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Borne Velvalor
Endless Hatred
966
   |
Posted - 2013.11.21 10:16:00 -
[1] - Quote
The Imperial Scrambler Rifle currently has an optimal range of 50m. As of 1.7, it will be 78m, almost a 30m increase. For comparison, the current Duvolle Assault Rifle does 30% damage up to 70m to shields, at which point the Scrambler Rifle will be doing 120% for another 8m. Currently, it looks like I'll be swapping to Scrambler Rifles as of 1.7, even though I use the TAR. It looks like the Scrambler Rifle will out range and out damage all of the new rifles, too. The only disadvantage seems to be the lack of an ACOG scope. Also, Carthum Assault Scrambler Rifles will be getting an optimal of 60m.
So, we've got an Assault Rifle variant that does less than half the damage and has less damage in a clip than a single stream of Scrambler fire, plus significant recoil that the Scrambler doesn't have, for a 14m advantage in range and a scope. Now that that's gone, the TAR will be so laughably ineffective compared to the Scrambler Rifle (we're talking half to a third of the DPS at most ranges), that there will be no reason to use it. I know, I know; it's a variant, so it should be a weaker version of the Scrambler. Then please explain to me why the Scrambler's Assault variant will be an Assault Rifle with 25% more range as of 1.7? I don't see that as being an inferior replica.
Scrambler Rifle 514, here we come? Unless, of course, the Scrambler Rifle starts doing 25% less damage than it is now, or something.
Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn.
Panda.
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Borne Velvalor
Endless Hatred
967
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 10:40:00 -
[2] - Quote
Delta90212 wrote:Borne Velvalor wrote:The Imperial Scrambler Rifle currently has an optimal range of 50m. As of 1.7, it will be 78m, almost a 30m increase. For comparison, the current Duvolle Assault Rifle does 30% damage up to 70m to shields, at which point the Scrambler Rifle will be doing 120% for another 8m. Currently, it looks like I'll be swapping to Scrambler Rifles as of 1.7, even though I use the TAR. It looks like the Scrambler Rifle will out range and out damage all of the new rifles, too. The only disadvantage seems to be the lack of an ACOG scope. Also, Carthum Assault Scrambler Rifles will be getting an optimal of 60m.
So, we've got an Assault Rifle variant that does less than half the damage and has less damage in a clip than a single stream of Scrambler fire, plus significant recoil that the Scrambler doesn't have, for a 14m advantage in range and a scope. Now that that's gone, the TAR will be so laughably ineffective compared to the Scrambler Rifle (we're talking half to a third of the DPS at most ranges), that there will be no reason to use it. I know, I know; it's a variant, so it should be a weaker version of the Scrambler. Then please explain to me why the Scrambler's Assault variant will be an Assault Rifle with 25% more range as of 1.7? I don't see that as being an inferior replica.
Scrambler Rifle 514, here we come? Unless, of course, the Scrambler Rifle starts doing 25% less damage than it is now, or something. Just wait for the Rail rifle with the highest range, decent dmg and a good scope comes. Then there will be crying.
A skilled Scrambler Rifle will be dealing twice the DPS while the Rail Rifle is kicking all over the place after spending 200ms charging up. Hide behind crate, charge. Strafe out and fire while te Rail Rifle is spooling up. Rinse, repeat until dead. It's not hard when you deal 1200 DPS with no recoil and they deal less than 500 DPS with recoil and charge time to kill them, even if they have an ACOG.
Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn.
Panda.
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Borne Velvalor
Endless Hatred
967
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 10:42:00 -
[3] - Quote
Nguruthos IX wrote:because **** lasers, thats why!
Explain the Laser Rifle, then. Unless you've previously fired 25 bullets, you're getting out DPS'd by pretty much everything in the game. Plus, that 19m span. As a previous Laser Rifle user, I will love the Scrambler Rifle. No more sub-300 DPS over 19m, hello post-1200 DPS over 78m.
Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn.
Panda.
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Borne Velvalor
Endless Hatred
967
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 10:47:00 -
[4] - Quote
Mordecai Sanguine wrote:Borne Velvalor wrote:The Imperial Scrambler Rifle currently has an optimal range of 50m. As of 1.7, it will be 78m, almost a 30m increase. For comparison, the current Duvolle Assault Rifle does 30% damage up to 70m to shields, at which point the Scrambler Rifle will be doing 120% for another 8m. Currently, it looks like I'll be swapping to Scrambler Rifles as of 1.7, even though I use the TAR. It looks like the Scrambler Rifle will out range and out damage all of the new rifles, too. The only disadvantage seems to be the lack of an ACOG scope. Also, Carthum Assault Scrambler Rifles will be getting an optimal of 60m.
So, we've got an Assault Rifle variant that does less than half the damage and has less damage in a clip than a single stream of Scrambler fire, plus significant recoil that the Scrambler doesn't have, for a 14m advantage in range and a scope. Now that that's gone, the TAR will be so laughably ineffective compared to the Scrambler Rifle (we're talking half to a third of the DPS at most ranges), that there will be no reason to use it. I know, I know; it's a variant, so it should be a weaker version of the Scrambler. Then please explain to me why the Scrambler's Assault variant will be an Assault Rifle with 25% more range as of 1.7? I don't see that as being an inferior replica.
Scrambler Rifle 514, here we come? Unless, of course, the Scrambler Rifle starts doing 25% less damage than it is now, or something. Because Scrmalber rifles ARE the TAR. I mean each races has his own version of assault rifles. (Based on actual assault rifles) Minmatarr = Burst. Amarr = Tactical. Gallente : Regular. Caldari : Breach. So it's obviously normal than Races specialists weapons are better than currents assault rifles version. In fact i think Gallente Burst / Breach / TAR should diseapears after the release of the others assault rifles. By the way i don't think Scrambler rifles (Semi-auto) will outperforms others assault rifles. Without Amarr assault suits the rifle is overheated VERY FAST and even if he has lot of damage and range the rate of fire is very low and you can't spam because of heat so i think he's balanced. (Maybe little more recoil should be good). To finish rail rifles has the same range with a better dps so..... Actually i think ALL assault rifles should be light nerfed. They are too powerful and ruins the game with their high DPS.
Assault Rifles are indeed a problem at the moment. Of course, Scrambler Rifles can double their DPS, but it takes more skill to do so. However, while the TAR is a variant, so is the Assault Scrambler Rifle. Please explain to me why the TAR will do 40% of the DPS with a 20m range disadvantage and recoil, when the ASR does 100% of the DPS with a 12m advantage. It has some more recoil? It overheats on the second clip if you don't pause? I don't see a pattern, here.
Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn.
Panda.
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Borne Velvalor
Endless Hatred
969
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 11:03:00 -
[5] - Quote
Mordecai Sanguine wrote:Borne Velvalor wrote:Mordecai Sanguine wrote:Borne Velvalor wrote:The Imperial Scrambler Rifle currently has an optimal range of 50m. As of 1.7, it will be 78m, almost a 30m increase. For comparison, the current Duvolle Assault Rifle does 30% damage up to 70m to shields, at which point the Scrambler Rifle will be doing 120% for another 8m. Currently, it looks like I'll be swapping to Scrambler Rifles as of 1.7, even though I use the TAR. It looks like the Scrambler Rifle will out range and out damage all of the new rifles, too. The only disadvantage seems to be the lack of an ACOG scope. Also, Carthum Assault Scrambler Rifles will be getting an optimal of 60m.
So, we've got an Assault Rifle variant that does less than half the damage and has less damage in a clip than a single stream of Scrambler fire, plus significant recoil that the Scrambler doesn't have, for a 14m advantage in range and a scope. Now that that's gone, the TAR will be so laughably ineffective compared to the Scrambler Rifle (we're talking half to a third of the DPS at most ranges), that there will be no reason to use it. I know, I know; it's a variant, so it should be a weaker version of the Scrambler. Then please explain to me why the Scrambler's Assault variant will be an Assault Rifle with 25% more range as of 1.7? I don't see that as being an inferior replica.
Scrambler Rifle 514, here we come? Unless, of course, the Scrambler Rifle starts doing 25% less damage than it is now, or something. Because Scrmalber rifles ARE the TAR. I mean each races has his own version of assault rifles. (Based on actual assault rifles) Minmatarr = Burst. Amarr = Tactical. Gallente : Regular. Caldari : Breach. So it's obviously normal than Races specialists weapons are better than currents assault rifles version. In fact i think Gallente Burst / Breach / TAR should diseapears after the release of the others assault rifles. By the way i don't think Scrambler rifles (Semi-auto) will outperforms others assault rifles. Without Amarr assault suits the rifle is overheated VERY FAST and even if he has lot of damage and range the rate of fire is very low and you can't spam because of heat so i think he's balanced. (Maybe little more recoil should be good). To finish rail rifles has the same range with a better dps so..... Actually i think ALL assault rifles should be light nerfed. They are too powerful and ruins the game with their high DPS. Assault Rifles are indeed a problem at the moment. Of course, Scrambler Rifles can double their DPS, but it takes more skill to do so. However, while the TAR is a variant, so is the Assault Scrambler Rifle. Please explain to me why the TAR will do 40% of the DPS with a 20m range disadvantage and recoil, when the ASR does 100% of the DPS with a 12m advantage. It has some more recoil? It overheats on the second clip if you don't pause? I don't see a pattern, here. I agree Assault scrambler rifles should be removed OR nerfed. (Bigger Heat). But don't forget Scrmalber got 20% bonus on shield which is low. And 20% penality on armor which is really high. So when shooting an ennemy 60-80% of his ehp will receive a 20% resistance against Scrmabler so...
Armor has a 10% resistance to Assault Rifle rounds, if I recall correctly. Yes, the difference is bigger; it's certainly noticeable on the Laser Rifle. However, this actually brings up another issue; why is it so cheap and easy to get armor. My starter fits that are nearly free have almost 700 HP due to armor. Meanwhile, if you want any decent amount of shielding you need to use Complex Extenders and a suit with a ton of high slots. I don't think it's a big enough of a drawback, still, and I think armor is also a problem on its own. With a Wirkomi hive and a Gallente logistics, you can heal your HP as fast as an Assault. I've used a Gallente starter fit with plates to take out 3 advanced Caldari shield tankers in a row before, only to step onto a hive and fully rep as fast as they can.
Nguruthos IX wrote:
Yeah.
so CCP should just remove the laser from game and refund SP
basically
If the mechanics are not changed or the range does not receive a serious rebalance, yes. They are very situational already. In situations where I'll go 15-2 with a LR, I'll go 24-2 with a TAR, maybe standing 5m more forward. The Scrambler Rifle after 1.7 will absorb it's niche further, along with Rail Rifles. CCP has already stated that the Rail Rifle should be longer ranged than the Laser Rife and the Scrambler Rifle has the same range as the Rail Rifle. So, the Laser won't get a range extension. The only way to fix the Laser Rifle is to buff the damage, add the damage increase for tiers back, lower the heat build up to normalize the damage curve, reduce the speed of the drop off at the end of maximum range by at least 50% and add another 10m to the lower end of the optimal span. It's hard to find a good scenario for the Laser Rifle now, and it'll be impossible in 1.7 without changes.
Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn.
Panda.
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Borne Velvalor
Endless Hatred
969
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 11:10:00 -
[6] - Quote
Delta90212 wrote:Borne Velvalor wrote:Delta90212 wrote:Borne Velvalor wrote:The Imperial Scrambler Rifle currently has an optimal range of 50m. As of 1.7, it will be 78m, almost a 30m increase. For comparison, the current Duvolle Assault Rifle does 30% damage up to 70m to shields, at which point the Scrambler Rifle will be doing 120% for another 8m. Currently, it looks like I'll be swapping to Scrambler Rifles as of 1.7, even though I use the TAR. It looks like the Scrambler Rifle will out range and out damage all of the new rifles, too. The only disadvantage seems to be the lack of an ACOG scope. Also, Carthum Assault Scrambler Rifles will be getting an optimal of 60m.
So, we've got an Assault Rifle variant that does less than half the damage and has less damage in a clip than a single stream of Scrambler fire, plus significant recoil that the Scrambler doesn't have, for a 14m advantage in range and a scope. Now that that's gone, the TAR will be so laughably ineffective compared to the Scrambler Rifle (we're talking half to a third of the DPS at most ranges), that there will be no reason to use it. I know, I know; it's a variant, so it should be a weaker version of the Scrambler. Then please explain to me why the Scrambler's Assault variant will be an Assault Rifle with 25% more range as of 1.7? I don't see that as being an inferior replica.
Scrambler Rifle 514, here we come? Unless, of course, the Scrambler Rifle starts doing 25% less damage than it is now, or something. Just wait for the Rail rifle with the highest range, decent dmg and a good scope comes. Then there will be crying. A skilled Scrambler Rifle will be dealing twice the DPS while the Rail Rifle is kicking all over the place after spending 200ms charging up. Hide behind crate, charge. Strafe out and fire while te Rail Rifle is spooling up. Rinse, repeat until dead. It's not hard when you deal 1200 DPS with no recoil and they deal less than 500 DPS with recoil and charge time to kill them, even if they have an ACOG. 0.2ms is really nothing i mean you probably only have to spool up the first shot and continue firing hopefully
It's enough that the DPS drops considerably enough that the peek-and-spray will slaughter it. I use this with my Tactical Assault Rifle on Laser Rifles, which have a similar enough DPS problem, and I almost never die to them anymore, even within their optimal range. The upside to all this is that it'll still at least take some skill to kill a RR user at 70m without a scope.
Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn.
Panda.
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Borne Velvalor
Endless Hatred
970
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 11:31:00 -
[7] - Quote
I-Shayz-I wrote:DUDE
Longer optimal means it will work like the laser rifle!
This would technically be a nerf to those who try and spam the rifle at close range in order to do a ton of damage.
Basically, post 1.7, if you try and use the scrambler up close you will do minimal damage. HOWEVER, if you use it at long range you will see much better results, WHICH IS HOW THE GUN SHOULD WORK.
If you are facing a scrambler rifle post 1.7, all you have to do is run up close to them and you will see similar results as if you try and run up close to a laser rifle.
SAME THING WITH THE RAIL RIFLE.
Did this not occur to you? -_-
Has CCP stated that these guns would be receiving the dreaded reverse damage drop off, or are you being sarcastic? It's hard to tell with you, sometimes. I can imagine you saying this before you pop me in the head 5m away with a fully charged Scrambler Rifle.
Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn.
Panda.
|
Borne Velvalor
Endless Hatred
970
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 11:49:00 -
[8] - Quote
Repe Susi wrote:I'm so out of the loop I don't know what you guys are talking about.
Scr getting buffed? Where can I see the info?
Here.
All of the rifle ranges that we know about for 1.7 are listed there. As you can see, the Scrambler Rifle is being extended to 78m, the Assault Scrambler to 60m and the TAR getting nerfed to 60m GÇô 55m for the GLU-5, which is the only really viable one. The Assault Rifle is also getting a slight range buff to 48m, although I don't know if the drop off is the same.
Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn.
Panda.
|
Borne Velvalor
Endless Hatred
973
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 13:29:00 -
[9] - Quote
Protected Void wrote:I don't know where this idea about the scrambler rifle having no recoil comes from. I see it pop up on the forums every now and then. Here's a test:
- Equip a scrambler rifle
- Find somewhere quiet, so you don't get distracted
- Aim at a specific point on a wall
- Fire your scrambler rifle rapidly until it overheats, paying close attention to where the shots land
- Realize that the shots didn't hit the same spot, because each shot pushed the rifle upwards
- You have now seen recoil in action
Now, I've never used the TAC beyond a quick test six months ago, so I can't really say whether it has more, less or the same amount of recoil as the scrambler rifle. Which is why I'm not going to make claims regarding it. TL;DR: The scrambler rifle does have recoil, please stop perpetuating untruths.
After using the TAR, it doesn't feel like it, but it's enough to make sniping longer ranged targets harder. Sorry.
Protected Void wrote:
A skilled Scrambler Rifle could be dealing twice the DPS while the Rail Rifle is kicking all over the place after spending 200ms charging up. Hide behind crate, charge. Strafe out and fire while the Rail Rifle is spooling up. Rinse, repeat until dead. It's not hard when you deal 1200 DPS with no recoil and they deal less than 500 DPS with recoil and charge time to kill them, even if they have an ACOG.
Also: have you been getting sneak peeks and test play at CCP's offices? No? Then how do you know what the Rail Rifle will actually be like to use? Are you psychic?[/quote]
There, is it fixed? Do I need to stick big, shiny, "IMO" at the end of it? Obviously, that's what I think is a possible, or probable, outcome. The numbers are correct enough, however, give or take 50 due to poor memory. After factoring in recoil, which I don't really notice (though I rarely use the Scrambler Rifle), it seems it'll take more skill than I thought. It's still receiving a positively massive buff, though. For the variants, the ASR is being buffed while the TAR is getting nerfed, which doesn't make much sense to me. Not a lot of players use the TAR over the Scrambler Rifle, anyways. Plenty use the Assault Scrambler, though.
Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn.
Panda.
|
Borne Velvalor
Endless Hatred
977
|
Posted - 2013.11.21 18:28:00 -
[10] - Quote
ugg reset wrote:Delta90212 wrote:Borne Velvalor wrote:The Imperial Scrambler Rifle currently has an optimal range of 50m. As of 1.7, it will be 78m, almost a 30m increase. For comparison, the current Duvolle Assault Rifle does 30% damage up to 70m to shields, at which point the Scrambler Rifle will be doing 120% for another 8m. Currently, it looks like I'll be swapping to Scrambler Rifles as of 1.7, even though I use the TAR. It looks like the Scrambler Rifle will out range and out damage all of the new rifles, too. The only disadvantage seems to be the lack of an ACOG scope. Also, Carthum Assault Scrambler Rifles will be getting an optimal of 60m.
So, we've got an Assault Rifle variant that does less than half the damage and has less damage in a clip than a single stream of Scrambler fire, plus significant recoil that the Scrambler doesn't have, for a 14m advantage in range and a scope. Now that that's gone, the TAR will be so laughably ineffective compared to the Scrambler Rifle (we're talking half to a third of the DPS at most ranges), that there will be no reason to use it. I know, I know; it's a variant, so it should be a weaker version of the Scrambler. Then please explain to me why the Scrambler's Assault variant will be an Assault Rifle with 25% more range as of 1.7? I don't see that as being an inferior replica.
Scrambler Rifle 514, here we come? Unless, of course, the Scrambler Rifle starts doing 25% less damage than it is now, or something. Just wait for the Rail rifle with the highest range, decent dmg and a good scope comes. Then there will be crying. Isn't it tied for 1st with the laser rifle.
The Laser Rifle has a higher optimal, technically, ending at around 83m~. The problem is that it only has about 20m to shoot in and has poor DPS in most situations.
Many suits I've worn, many burdens I've borne, for the oaths I've sworn.
Panda.
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