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Vyzion Eyri
The Southern Legion
The Umbra Combine
2112
   |
Posted - 2013.11.25 08:42:00 -
[1] - Quote
Nanite Bar
Proposal:
Implementation of a nanite supply for every dropsuit instead of maximum ammunition.
How it works:
1. Replacing maximum ammunition:
Firstly, nanohives. Every nanohive has a maximum number of 'nanite clusters', which limits how long it can resupply or repair armour before depleting and popping. We can gather from this then that weapon ammunition requires a certain number of nanite clusters to replenish a certain amount of ammunition.
With a nanite bar, all ammunition is converted into nanite clusters, basically, and are stored in nanite storages on your dropsuit.
Lets say 300 bullets on an AR is the equivalent of 100 nanite clusters. Then a full clip of the SMG is another 100. Then 2 locus grenades were 50 clusters.
Instead of having this ammunition separated per weapon, they would be accumulated in one nanite pool of 250 clusters.
2. Drawing from the pool:
Weapons draw automatically from the pool depending on what you use. So essentially, when you deplete a clip from your AR (lets say its 60 bullets), you draw 20 nanite clusters (going from the above numbers) from your pool of 250. So essentially you have roughly 720 AR bullets that can be drawn from your nanite supply, IF YOU ONLY USE THE AR. If you use a grenade, you draw 50 nanite clusters from the pool, meaning you're detracting from the maximum ammunition of your AR as well.
3. Calculating maximum nanite storage capacity:
3.1 Dropsuit frames
From above, the example of 250 clusters was dependent on what weapons I chose. That was only an example. What I think should really determine nanite storage capacity is the type of dropsuit you use. Specifically:
Heavies have the largest nanite storage capacity,
Assaults have the second largest,
Light Frames have the third largest,
and Logistics have the least.
This is my personal twist on the idea to try stamp down on players using logistics suits as a 'slayer', stacked with HP, uplinks, hives and damage mods. Logistics have the smallest ammunition pool so they WILL need hives to keep themselves restocked ammunition-wise. They will also be forced to remain close to or have at hand a constant supply of ammunition at all times, and if they run off from this supply, they'll find themselves empty very quickly.
3.2 New skills and modules
To increase nanite pool, there should be modules involved.
-Nanite Storage Expansion (Basic, Enhanced, Complex) increases nanite storage capacity by x amount. Low-slot module.
-Reactive Nanite Armour Plating (B, E, C) is equipped to use nanites as another source of armour repair. This armour repair rate will be perhaps 2-3 times faster than normal repairers, but drawing from your nanite supply also limits your ammunition supply. High-slot module.
Each of these modules will have relevant skills. Haven't thought of bonuses yet.
Furthermore, the Ammo Capacity skill most weapons have now could be changed to Nanite Efficiency, allowing them to draw less nanites for more ammunition.
4. Resupplying
Replenishing the nanite bar should be exactly the same as what is needed to resupply ammunition now. Supply depots and nanohives. However, the nanite bar is replenished, and the weapon the user is wielding is reloaded automatically if empty, or manually if not. This also provides some reasoning behind how we can reload half a clip, and retain the leftover ammo, instead of having to discard ammo which is unused in a clip.
This also means when resupplying, instead of all your various weapons popping up on screen and showing how much they've resupplied, you will get a simple "Nanite Resupply +50", clearing up lots of the resupply clutter on screen.
4.1 No reloading
Once a clip is depleted, nanites immediately begin replenishing the empty clip without the mercenary having to reload. A key difference here should be the implementation of progressive reloading. Essentially, nanites refill your clip one ammunition unit at a time. This means at any time during the reload process, should you choose to stop reloading by firing your weapon, you will have the amount of bullets you've allowed the nanites to replenish, instead of having an empty clip as it is now.
This system means you can be reloading whilst sprinting. One negative for your hardcore players is that this means sprint-cancelling is gone, but I'd say progressive reloading and the ability to sprint whilst reloading far outweighs this little exploit.
4.2 Reloading based on type of ammunition
Currently, ammunition gains are different based on the weapon. Lets say this is because each weapon's ammunition has a different value, and we will call this AMVL (ammunition value).
The AMVL of HMG ammo is much less than the AMVL of AR ammo, which is why HMG ammunition is replenished much faster than AR ammo currently when you stand on a nanohive. HMG ammunition is most likely less complex to create than the capsules of plasma the AR fires.
What is more complex than any of these? Grenades. Here is how this system balances grenades. I mentioned earlier all weapons load in with 1 clip and grenades load in with 1 grenade. After using this grenade, nanites automatically begin to be consumed to reload another grenade, however it will take time to 'make', unlike the instantaneous resupply that we have currently. This prevents grenades from being spammed, although I'm not quite sure exactly how long it should take. Perhaps the same amount of time it takes to reload 1 AR clip.
"When nothing is going your way, go out of your way to do nothing."
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Vyzion Eyri
The Southern Legion
The Umbra Combine
2112
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 08:42:00 -
[2] - Quote
5. Reasoning behind depleting nanites
Now someone noted that nanites are what create the ammunition from raw materials, and as such aren't actually consumed in this way. However, where are these nanites drawing materials from? Nanohives pack clusters of nanites which I assume produce ammunition... from materials stored in/on the nanites or the nanohive. These clusters of nanites probably only contain enough energy to be used once before becoming disabled, so essentially this is what is happening. Perhaps nanites on the dropsuit are drawing raw materials from the ground, or from the dropsuit. In fact, this could lead to a 'matter' bar having to be implemented, whereby the nanites draw from the matter to create ammunition, but for simplicity's sake we will leave it as this for now.
6. Impact of nanites on HP.
6.1 Shields
The more nanites you have, the 'softer' your shields are, because energy in the dropsuit is consumed maintaining nanite health. HOWEVER, this does not mean you have less shields. What it means is that you load into the battle with 100% of the shields which you have now, but this isn't the maximum. As you deplete your nanite supply, your shields get progressively stronger. At a 0% nanite supply, shield HP should increase by about 50%.
6.2 Armour
I mentioned a module above that allows nanites to be utilised to repair armour. This would be interesting to see on a heavy dedicated to brick-walling and soaking up damage, or a sniper who is very ammo-efficient.
Also, another possibility is more armour plating = more protection for nanites. See the next section.
7. Damaging enemy nanite supplies
7.1 Weaponry
Light - Nanite Disruptor
Firing this at an enemy deals damage, but also disrupts nanites on the dropsuit, disabling them.
Heavy - The Gallente heavy weapon
Whenever this is implemented, the Gallente are renowned for their specialty in drone tech and AI. Their heavy weapon should also deal damage to the enemy nanite supply.
Melee - Nanite Vampire (for lack of a better name) Whack people with this to steal their nanites.
7.2 Equipment
Nanite Disabling Field
Creates a field in which nanites cease to operate, preventing reloading and resupplying. Includes nanohives.
Thoughts, comments, ideas welcome. I made a previous thread about this but when I went to expand it I realised I had foolishly forgotten to reserve some posts, so apologies for a new thread so soon.
"When nothing is going your way, go out of your way to do nothing."
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Vyzion Eyri
The Southern Legion
The Umbra Combine
2112
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 08:43:00 -
[3] - Quote
Reserved!
"When nothing is going your way, go out of your way to do nothing."
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WeapondigitX V7
The Exemplars
Top Men.
125
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Posted - 2013.11.25 10:12:00 -
[4] - Quote
These are interesting ideas. However please remember that the scrambler rifle mimics the mechanics of progressive reloading but has the additional mechanic of overheat damage and overheat duration which prevents some actions from occurring like sprinting and switching weapons.
As the weapon cools down it is essentially allowing you to fire more bullets. Like a progressive reload but without penalties for when you try to exceed the weapons limits. |
Vyzion Eyri
The Southern Legion
The Umbra Combine
2115
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 11:05:00 -
[5] - Quote
WeapondigitX V7 wrote:These are interesting ideas. However please remember that the scrambler rifle mimics the mechanics of progressive reloading but has the additional mechanic of overheat damage and overheat duration which prevents some actions from occurring like sprinting and switching weapons.
As the weapon cools down it is essentially allowing you to fire more bullets. Like a progressive reload but without penalties for when you try to exceed the weapons limits.
Wait, so you mean as the weapon cools down, you can fire more bullets as in it is 'progressively reloading' in the sense that it is mimicking reloading whilst it's cooling down?
"When nothing is going your way, go out of your way to do nothing."
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Ulysses Knapse
duna corp
631
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Posted - 2013.11.25 11:38:00 -
[6] - Quote
No.
For one, nanites are supposed to be a special thing, like teleportation from drop uplinks.
For two, it makes the idea of carrying a sidearm in case you run out of ammo a mute point.
However, the idea of different dropsuits having different ammo supplies interests me... Plas one just for that.
Humanity is the personification of change.
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Luna Angelo
We Who Walk Alone
152
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Posted - 2013.11.25 11:52:00 -
[7] - Quote
Why would Logis have the LEAST ammo? We are NOT healers in the pure sense of the word, though that is the best way to describe us in MMO terms. We are Combat Medics. Sometimes shooting the enemy is the best thing you can do for your ally, and if we run out of ammo, we're done. Keep in mind that Logis (except Ammar) only have one weapon. Why do we need yet another thing that will put us at a disadvantage?
I do agree we need less killing power and more reason to use our equipment, but basically taking half of our ammo (or however much it is) is counter-productive. +1 for effort and for the well thought out idea, even if I disagree, though.
Contact WaTcHoUt1219 ZARTA for Logos. More are available. 500K ISK.
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Vyzion Eyri
The Southern Legion
The Umbra Combine
2117
|
Posted - 2013.11.25 12:10:00 -
[8] - Quote
Luna Angelo wrote:Why would Logis have the LEAST ammo? We are NOT healers in the pure sense of the word, though that is the best way to describe us in MMO terms. We are Combat Medics. Sometimes shooting the enemy is the best thing you can do for your ally, and if we run out of ammo, we're done. Keep in mind that Logis (except Ammar) only have one weapon. Why do we need yet another thing that will put us at a disadvantage?
I do agree we need less killing power and more reason to use our equipment, but basically taking half of our ammo (or however much it is) is counter-productive. +1 for effort and for the well thought out idea, even if I disagree, though.
Basically I assumed most logibros would have nanohives, so they could resupply much more effectively, rather than assaults who I seem to see run injectors/uplinks/scanners and scouts who're mostly uplinks/scanners.
I was considering having light frames possess the lowest nanite amount, and if more people agree with you on this point I will consider changing it! Thanks for the feedback.
Ulysses Knapse wrote:
No.
For one, nanites are supposed to be a special thing, like teleportation from drop uplinks.
For two, it makes the idea of carrying a sidearm in case you run out of ammo a mute point.
However, the idea of different dropsuits having different ammo supplies interests me... Plas one just for that.
Hehe, the first two to like my OP disagree with it. How interesting.
Anyway, one of the purposes for this idea is to create a unique ammunition system, to set DUST apart from everything else. If you could expand on what you mean by nanites as a 'special thing', I'd like to understand it, because that's exactly what I want nanites to be.
Also, that is an interesting point on sidearms. Sidearms, I feel work as finishers and/or engagers, and this means they're used when the main weapon is out of a clip. Reload is still involved because you shoot way faster than the reload speed, even if its progressive. This time spent reloading should be behind cover; you'll need a sidearm at this moment to extract yourself. Furthermore, I find I rarely get to the point where my light weapon runs totally out of ammunition and I have to rely solely on my sidearm.
Just trying to flesh out your points, guys. You need to make me believe I'm wrong. :P
"When nothing is going your way, go out of your way to do nothing."
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Ulysses Knapse
duna corp
631
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Posted - 2013.11.25 12:31:00 -
[9] - Quote
Vyzion Eyri wrote:Anyway, one of the purposes for this idea is to create a unique ammunition system, to set DUST apart from everything else. If you could expand on what you mean by nanites as a 'special thing', I'd like to understand it, because that's exactly what I want nanites to be.
The lore. Nanohives and Drop Uplinks are supposed to be special cases. If this system was implemented, it could uproot all the lore that I've stood for! By the way, I'm fairly certain those two work on a similar principle. Teleportation. From what I understand, the ammo from nanohives isn't composed of nanites. Nanites simply deconstruct ammo, go through the teleportation process, end up at the nanohive, and then reconstruct the ammo. As such, carrying around the nanites wouldn't be very efficient, but with teleportation it's fine.
I don't know for sure, but judging from the size of the nanohive and its similarity to the Drop Uplink, I think this theory is highly probable. Don't you agree?
Vyzion Eyri wrote:I find I rarely get to the point where my light weapon runs totally out of ammunition and I have to rely solely on my sidearm.
Can happen quite often if you use a Laser Rifle, Mass Driver, Sniper Rifle, or other weapon that has relatively low ammo, and you don't have a nanohive with you.
Humanity is the personification of change.
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Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S.
Public Disorder.
955
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Posted - 2013.11.25 12:44:00 -
[10] - Quote
I might like this idea, it depends...
Vyzion Eyri wrote:and Logistics have the least.
What does this mean for my Plasma Cannon?
How many slugs will I be able to fire before I run out? My nanohive gives me just enough to refill my ammo completely, 12 slugs.
Would this get rid of reloading for my Cannon? I wouldn't like that, unless each slug took about 6 seconds to manufacture, so it isn't OP.
[+ªa¦Ç+¦++-ö-Å94]
The Plasma Cannon is not underpowered.
BUFF PLASMA CANNON DIRECT DAMAGE
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Vyzion Eyri
The Southern Legion
The Umbra Combine
2117
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Posted - 2013.11.25 12:54:00 -
[11] - Quote
Sorry I didn't make it clear on the frames idea. By logistics having the least I meant the base amount, which I've just made what we have currently. So lets say the average SMG, average AR and average locus grenade all add up to x amount of nanites. THAT will be the lowest amount. Essentially with this system everyone will have MORE ammunition, less necessity to resupply. Discuss this point too, I'm not sure if it should work like that, but for now I'll add this to the OP.
@Ulysses, I never knew the lore for nanohives was fleshed out that much. I haven't seen anything official besides the nanohive description, and from there I gather that the nanites are stored in the nanohive, along with raw material to construct nanites.
Quote:...able to convert formatted matter from its limited internal stores and reorganise it into any kind of ammunition...
"When nothing is going your way, go out of your way to do nothing."
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Ulysses Knapse
duna corp
631
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Posted - 2013.11.25 13:04:00 -
[12] - Quote
Vyzion Eyri wrote:@Ulysses, I never knew the lore for nanohives was fleshed out that much. I haven't seen anything official besides the nanohive description, and from there I gather that the nanites are stored in the nanohive, along with raw material to construct nanites. Quote:...able to convert formatted matter from its limited internal stores and reorganise it into any kind of ammunition...
See? It's already lorebusting without becoming a regular thing! It infuriates me!
*begins to weep*
I like consistency, you know? Nothing that fantastic has ever been done with nanites in EVE Online.
Humanity is the personification of change.
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Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S.
Public Disorder.
955
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Posted - 2013.11.25 13:11:00 -
[13] - Quote
Ulysses Knapse wrote:Vyzion Eyri wrote:@Ulysses, I never knew the lore for nanohives was fleshed out that much. I haven't seen anything official besides the nanohive description, and from there I gather that the nanites are stored in the nanohive, along with raw material to construct nanites. Quote:...able to convert formatted matter from its limited internal stores and reorganise it into any kind of ammunition... See? It's already lorebusting without becoming a regular thing! It infuriates me! *begins to weep* I like consistency, you know? Nothing that fantastic has ever been done with nanites in EVE Online.
How do nanites move individual electrons to recharge an Energy Weapon? Is each ScR magazine its own self contained powerplant? That would be pretty cool.
[+ªa¦Ç+¦++-ö-Å94]
The Plasma Cannon is not underpowered.
BUFF PLASMA CANNON DIRECT DAMAGE
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Ulysses Knapse
duna corp
631
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Posted - 2013.11.25 13:19:00 -
[14] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Ulysses Knapse wrote:Vyzion Eyri wrote:@Ulysses, I never knew the lore for nanohives was fleshed out that much. I haven't seen anything official besides the nanohive description, and from there I gather that the nanites are stored in the nanohive, along with raw material to construct nanites. Quote:...able to convert formatted matter from its limited internal stores and reorganise it into any kind of ammunition... See? It's already lorebusting without becoming a regular thing! It infuriates me! *begins to weep* I like consistency, you know? Nothing that fantastic has ever been done with nanites in EVE Online. How do nanites move individual electrons to recharge an Energy Weapon? Is each ScR magazine its own self contained powerplant? That would be pretty cool.
They are power cells, after all.
Humanity is the personification of change.
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Fizzer94
L.O.T.I.S.
Public Disorder.
955
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Posted - 2013.11.25 13:24:00 -
[15] - Quote
Ulysses Knapse wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:Ulysses Knapse wrote:Vyzion Eyri wrote:@Ulysses, I never knew the lore for nanohives was fleshed out that much. I haven't seen anything official besides the nanohive description, and from there I gather that the nanites are stored in the nanohive, along with raw material to construct nanites. Quote:...able to convert formatted matter from its limited internal stores and reorganise it into any kind of ammunition... See? It's already lorebusting without becoming a regular thing! It infuriates me! *begins to weep* I like consistency, you know? Nothing that fantastic has ever been done with nanites in EVE Online. How do nanites move individual electrons to recharge an Energy Weapon? Is each ScR magazine its own self contained powerplant? That would be pretty cool. They are power cells, after all.
What do they use then? I heard the Amarr use antimatter reactors in their tech. Wouldn't that be impossible to move via nanites? It makes no sense!
[+ªa¦Ç+¦++-ö-Å94]
The Plasma Cannon is not underpowered.
BUFF PLASMA CANNON DIRECT DAMAGE
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Ulysses Knapse
duna corp
631
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Posted - 2013.11.25 13:26:00 -
[16] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Ulysses Knapse wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:How do nanites move individual electrons to recharge an Energy Weapon? Is each ScR magazine its own self contained powerplant? That would be pretty cool. They are power cells, after all. What do they use then? I heard the Amarr use antimatter reactors in their tech. Wouldn't that be impossible to move via nanites? It makes no sense!
I don't know how the power cells work, I just know that they do.
Humanity is the personification of change.
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