DUST Search - Make uplink spam increase spawn time

Krom Ganesh wrote:

Skihids wrote:

This isn't really required, but it's the least onerous way to discourage very close placement of uplinks.

It's basically a stacking penalty like the others we are familiar with. Two uplinks close together increases the spawn time on each by a small fraction, a third a bit more, and the fourth even more. That would throttle the arrival rate of mercs to just a little under what it would be if you had only the one uplink. The stacking penalty should never make the total time for a squad to spawn than if there was one link as stacking penalties never make adding another module actually hurt your stat. That is, adding another damage modifier doesn't reduce your damage, it just adds only a little bit.

The penalty would come in the form of lowering in the spawn time of a single merc.

This is very reasonable but I'm afraid my suggest would increase spawn time for a squad in an uplink spammed area. If only one merc could use an uplink at a time (as in you can't even select it while someone is spawning on it), then it would be fairly simple to make it so a squad would spawn in the same amount of time on 6 uplinks as it would with 1. However, multiple mercs can spawn on one uplink at a time so average squad time of spawning would go up.


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Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2375	Posted - 2013.11.01 15:38:00 - [1] - Quote This isn't really required, but it's the least onerous way to discourage very close placement of uplinks. It's basically a stacking penalty like the others we are familiar with. Two uplinks close together increases the spawn time on each by a small fraction, a third a bit more, and the fourth even more. That would throttle the arrival rate of mercs to just a little under what it would be if you had only the one uplink. The stacking penalty should never make the total time for a squad to spawn than if there was one link as stacking penalties never make adding another module actually hurt your stat. That is, adding another damage modifier doesn't reduce your damage, it just adds only a little bit. The penalty would come in the form of lowering in the spawn time of a single merc.
Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2375	Posted - 2013.11.01 17:57:00 - [2] - Quote Krom Ganesh wrote: Skihids wrote: This isn't really required, but it's the least onerous way to discourage very close placement of uplinks. It's basically a stacking penalty like the others we are familiar with. Two uplinks close together increases the spawn time on each by a small fraction, a third a bit more, and the fourth even more. That would throttle the arrival rate of mercs to just a little under what it would be if you had only the one uplink. The stacking penalty should never make the total time for a squad to spawn than if there was one link as stacking penalties never make adding another module actually hurt your stat. That is, adding another damage modifier doesn't reduce your damage, it just adds only a little bit. The penalty would come in the form of lowering in the spawn time of a single merc. This is very reasonable but I'm afraid my suggest would increase spawn time for a squad in an uplink spammed area. If only one merc could use an uplink at a time (as in you can't even select it while someone is spawning on it), then it would be fairly simple to make it so a squad would spawn in the same amount of time on 6 uplinks as it would with 1. However, multiple mercs can spawn on one uplink at a time so average squad time of spawning would go up. Ah, I heard that MCRU spawns were sequential and assumed that was true of uplinks as well. If that is correct then there is very little rational for penalizing grouped uplinks. If close grouping doesn't yield an advantage, why worry about it? If they are that close one flux will take them out so it's no no more difficult to clear three as one. If they are dispersed far enough that you can't get to them, then you aren't in immediate danger from someone spawning on them. What's really the problem here?
Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2375	Posted - 2013.11.01 19:25:00 - [3] - Quote Your suggestion would basically make uplinks useless. I find that strategic use of uplinks involves deploying several in an arc at the battle front in Domination. A single uplink concentrates your team in one place that invites grenades and orbitals. I rarely drop two links within thirty meters of each other, the exception being the bridge in Domination mode as there is a single approach to the objective. Strategic deployment in Skirmish involves two or three uplinks near the objective but separated enough that they encourage different routes/flanking to the objective. The worst thing you can do with uplinks is to concentrate your team in one place. Thats one reason I am reluctant to place uplinks on rooftops. It tends to concentrate the entire team in one small area which yields control to the opposite team and results in a slaughter as the enemy has one small area to concentrate on. Properly shaping a battle with uplinks requires five or more depending on the mode. Limit deployment to one and you can't so much with it. People aren't giving much thought to this, and that's because the majority haven't spent much if any time in the role of Logistics. I'm not talking about water bearers running around with a rep tool attached to a heavy, but someone who is working at a higher level to create a tend to lines of reinforcement or creating flanking opportunities. There's a whole level of game beyond rushing around and shooting face. Some of us prefer that.
Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2375	Posted - 2013.11.01 20:17:00 - [4] - Quote I'd like to get a clear description of the problem and how any proposed solution addresses it, along with consideration of unintended consequences. For example: [Ul]Closely spaced uplinks[/ul] Definition: Three or more uplinks within five meters of each other, possibly blocked from each other by structures Habitat: Generally found around the objective in Domination Effect: allows the defending team to respawn quickly, hindering conquest of the area by a small number of opponents who cannot destroy all of them quickly. Desired effect: a small number of mercs should be able to whittle down the occupying force over time to take it, but cannot due to multiple uplinks. Proposed solution: increase spawn time for closely spaced uplinks by X percentage/seconds for each uplink within a five meter radius of each uplink. How this works to mitigate the effect and achieve the desired outcome: this slows down the respawn rate which allows a kill rate of X eventually eliminate the occupying force. Unintended consequences/workarounds: placement of only one or two well placed uplinks still allows full speed respawning and still protects the resupply line.
Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2377	Posted - 2013.11.02 02:28:00 - [5] - Quote Quote: Effect: allows the defending team to respawn quickly, hindering conquest of the area by a small number of opponents who cannot destroy all of them quickly. - It isn't so much the speed of spawn, but the difficulty of preventing their spawning. So the closer together the links are the easier it is to destroy all at once, right? Quote: How this works to mitigate the effect and achieve the desired outcome: this slows down the respawn rate which allows a kill rate of X eventually eliminate the occupying force. - By slowing down the respawn rate, the attack force is given a better chance of removing the vast amount of uplinks. Wait, you JUST said it won't alter the spawn rate! If there is no waiting on an uplink, then the respawn rate of ten uplinks is the same as one. So this proposal won't do what you want. Quote: Unintended consequences/workarounds: placement of only one or two well placed uplinks still allows full speed respawning and still protects the resupply line. - As it should. There is nothing wrong with using uplinks to effectively hold an area. The problem is that after the enemy team has placed so many uplinks your team cannot destroy them fast enough to stem the flow of enemies no matter how well they are handling them. In other words, if you have enough uplinks in an area, you effectively create a spawn hub that is extremely difficult if not impossible to shut down. Imagine playing a round of domination with objective spawning. I have played Domination with objective spawning. The difference is that you can't flux or destroy the letter with an OB. I have also placed numerous uplinks on and around an objective and had the enemy roll my team and destroy every last one of them both with and without an OB. Uplinks won't save an out played team, even on the bridge which is probably the most subject to uplink use.