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Tanking 1.7 Looking Crazily, underpowered? Char-Odelle, what will we do buddy :(

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Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 17:52:00 - [1] - Quote Svipdagr Hero wrote: Heya Everyone! Been mulling over the charts, and I just can't find a way to make these new 1.7 statistics match up to the awesomeness that is the vehicle I have now? Is this intentional for them to be seemingly nerfing tanks? I took a break when FFXIV came out, and am returning soon... Is there something I am missing? or are the tanks actually getting nerfed with this rework? @ CharOdell - dude, let me know if you found some good combinations with the new stats, I cant seem to find anything comparable to what I have now. Of course the coming nerf to tanks is intentional. They're removing active armor reps, soon they will be passive. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:07:00 - [2] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: I'm a little bit more confused with what they'll do with the slot layout for Minmatar and Amarr LAVs if the Gallente and Caldari highs and lows stay as they do. maybe Amarr would have three lows and no highs at standard and Minmatar would be the opposite at standard level. Minmatar would have to have their own small passive reps to make them at all viable. If there's no lows, there's no PG expansion, no ammo expansion, and no possibility for rep modules. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:09:00 - [3] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: AV was nerfed. Tankers will never be happy. You can survive an orbi in 1.7 using active defeses, dafuq do you want? AV is going to be nerfed. For the first time. Ever. We're still not going to be happy because the damage percentage is still basically going to be the same regarding AV against tanks. We'll be happy when tank v tank battles are closer to Chromosome. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:10:00 - [4] - Quote pegasis prime wrote: Smoky Fingers wrote: "Everything seems fine, maybe even better than before,that is.. until you've realized that you're out of ammo" yea and you spent your last rounds blowing up that supply depo hahahahaha if infantry could take and hold the supply depot..................... Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:12:00 - [5] - Quote Atiim wrote: I Guess some people won't be happy until thier tanks are invincible and can lock entire squads out of combat. Why do you want it balanced for pubs? Have you ever been in PC? Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:13:00 - [6] - Quote Atiim wrote: Racro 01 Arifistan wrote: says we are getting ammo for a our tanks to stop spraying and praying............ HTF do you think a blaster tank kills infantry? and you want to give it ammo? It's called balance. AV doesn't have infinite ammo so neither should HAVs. But the strength of AV (and the continued strength of AV when 1.7 comes) makes them outgunned by a single person and expensive paper weights. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:13:00 - [7] - Quote Atiim wrote: Mortedeamor wrote: Atiim wrote: I Guess some people won't be happy until thier tanks are invincible and can lock entire squads out of combat. wow can u cry some more? you really so scared of a bit of challenge? cry some more ..(coordinated tank /av gods soon tm. ) LOL Tankers shouldn't even talk about QQ. Heck I could flood entire countries with the buckets of tears I have from HAV Pilots You say "bit of challenge" as I driving a steel box with infinite ammo and only being vulnerable to 3 weapons in the entire game is easy. Militia. Missile. Turret. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:15:00 - [8] - Quote Vulpes Dolosus wrote: I've been mulling with the vehicle fitting tool stickied here and have been pleased with my tinkering. I've made tanks with 31k ehp (30sec, 4k passive, max skills iirc), and proto blasters. I've looked at dropships with 18k ehp for 30sec or 6k for 1min and a 15 sec cooldown with afterburner. I don't know how accurate this tool is or if any things changed, but so far I'm excited. I just wish I had my ADS... I'm guessing all the numbers so far are placeholder until we see CCP threads with titles like "Confirmed AV / Tank Numbers So Far," or later on, "1.7 AV and Tank Patch Notes." Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:16:00 - [9] - Quote Flix Keptick wrote: Cat Merc wrote: AV was nerfed. Tankers will never be happy. You can survive an orbi in 1.7 using active defeses, dafuq do you want? I am happy, I will have a massive power when my resists are on but will get owned during the 30+ sec cooldown. Everyone can be happy. The only ones that will whine will be people that play stupidly. No, the ones that will whine will again be infantry, because their MLT swarm can't 2HK a Madrugar with modules active. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:17:00 - [10] - Quote Atiim wrote: 21-33k EHP and swarms that deal 7,920 HP of damage (and that's at PRO tier, 6 people firing and they emptied thier entire clips) You don't think that's a problem? You really expect people to believe that 6 people firing ADV or PRO level swarms at an armor tank can't destroy it? Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.

Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:20:00 - [11] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Atiim wrote: 21-33k EHP and swarms that deal 7,920 HP of damage (and that's at PRO tier, 6 people firing and they emptied thier entire clips) You don't think that's a problem? 6 people. Firing at one person. I do not see the context, so I don't know if this is tanker QQ, but if it is... WTF do you want? Seriously how much more powerful do you want to be? Tanking against 6 people isn't enough? wtf No, he's on an anti-tanking crusade, and fully believes that with his minimal SP into tanking, he's going to take on people that have been tanking for months with full proficiency into it. He also thinks AV is hard, that you have to get right next to a tank to destroy it. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:23:00 - [12] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Cat Merc wrote: AV was nerfed. Tankers will never be happy. You can survive an orbi in 1.7 using active defeses, dafuq do you want? AV is going to be nerfed. For the first time. Ever. We're still not going to be happy because the damage percentage is still basically going to be the same regarding AV against tanks. We'll be happy when tank v tank battles are closer to Chromosome. You mean chromosome? The build where everyone with a bit of skills into tanks could get 50/0 in a tank? Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. The range of AV was nerfed, damage isn't everything. It used to be 400~ meters, now it's 150~ meters. Again, AV is going to be nerfed. The best early Christmas / Hanukkah present CCP could give tankers is just one week of adjusted AV numbers with current tanks. AV would whine and cry about "The Longest 7 Days in Dust History," when tanks have been suffering nerfs through consecutive builds. And it was the build when tanks were 2HK by other tanks. AV wasn't needed unless one side could not deploy any tanks at all. If there was just one rail tank on any team, that put every single tanker on notice that they could be destroyed in 3 seconds from anywhere, and there was nothing they could do about it. I really don't see infantry's problem with that. Maybe they're jealous they don't know how to pilot a tank. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:25:00 - [13] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Atiim wrote: I Guess some people won't be happy until thier tanks are invincible and can lock entire squads out of combat. Why do you want it balanced for pubs? Have you ever been in PC? Because like it or not, pubs are 99% of the game. If stuff was balanced for PC, so many things would be hugely overpowered in pubs... I don't see why CCP can't change values based on what someone queue's up for. 100% damage in PC, 90% in FW, 80% in pubs. PvE, when it comes out, would be 100%. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:26:00 - [14] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Atiim wrote: 21-33k EHP and swarms that deal 7,920 HP of damage (and that's at PRO tier, 6 people firing and they emptied thier entire clips) You don't think that's a problem? You really expect people to believe that 6 people firing ADV or PRO level swarms at an armor tank can't destroy it? During it's resist cycle? They can't. After that? LOLTANKISSCREWEDINONEVOLLEY If you really believe that a tank today with an active repper and 2 armor hardeners can survive, what, 16,000 damage every 2 seconds, then you must playing a completely different game. But your corp is always in alliance asking for tankers, so I don't expect any of you to know anything about tanking. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:28:00 - [15] - Quote Mossellia Delt wrote: Cat Merc wrote: AV was nerfed. Tankers will never be happy. You can survive an orbi in 1.7 using active defeses, dafuq do you want? Can curretly survive 2 orbitals, one after the other right now. Whats your point? Theoretically, yes, because rep modules are for 20 seconds and a precision strike is what, 10 seconds? So yes, an armor tank can survive 2 consecutive. The way to kill them faster is by dropping 2 at the same time, but that requires teamwork and you can't allow that. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:30:00 - [16] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Cat Merc wrote: AV was nerfed. Tankers will never be happy. You can survive an orbi in 1.7 using active defeses, dafuq do you want? AV is going to be nerfed. For the first time. Ever. We're still not going to be happy because the damage percentage is still basically going to be the same regarding AV against tanks. We'll be happy when tank v tank battles are closer to Chromosome. You mean chromosome? The build where everyone with a bit of skills into tanks could get 50/0 in a tank? Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. The range of AV was nerfed, damage isn't everything. It used to be 400~ meters, now it's 150~ meters. Again, AV is going to be nerfed. The best early Christmas / Hanukkah present CCP could give tankers is just one week of adjusted AV numbers with current tanks. AV would whine and cry about "The Longest 7 Days in Dust History," when tanks have been suffering nerfs through consecutive builds. And it was the build when tanks were 2HK by other tanks. AV wasn't needed unless one side could not deploy any tanks at all. If there was just one rail tank on any team, that put every single tanker on notice that they could be destroyed in 3 seconds from anywhere, and there was nothing they could do about it. I really don't see infantry's problem with that. Maybe they're jealous they don't know how to pilot a tank. No, we just don't want to see the game become Tank 514. If Tanks are just a power up, like they were a while ago, then infantry are only useful for hacking objectives :X It can never become Tank 514 because you can't deploy 16 vehicles per side, and not every objective can be reached by vehicle. So no, this could never become Tank 514. It could, and has, been TAR 514 and Flaylock 514, and was Swarm Launcher 514 [(AKA Halo) before swarms rightly had their dumbfire nerfed], and still is AR 514 because it beats everything but the sniper rifle at all ranges. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1225	Posted - 2013.11.14 18:33:00 - [17] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Atiim wrote: 21-33k EHP and swarms that deal 7,920 HP of damage (and that's at PRO tier, 6 people firing and they emptied thier entire clips) You don't think that's a problem? You really expect people to believe that 6 people firing ADV or PRO level swarms at an armor tank can't destroy it? During it's resist cycle? They can't. After that? LOLTANKISSCREWEDINONEVOLLEY If you really believe that a tank today with an active repper and 2 armor hardeners can survive, what, 16,000 damage every 2 seconds, then you must playing a completely different game. But your corp is always in alliance asking for tankers, so I don't expect any of you to know anything about tanking. I was talking about 1.7. There's no intelligent tanker that would have both hardeners active before going in to fight infantry, before they know if AV is around, and if there is AV, how many have it and how powerful it is. You're talking about something that will last less than 3 days, not something that's going to last for months. First one is for brawling, second one is for escaping. Any tanker with a brain realizes that. Stop brainstorming about a possible god mode for tanks. We've never had it and never will. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1229	Posted - 2013.11.14 23:20:00 - [18] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Cat Merc wrote: AV was nerfed. Tankers will never be happy. You can survive an orbi in 1.7 using active defeses, dafuq do you want? AV is going to be nerfed. For the first time. Ever. We're still not going to be happy because the damage percentage is still basically going to be the same regarding AV against tanks. We'll be happy when tank v tank battles are closer to Chromosome. You mean chromosome? The build where everyone with a bit of skills into tanks could get 50/0 in a tank? Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. The range of AV was nerfed, damage isn't everything. It used to be 400~ meters, now it's 150~ meters. Again, AV is going to be nerfed. The best early Christmas / Hanukkah present CCP could give tankers is just one week of adjusted AV numbers with current tanks. AV would whine and cry about "The Longest 7 Days in Dust History," when tanks have been suffering nerfs through consecutive builds. And it was the build when tanks were 2HK by other tanks. AV wasn't needed unless one side could not deploy any tanks at all. If there was just one rail tank on any team, that put every single tanker on notice that they could be destroyed in 3 seconds from anywhere, and there was nothing they could do about it. I really don't see infantry's problem with that. Maybe they're jealous they don't know how to pilot a tank. You mean the build when this game became World of Tanks? Where the easiest way to win was to spam tanks? Hell back then all infantry guys were useless except for hacking objectives. Tanks could've countered tanks, but no, that's not fair to you. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1229	Posted - 2013.11.14 23:21:00 - [19] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Void Echo wrote: well... you guys had cod514 for the past year now... this game is nearly dead because of it, back when tanks were actually tanks this game was alive. Uhh... No... Not everyone wants to be a tanker, but everyone needs to have at least BASIC infantry skills. What does that mean? That the game is an infantry game first, tanks come around that. Nowhere in Dust 514 does it say infantry comes first. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1229	Posted - 2013.11.14 23:22:00 - [20] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: You do know that back then (In closed beta) we had less players then we do now right? LOL!! *Closed beta required a beta key.* Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.

Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1229	Posted - 2013.11.14 23:29:00 - [21] - Quote Atiim wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Atiim wrote: 21-33k EHP and swarms that deal 7,920 HP of damage (and that's at PRO tier, 6 people firing and they emptied thier entire clips) You don't think that's a problem? 6 people. Firing at one person. I do not see the context, so I don't know if this is tanker QQ, but if it is... WTF do you want? Seriously how much more powerful do you want to be? Tanking against 6 people isn't enough? wtf Not tanker QQ The new PRO swarms deal 1320 base damage per clip. (1320*6=7920) Meaning that if an entire squad emptied their clip of swarms into ONE tank, they would do 7920. That is a huge problem when HAVs have around 33k eHP. Meaning tanks would be roflstompeasyofficerweaponredlinethale'striagehivescrwithamarrasssuaktmk.0duvolle mode. I did terrible at math all throughout school and I know you're lying to prove a lame point. You're forgetting proficiency. You're forgetting the ability to stack 5 damage mods on PRO suits. You're forgetting that if they're smart, they'll hold back 4 people, or meet the tank on another area of the map to ambush it when a hardener goes offline. You're basically forgetting everything else except rudimentary stuff. Which is par for the course for infantry. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1229	Posted - 2013.11.14 23:30:00 - [22] - Quote CLONE117 wrote: well im pretty sure one of the most powerful maddy fittings involves nothing but a light repper. and active hardeners. currently that fitting can almost tank an entire forger gunners base ammo capacity.... as for the tank changes in 1.7 im not sure whats going to happen to my decently fitted soma tank. it can take a few/2-3, mlt swarm hits. before needed to head back for reps. still have no proper protection from av nades. although i think it would be nice if my obs that i dropped directly ontop of those havs had not survived... only way to kill a tank now a days is an ob+av at the same time.. the av just finishing the hav off.. if active resists are made to be less effective that could solve the current tank problems.. i dont think the reppers are the problems at that point as they really only provide barely enough time to escape death. i feel the active resist mods are the issues at hand. If you're only pretty sure, methinks you're not a tanker. A light armor repper on a tank = death. Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me, such is the motto of the anti vehicle infantry.