DUST Search - why are shotguns so weak?

Acturus Galaxy wrote:

Odd, I nearly always get a second shot off when I have sneaked up on a red berry, that is if they survive the first hit by my breach shotgun aimed at their heads. Only heavy tanked Gallente seems to need a seond shot to get through their thick armor skin.
And about jumping into a doorway where one or several red dots are pointing their ARs ready to shoot at a skinny scout is suicide. I would never do that, leave this to frontline assaults that has the armor to survive the fire returned from inside the door. Move around the building and take them from behind.

I think they need to create several scout classes, one that suits your need, an extremely quick and high dps role. And another scout role similar to what we have in the Gallente for the stealthy ewar type of role. I start to see the problem being different opinions about the scout role, one with your view for a hunter role common in many games, light armored with high damage. And another whom prefer the stealthy utility type which gathers intel, sneaks behind enenmy lines, hacks stuff and backstabs high ranked generals. etc.


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Shutter Fly Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 98	Posted - 2013.11.15 10:42:00 - [1] - Quote Acturus Galaxy wrote: ... My Duvolle with three damage mods surely zaps one faster than my standard shotgun. I wonder how the proto shotgun with three damage mods would do? Proto shotgun would in one shot do 39,6121,25=594, the breach would do 47,5121,25=712. Not that many have more than 712 if they are running damage mods. And two shots is enough to take down most heavies. The scout using Allotek Breack without damage mods would do 47,5*12=570, with the surprise on your side, you should be able to pull off two shots with a total damage of 1140. How many would survive this?!? The scout are skinny and should only engange when you have the surprise moment on your side, the opponent has to be extremely skilled with quick reflexes to get away within 1 second from being hit by the first shot before the second shot impacts. Getting a headshot with the shotgun would deal much more damage. The issue with the proto shotgun's damage is that, while an AR or ScR user can easily sacrifice HP and then hang back to deal damage from a distance, a shotgun MUST close the gap and engage directly. When you are against prototype gear, that is never an easy task. With the Breach dealing 712 HP of damage with two damage mods, that is lower than it should be. Even with proficiency it takes a long time to fire two Breach SG rounds, more than enough time for an AR to kill you with the small amount of health they have remaining. For the CreoDron, it takes 3 damage mods just to get it to 600 damage, that is a huge eHP sacrifice, and you still have to get within 4m to even do that much damage. If you have even one shot that is just slightly off, or the enemy manages to create some distance, you are already going to need at least 3 shots to kill. Also, only a Medium suit can even fit 3 DMs on a proto SG, the scout Gk.0 only has one high and the Mk.0 would either run out of CPU or die to about two Duvolle bullets.
Shutter Fly Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 98	Posted - 2013.11.15 11:49:00 - [2] - Quote I don't think SG should be OHKing anything above their own tier level. I just find that they fall short against similar gear, and sometimes against lower level gear. The issue with your scenarios is that neither of those situations are usually achievable by a medium frame. Yes, if SG damage was to be increased, a medium frame with DMs would be able to deal a lot of damage, but they would still have to get withing 5m to get the chance. Getting that close both undetected and unscathed is extremely difficult for any medium frame suit, especially in a PRO vs. PRO environment. Medium suits cannot dampen efficiently, and they cannot reliably speed tank. Getting in close is hard enough as it is. For the scouts, they don't apply damage wise. You are still assuming that the SG will be able to 2HK from behind, but with a scout's limited fitting, that very likely won't be the case. For the second, I agree that it isn't how a scout should be getting most of their kills, but it still should be a matter of getting 2 shots off, as 3 is obscenely difficult in most situations. The Gallente is definitely much better than the Minmatar at this. I don't think that issue is with the weapon, it is the suit itself that needs readjustment. The Gallente is already difficult to reliably kill with the SG, only a select few are able to consistently pull it off. I can't really give much of a verdict on scouts, as I am just recently starting to skill into a Gal scout, as I am tired of trying to make the Min Ass a viable shotgun suit.
Shutter Fly Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 98	Posted - 2013.11.15 11:55:00 - [3] - Quote Acturus Galaxy wrote: Odd, I nearly always get a second shot off when I have sneaked up on a red berry, that is if they survive the first hit by my breach shotgun aimed at their heads. Only heavy tanked Gallente seems to need a seond shot to get through their thick armor skin. And about jumping into a doorway where one or several red dots are pointing their ARs ready to shoot at a skinny scout is suicide. I would never do that, leave this to frontline assaults that has the armor to survive the fire returned from inside the door. Move around the building and take them from behind. I think they need to create several scout classes, one that suits your need, an extremely quick and high dps role. And another scout role similar to what we have in the Gallente for the stealthy ewar type of role. I start to see the problem being different opinions about the scout role, one with your view for a hunter role common in many games, light armored with high damage. And another whom prefer the stealthy utility type which gathers intel, sneaks behind enenmy lines, hacks stuff and backstabs high ranked generals. etc. Sorry for the double post, wanted to give a quick response to this. As you said, you haven't had the chance to run Proto shotguns. From this, I take it you haven't used them in a completely Proto environment, like PC. Believe me, in PC, shotguns do not OHK anyone. That is the perspective I'm making my observations from.