That links not working for me.

And yet despite this fact the freedom assault, having the tightest dispersion, also has the best damage application at medium to close range.

Doesn't make sense, does it?

Advice from a former HMG heavy in Chromosome, when heavies were much weaker than they are now.

-Try to keep the majority of the target within the aiming reticle circle.

-Start firing before you actually have a line of sight on your target. This allows your stream of bullets to concentrate to killing efficiency when you engage your enemy instead of having to wait when you engage.

-Don't listen to idiots who say strafing is pointless for heavies. ALWAYS STRAFE! Strafe with the primary goal of tracking your target. Your secondary goal should be to avoid enemy fire.

-Cover is your friend and worst enemy. Don't rely on your EHP to keep you alive, use cover. When an enemy uses cover, a portion of their body is protected and reduces your HMG's killing power.

-The Gallente logi-LAV not only mitigates a heavy's poor mobility, but also provides an armor rep.

+1 for science, and if Cyrius Li-Moody posts here, he'll get a +1 for taking one (or two, or three) for the team.

At the risk of sounding like an ass, however:

Red reticule means you are doing damage. White reticule means you are not.

We all intuitively knew this, whether or not we had confirmation that the tiny little dot in the center is what determines the activation of the reticule.

Is there any way you can turn your considerable scientific talents to determining the reduction in HMG damage based on distance, or whether the larger circle in the reticule has any effect on applied damage whatsoever?

I'll provide you with a near-endless stream of Likes if you can keep this going.

Let me rephrase: is there a way to test whether crouching actually increases DPS, or whether the effect of the reticule "tightening" after firing for a second has a confirmable and/or significant effect on DPS?

This is all given the fact that you need the center dot on target to do any damage whatsoever.


ED: For more clarification: My theory is that CCP is simulating dispersion by mathematically reducing damage based on the fraction of the aiming reticule filled by the target. You need to have it centered to do any damage at all, yes, but I'm curious if applied DPS increases the more the target fills the reticule.

I've had this theory for a while now, but can't really figure out a way to test it. I don't believe HMG DPS is reduced simply by a range-to-target calculation the same way the AR gets treated. I believe another factor is involved.

Okay, good to know.

So in your opinion, the poor performance of the HMG at 30m (a distance still within HMG optimal range), is essentially due to bad player aim because of a misunderstanding of how the reticule actually works?

If so... I guess I need to "get gud."

ED: I suppose that would mean the "aim tightening" effect of firing the HMG for a second is almost totally for flavor and has no effect whatsoever if your aim is good.

Yea I kinda thought this was common knowledge, at least among HMG users. But I won't complain about having video evidence. Although I recall that among every single thread that has brought this problem up, there's been literally zero blue tags in response, which kinda worries me.

Well sir, you have inspired me. Off to do some testing.

If this is all correct, and lost DPS at range is actually lost to kick taking the center dot off target, an Assault HMG should be able to top a similar tier Assault Rifle at all ranges provided your aim is true. (The AHMG actually has a superior range profile and DPS.)

I'm going to leave my pre-conceived prejudices at the door and give it the good ol' college try.

Does anyone know IWS's info? This is something that the CPM should at least have their mind on with the whole TTK issue being dealt with right now

I don't know if it's actually a bug. It may have always been this way. We just lolled at the description that read "pin-point accurate stream of gunfire." Turns out it's true.

Psychology and subjectivity trolled us...

Thats it! heavies cant aim! Who wouldve known -_- on the other hand my shotgun can be point blank and still not function properly... Your weapon does, i dont wanna hear it... Although i agree a hmg's spread should be much larger. The smg functions like a hmg more than the hmg. But my hate for heavies in chromosome when i first started in standard gear is keeping me from sympathizing.

Right, so the hmg issue is how the system registers and calculates damage.
Could it be set this way because it would be too taxing to calculate each individual round with the speed they are fired? Also interested if the burst has been tested? Nobody seems to mention the burst when discussing hmg issues.

probably a friendly PC game. or a FW games with mostly friends on both sides

I'm not sure you're reading your own results correctly there, Ghaz. 30m optimal isn't that horrible compared to AR's 38m, and AHMG has

It could be that every single weapon in the game has pin-point perfect accuracy, and that all problems stem from our perceptions on how they should work.

So it seems most agree that this is not working as intended. Now if only we can get some confirmation from CCP

It only seems to do this when standing still. If you move at all you can notice there is much more spread.

You can visualy see the bullets travel away from the center when your moving. Ive even tested it and got hit markers when i had the point in the center not aimed at the target.

hopefully us heavies can have a improved HMG to murder all those reds with
and maybe go back to the days when we were feared

I feel dumb..

I use to whine stating that the dispersion was far too much which ultimately added to the HMG's inaccuracies. After all this time, it turns out that I just suck at aiming...

No wonder why I play a support medic MinLogi with an Assault MD now... because I can't shoot.

For reference, in the first example of Ghaz's video, his target was standing at 23m.

Before pulling the trigger, I'd estimate his target filled 20-30% of the aiming reticule. After a second of firing, he filled the majority of it. (my guestimation: 65-80%).

Seems about right to me for how I think it should work, if damage were to actually be linked to how much the target fills the reticule. I'd maybe make it a little tighter so a target filled 75% at 30m.

I'd go for anything at all over the current mechanics in game, though...

20 minutes.

Still sad.

Isn't 1.7 already content locked?

I suppose this could be the case if Aim Assist is not active for the HMG. That would explain why the HMG did not get the sudden boost in effectiveness that all the other automatic weapons did with 1.4.

If Aim Assist was active, the different in kick would not be enough to break Aim Assist if the player was half way decent and compensating for the kick.

Personally, I think you guys shot yourself in the foot.
Dont ask for MORE dispersion... you should have asked for a better reticle!
You're gonna die worse, if they actually "fix" this. your range (which you didnt know you had, but you do NOW..) will be screwed.

Unfortunately, knowing how to use it properly does not it a superior weapon to its competition.

Never designed for combat further than 30m? Says who? Far as I know, before Uprising the HMG was handling that range with ease, and no heavy was complaining about the HMG. Uprising came along, HMGs got nerfed to crap, and assault players rejoiced! When last have you seen a "THE HMG IS OP!!!" thread? ...exactly.

People need to drop this crap about "HEAVIES ARE ONLY FOR CQC! LEARN TO PLAY YOUR ROLE!" Again, heavies were a formidable enemy when they were pushing the front lines to an objective. Not camping a hack like they are doing now.

HMGs were nerfed because Assault players couldn't 1v1 a heavy, and everyday was a QQ thread about it during Chromosome. They got their wish in Uprising, and heavies were basically forced to camp objectives, and people just took it. People just assumed "Well, heavies are only for CQC, so the HMG is perfect." Big mistake, and we're still paying for it to this day because people didn't make enough noise.

One thing that I would like to see tested is the actual DPS of the HMG.

Take a standard HMG, stand so that the other suit takes up the entire aiming circle and count how bullets it takes to kill them.

The stats of the weapon state that it has an accuracy of 61%, and I take that to mean that 61% of the bullets hit the small dot, but what happens to the other 39%?

I have seen several threads that complain about the Hit detection on the HMG is horrible, and that it feels like a 1/3 bullets never hit.

Could this be where this issue is coming from?

I have watched the video, what I mean is on paper the HMG has a DPS of around 566.66 (17 per bullet time 2000 rpm divided by 60 seconds) The test I would like to see is at point blank range with the small white dot center chest with the enemy taking up the entire larger circle.

By counting how many bullets it takes to kill a suit (amarr would be best because of the shields and armor equal) we could take the total HP of the suit divided by the number of rounds it takes to kill and see it is even close to 17.

I have had several occasions where I had someone dead to rights (they were hacking a terminal, sniper, looking the other way) and it seemed that it took forever to kill them.

The question that I have is if the 61% accuracy are the only bullets even when the white dot is center chest and any dispersion should still hit the target, or do the 39% disappear even in a perfect control test?

I think it was around Uprising 1.3, but I remember squadding up with a Heavy by the name of "Red Dragonfly." We were in a Domination match and this guy was beasting. With only an ADV basic Heavy frame and an MH-82, he went somewhere around 55-3 in that game while I went 21-10 in a similar fitting. Thinking about it now, he had be one hell of a good shot to attain a score like that with such a gimped weapon.

i haz noe gun game.....

*runs back to Assault MD and rep tool*

I still have not seen any official comment in when they hope to fix this issue?

I just tried the scrambler rifle last night...lulz I may never go back to being an hmg again this thing allows me to get ridiculous kills. And here I have been so frustrated playing with the HMG and this thing I can take out two if not three heavies side by side, in a light suit... Wow reminds me of pre uprising the way the HMG used to be

Any chance of a hotfix on this CCP or will it require something more substantial? I'm running out of puppies to strangle and kittens to drown.

I find that the boiling water also serves to tenderize the meat.