the big picture. EVE industrialists are so well off, and wellsupplied that money isn't a factor to most. I crash frigate and cruiser markets just for the lulz bud, 3 million geks could happen quite easily. Inverse of that is the struggling or new indy player who will chase the infantry market and realize that it's going to be heavily saturated with high high supply and steady demand. Profits will be razor thin to the point that a lot if players will stop feeding it. Then equilibrium the under supply b then over. ...repeat until the end if time. Now granted the second case might be more in DUST players favor, but the price will still be set by EVE. It's ugly and unsightly and I really don't see it going that smooth ever, EVE side DUST production but we'll find iut
Dust players should be just as susceptible to market manipulation as EVE players.
It's all New Eden.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
4049
|
Posted - 2013.11.26 15:39:00 -
[3] - Quote
Rogue Saint wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:Rogue Saint wrote:NPC's will still seed the market, EvE players will then have to undercut the price of the NPC's ... Simple. The price *should* never go above the NPC price, end result being we get cheaper items.
The economics of this will be at the EvE side with material costs etc. Temporary yes. But not permanently. Eventually the npc supply will need to be removed and finally let the players have total control of the supply. Only if manufacturing is allowed in dust, which I god hope will never happen. The dust market has to have a base price and a base supply. Until mercs can affect the resource supply needed, either by capturing Planetary Infrastructure or whatever, the EvE economy will prevail over dust. As for material costs on the EvE side, not really an issue, the price can be high if the amount of end product is high too i.e. 5000 GEK's for a single BP run. The sale price of those GEK's will be reduced.
Why shouldn't Dust mercs be capable of manufacturing?
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
4055
|
Posted - 2013.11.26 16:35:00 -
[4] - Quote
Rogue Saint wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Why shouldn't Dust mercs be capable of manufacturing? To me it just goes against the whole lore of mercs and why they were created. I can't imagine being a dust-bear and mining/collecting resources! It's not for the console either. The whole indy system in New Eden is way too complex to translate to a console IMHO. - Buying BPO's - Researching them to make them better (use less material and quick production) - Making BPC's (copies) - Getting the resources (mining?? PI??) - Doing invention to get proto grear??? - Getting invention materials to actually perform invention! - Spread sheets for the entire chain! - Etc. DUST Fiend wrote: It seems like if you'd want to thrive at DUST, you'd need an EVE account, or at the very least be good friends with someone who does.
I can see why they've waited so long to merge the economies in any way though, what with all the different ways to abuse it. Agreed. Going back to your other point though, whats the difference in me buying the BPO, mining all the resources, Moon Mining and reacting the more exotic stuff and then using PI to get the missing parts? It's what I've done for years in EvE to get "free" ships. The cost to me is my time.
Even if we're mercs, we're extremely rich.
1 ISK is more than the average family makes in a YEAR.
Also, collecting minerals should be EVE only, we will just buy them off the market.
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
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Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries
EoN.
4055
|
Posted - 2013.11.26 16:37:00 -
[5] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Jadd Hatchen wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:Viktor Hadah Jr wrote:Salvaged items. And stuff you buy no longer want and sell back
Buy won't be that active until we get Indy. Without industry you'd just see the ISK farming corps buy up EVERYTHING, and then refuse to sell it, effectively choking out the majority of the "competition" before it even got up and running. Not likely to happen. If prices are too high, then consumers will stop buying and switch to something else. Then the suppliers end up wasting money and time as they have to constantly keep buying up all the stuff going on market every second of every day that is trying to undercut their artificially inflated prices. In the end it's not worth it. But if you could buy up, say, all the prototype ARs and Scrambler rifles, you would simply dominate any PC match ever because the enemy wouldn't be able to field the most basic of equipment because they couldn't buy it. When you consider the insane amount of ISK some corps are sitting on, it's far from out of the question. It might not turn a direct profit since you aren't selling those weapons, but it turns a profit because no one can shake you from your planets, and you just rake in insane ISK each day because you've got all the gear.
The market will stabilize itself.
Soon players will see the vacuum and produce more.
They can't keep buying forever from 500k EVE players 
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
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