DUST Search - Randomness from Sinboto: basic heavy

Fizzer94 wrote:

Vitharr Foebane wrote:

Fizzer94 wrote:

THUNDERGROOVE wrote:

Here's my comment:
If they don't fix the HMG by the next respec I'm going back to my old role of a scout.

That's how bad the heavy is, that I'd rather be a scout. In fact, I've actually been skilling into some fancy Minja suits and shotguns along with biotic mods.

They should make the HMG slightly more effective than an AR, but with a shorter range. Then they should buff the heavies HP and lower their speed. Let the suit be its own thing, just as good as any other suit, a suit that just happens to cater to a different playstyle. Then make the HMG its own thing, just as effective as any other weapon, with its own range and damage and such.
The heavy and heavy weapon should stop being paired up with each other like they were made for each other. The heavy suit should just be its own dropsuit type, not one that has to use a heavy weapon to be any good. And the HMG should just be another weapon in the Heavies arsenal, no better or worse than other weapons, just different.

I'd hardly call TWO weapons an arsenal...

I mean along with all the light weapons a heavy can weild. There you go thinking a heavy needs to be using a heavy weapon.
The main tradeoffs for a heavy should be:

-Speed,+ Detectability in exchange for +EHP, and IMO reduced headshot damage
-Equipment,-Slots in exchange for access to heavy weapons

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Sinboto Simmons SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1640	Posted - 2013.10.27 16:43:00 - [1] - Quote So had an alt laying around and I haven't used heavy since chrome so I decided to skill into a basic heavy, and heavy weapons, fitted it like a new guy would and droped into around 10 ambushes. Whoo boy did it suck, ARs ripped through my slow behind with extreme, almost disturbing, effectiveness I could gun down most with my hmg or hit um with the forge if I had enough time but usually I'd be gunned down within two seconds by a single assault (or an assault guy in a logi suit) even a scrambler rifle user wrecked my **** before I could put him down at close range. I'll see how it improves with investments, truly curious now.
Sinboto Simmons SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1645	Posted - 2013.10.28 03:06:00 - [2] - Quote no comments? strange.....
Khal V'Rani Nephilim Initiative 358	Posted - 2013.10.28 03:14:00 - [3] - Quote Don't waste the sp, isk or more importantly your time man. How's that for a comment? :p
Chad Michael Murray NECROM0NGERS 116	Posted - 2013.10.28 03:16:00 - [4] - Quote Use a forge gun, don't play ambush or play with a squad and stick with them. Not really rocket science :S
Flix Keptick Red Star. EoN. 835	Posted - 2013.10.28 03:17:00 - [5] - Quote I rip heavies with my smg :/
Joel II X AHPA 78	Posted - 2013.10.28 03:20:00 - [6] - Quote Heavies are a joke nowadays unless you run proto. I see heavies getting shredded by starter suits because they're faster, have longer range, and are more accurate lol
SoTa PoP MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 4337	Posted - 2013.10.28 03:31:00 - [7] - Quote SCRUBS. The heavies only problem is range. If AR are taking you down then you're not where you should be in a pub match, In fact - in pubs heavies are a dominate force, especially one in a good LLAV. It's in PC matches where the heavy turns to utter garbage if he isn't camping a roof with a FG.
THUNDERGROOVE ZionTCD Public Disorder. 1184	Posted - 2013.10.28 03:39:00 - [8] - Quote Here's my comment: If they don't fix the HMG by the next respec I'm going back to my old role of a scout. That's how bad the heavy is, that I'd rather be a scout. In fact, I've actually been skilling into some fancy Minja suits and shotguns along with biotic mods.
IMMORTAL WAR HERO BAD SANTA'S SCHOOL 4 SCOUNDRELS 61	Posted - 2013.10.28 03:42:00 - [9] - Quote the dren heavy is the friendly heavy
The Attorney General MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 1362	Posted - 2013.10.28 03:43:00 - [10] - Quote My heavy alt has all that wasted SP into the HMG. I am more effective running two SMG's than the HMG. Lower fitting requirements, same small engagement range, but at least my shots go where they are supposed to. Plus, that way your damage mods work on both weapons, instead of just the ****** HMG. Sota is right though, if you can't keep them close, you are messing up. Also, a heavy without a LAV, even a MLT one, is at a severe disadvantage.
Fizzer94 L.O.T.I.S. Public Disorder. 640	Posted - 2013.10.28 04:11:00 - [11] - Quote THUNDERGROOVE wrote: Here's my comment: If they don't fix the HMG by the next respec I'm going back to my old role of a scout. That's how bad the heavy is, that I'd rather be a scout. In fact, I've actually been skilling into some fancy Minja suits and shotguns along with biotic mods. They should make the HMG slightly more effective than an AR, but with a shorter range. Then they should buff the heavies HP and lower their speed. Let the suit be its own thing, just as good as any other suit, a suit that just happens to cater to a different playstyle. Then make the HMG its own thing, just as effective as any other weapon, with its own range and damage and such. The heavy and heavy weapon should stop being paired up with each other like they were made for each other. The heavy suit should just be its own dropsuit type, not one that has to use a heavy weapon to be any good. And the HMG should just be another weapon in the Heavies arsenal, no better or worse than other weapons, just different.
Vitharr Foebane Blood Money Mercenaries 159	Posted - 2013.10.28 04:21:00 - [12] - Quote Fizzer94 wrote: THUNDERGROOVE wrote: Here's my comment: If they don't fix the HMG by the next respec I'm going back to my old role of a scout. That's how bad the heavy is, that I'd rather be a scout. In fact, I've actually been skilling into some fancy Minja suits and shotguns along with biotic mods. They should make the HMG slightly more effective than an AR, but with a shorter range. Then they should buff the heavies HP and lower their speed. Let the suit be its own thing, just as good as any other suit, a suit that just happens to cater to a different playstyle. Then make the HMG its own thing, just as effective as any other weapon, with its own range and damage and such. The heavy and heavy weapon should stop being paired up with each other like they were made for each other. The heavy suit should just be its own dropsuit type, not one that has to use a heavy weapon to be any good. And the HMG should just be another weapon in the Heavies arsenal, no better or worse than other weapons, just different. I'd hardly call TWO weapons an arsenal...
THUNDERGROOVE ZionTCD Public Disorder. 1184	Posted - 2013.10.28 04:25:00 - [13] - Quote Fizzer94 wrote: THUNDERGROOVE wrote: Here's my comment: If they don't fix the HMG by the next respec I'm going back to my old role of a scout. That's how bad the heavy is, that I'd rather be a scout. In fact, I've actually been skilling into some fancy Minja suits and shotguns along with biotic mods. They should make the HMG slightly more effective than an AR, but with a shorter range. Then they should buff the heavies HP and lower their speed. Let the suit be its own thing, just as good as any other suit, a suit that just happens to cater to a different playstyle. Then make the HMG its own thing, just as effective as any other weapon, with its own range and damage and such. The heavy and heavy weapon should stop being paired up with each other like they were made for each other. The heavy suit should just be its own dropsuit type, not one that has to use a heavy weapon to be any good. And the HMG should just be another weapon in the Heavies arsenal, no better or worse than other weapons, just different. The problem isn't the damage Or the range It's the dispersion, you aim at their chest and half the bullets go on either side of them.
Fizzer94 L.O.T.I.S. Public Disorder. 640	Posted - 2013.10.28 04:28:00 - [14] - Quote Vitharr Foebane wrote: Fizzer94 wrote: THUNDERGROOVE wrote: Here's my comment: If they don't fix the HMG by the next respec I'm going back to my old role of a scout. That's how bad the heavy is, that I'd rather be a scout. In fact, I've actually been skilling into some fancy Minja suits and shotguns along with biotic mods. They should make the HMG slightly more effective than an AR, but with a shorter range. Then they should buff the heavies HP and lower their speed. Let the suit be its own thing, just as good as any other suit, a suit that just happens to cater to a different playstyle. Then make the HMG its own thing, just as effective as any other weapon, with its own range and damage and such. The heavy and heavy weapon should stop being paired up with each other like they were made for each other. The heavy suit should just be its own dropsuit type, not one that has to use a heavy weapon to be any good. And the HMG should just be another weapon in the Heavies arsenal, no better or worse than other weapons, just different. I'd hardly call TWO weapons an arsenal... I mean along with all the light weapons a heavy can weild. There you go thinking a heavy needs to be using a heavy weapon. The main tradeoffs for a heavy should be: -Speed,+ Detectability in exchange for +EHP, and IMO reduced headshot damage -Equipment,-Slots in exchange for access to heavy weapons
Broonfondle Majikthies Bannana Boat Corp 364	Posted - 2013.10.28 04:32:00 - [15] - Quote My alt runs a basic heavy and HMG (ok, I caved, I didn't want any suit till Min Heavy was out but the militia is so cack) I tear people apart, even proto's. There is nothing wrong with them and I go solo. Just cus their heavy and have lots of health doesn't make them invulnerable - nor should they be. Use cover, close in on the target, get them from behind (yes its slow as hell but the reaction when you round that last corner and gun down 4 guys in a row is priceless) Maybe I'm too used to running around with an SMG and a scout suit but I use the same tactics for all my characters. What can I say, I hate stand up firefights. I like to outflank and win decisively.
Jacques Cayton II CALDARI SPECIAL FORCES -the specials 54	Posted - 2013.10.28 05:09:00 - [16] - Quote Broonfondle Majikthies wrote: My alt runs a basic heavy and HMG (ok, I caved, I didn't want any suit till Min Heavy was out but the militia is so cack) I tear people apart, even proto's. There is nothing wrong with them and I go solo. Just cus their heavy and have lots of health doesn't make them invulnerable - nor should they be. Use cover, close in on the target, get them from behind (yes its slow as hell but the reaction when you round that last corner and gun down 4 guys in a row is priceless) Maybe I'm too used to running around with an SMG and a scout suit but I use the same tactics for all my characters. What can I say, I hate stand up firefights. I like to outflank and win decisively. You just described a scout you have no say in the matter a heavy is the point defense he soaks the bullets and takes a big gun to kill people. He is not meant to die easily, he is not meant to attack from the rear, he is meant to be out front doing damage and soaking rounds. If a heavy was meant to use scout tactics he would be a scout. More range or dispersion cut from 35% to 10%. And give the heavy more hp not to much to make it fair. Reasoning behind this Science thats why.
Khal V'Rani Nephilim Initiative 358	Posted - 2013.10.28 05:18:00 - [17] - Quote The Amarr Sentinel is designed for point defense... Let's not force the other heavy suits when they come out be forced into the same role with no variety.
Broonfondle Majikthies Bannana Boat Corp 364	Posted - 2013.10.29 03:20:00 - [18] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: Broonfondle Majikthies wrote: My alt runs a basic heavy and HMG (ok, I caved, I didn't want any suit till Min Heavy was out but the militia is so cack) I tear people apart, even proto's. There is nothing wrong with them and I go solo. Just cus their heavy and have lots of health doesn't make them invulnerable - nor should they be. Use cover, close in on the target, get them from behind (yes its slow as hell but the reaction when you round that last corner and gun down 4 guys in a row is priceless) Maybe I'm too used to running around with an SMG and a scout suit but I use the same tactics for all my characters. What can I say, I hate stand up firefights. I like to outflank and win decisively. You just described a scout you have no say in the matter a heavy is the point defense he soaks the bullets and takes a big gun to kill people. He is not meant to die easily, he is not meant to attack from the rear, he is meant to be out front doing damage and soaking rounds. If a heavy was meant to use scout tactics he would be a scout. More range or dispersion cut from 35% to 10%. And give the heavy more hp not to much to make it fair. Reasoning behind this Science thats why. I believe I just described a TACTIC, not a suit characteristic But fine, if you want my suit to go round said corner and be even harder to kill then I won't complain. At the end of the day, the balance of the heavy is and should be that it is a healthier suit, not a harder one. Something that can indeed take more hits but is balance by the fact it can't reposition and be everywhere at once, should be vulnerable when alone and in the open and is harder to miss - exactly what it it now
Powerh8er Norwegian Dust514 Corporation Top Men. 202	Posted - 2013.10.29 03:41:00 - [19] - Quote There is no use on a battlefield for a machinegun that doesnt outrange an rifle. I didnt specc into HMG's to spend my time hiding inside bunkers or ride around in a car.
Lily Q Red and Silver Hand Amarr Empire 10	Posted - 2013.10.29 04:27:00 - [20] - Quote Crouch +ADS + HMG = Effective Unfortunately you are a sitting duck, however it's not all that less maneuverable than standing :(
Ludvig Enraga KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 626	Posted - 2013.10.29 04:47:00 - [21] - Quote Not to throw myself into a lion's cage, but here is my very limited experience with heavy in uprising. On one of my pissed off scout days I put some SP into basic heavy and put on MD, SMG for weaps and complex shields and kin cat (scout modules that I had trained). I cant say that I was an unstoppable force of nature but in general I did much better than I usually do on my advanced and even proto light frame. So in my limited experience heavy does better than scout. In general I think CCP should give up on their "we don't tell you what style to play, you make your own fit and build your own style" BS because it clearly does not work. Instead there is the tanked medium frame style with AR as the only viable option. I think they should make it so that each suit type has modules that only that suit can equip and those modules scale up according to what's appropriate for the suit. So that there is a huge gap in progression between different suits (for example, +60 shield to a scout is not the same as +60 shield module to a heavy, which is what we have now). Also they should make it so that in general heavy can kill a medium in most circumstances, medium can kill a scout, and scout can kill a heavy easily. F.E. heavy has raw DPS and range to melt mediums even at moderate distance. Scout has good speed so that a heavy can't track a scout up close (e.g. nerf heavy rotation speed) while scout has high rotational speed to be able to keep a heavy in crosshairs. Mediums should have a rotational speed similar to scouts so that they can track a scout who is dancing around them.
Rusty Shallows Black Jackals 443	Posted - 2013.10.29 05:05:00 - [22] - Quote Sinboto Simmons wrote: snip I'll see how it improves with investments, truly curious now. If possible please provide updates to the forums. Working under the premise CCP will never give out another repec I've been avoiding putting any SP that Skill Tree branch until the other suits are put out. You have my sympathies with ambushes. The two instances when I'm successful tend to be when the blues have a strong front and I'm able to assault forge at a moderate elevation just behind them. The other would be using a LAV BPO to circle like a vulture looking for opportune forge spots, preferably to the side and rear so that no one sees the glowey balls inbound. I've never had a good ambush with the HMG. Okay times but never really worth the costs.
Vitharr Foebane Blood Money Mercenaries 163	Posted - 2013.10.29 05:25:00 - [23] - Quote Fizzer94 wrote: Vitharr Foebane wrote: Fizzer94 wrote: THUNDERGROOVE wrote: Here's my comment: If they don't fix the HMG by the next respec I'm going back to my old role of a scout. That's how bad the heavy is, that I'd rather be a scout. In fact, I've actually been skilling into some fancy Minja suits and shotguns along with biotic mods. They should make the HMG slightly more effective than an AR, but with a shorter range. Then they should buff the heavies HP and lower their speed. Let the suit be its own thing, just as good as any other suit, a suit that just happens to cater to a different playstyle. Then make the HMG its own thing, just as effective as any other weapon, with its own range and damage and such. The heavy and heavy weapon should stop being paired up with each other like they were made for each other. The heavy suit should just be its own dropsuit type, not one that has to use a heavy weapon to be any good. And the HMG should just be another weapon in the Heavies arsenal, no better or worse than other weapons, just different. I'd hardly call TWO weapons an arsenal... I mean along with all the light weapons a heavy can weild. There you go thinking a heavy needs to be using a heavy weapon. The main tradeoffs for a heavy should be: -Speed,+ Detectability in exchange for +EHP, and IMO reduced headshot damage -Equipment,-Slots in exchange for access to heavy weapons With all due respect, you are f*cking wrong... the point of a HEAVY dropsuit is to use a HEAVY weapon to inflict HEAVY damage on the enemy be it a person or vehicle. The fact that almost half the heavies i see are using ARs disgusts me and is an extremely telling sign that heavies are a joke right now. HINT HINT CCP Dedicated fattie in need of new heavy content.
medomai grey WarRavens League of Infamy 298	Posted - 2013.10.29 05:47:00 - [24] - Quote Sinboto Simmons wrote: no comments? strange..... If your heavy suit doesn't have a 1000 EHP without any mods attached, then your suit isn't a real heavy suit. It's more of a slow big target that can carry a heavy weapon. Blatant Dust_514 recruiting in the silliest of places. :P
Knox Firmus Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 25	Posted - 2014.01.27 05:28:00 - [25] - Quote Rise, riiiise, RIIIIIISE! Rise from your grave, necro-post! I have sought long and hard to find the oldest unlocked thread, and here thou art. Rise and heed your master, bring woe to all who read! Muahahahahahhahaha!
pyramidhead 420 Carbon 7 CRONOS. 292	Posted - 2014.01.27 05:43:00 - [26] - Quote Knox Firmus wrote: Rise, riiiise, RIIIIIISE! Rise from your grave, necro-post! I have sought long and hard to find the oldest unlocked thread, and here thou art. Rise and heed your master, bring woe to all who read! Muahahahahahhahaha! SINBOTO LIIIIIIIIIIIVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSS
Aszazel Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 18	Posted - 2014.01.27 05:50:00 - [27] - Quote Here what you do, gear up your heavy, give him a rail rifle or combat rifle, and ferroscale plates or reactive, maybe even a kinkats. Boom, then you are like 50% of the people playing, combine with a BPO LAV and your a one man wrecking crew as long as you have the skillz to back it up. HMG are slightly better now, RR and CR still own all. Its sorta sad. On the plus side, a heavy with a HMG will make my shotgunner pause before a CR/RR heavy would.
Princess Abi-Hime Pradox XVI Proficiency V. 1241	Posted - 2014.01.27 06:19:00 - [28] - Quote I thought this was a current thread until I read the name SoTa Pop. The Metalhead Mercenary
xSir Campsalotx G0DS AM0NG MEN 87	Posted - 2014.01.27 06:33:00 - [29] - Quote Broonfondle Majikthies wrote: My alt runs a basic heavy and HMG (ok, I caved, I didn't want any suit till Min Heavy was out but the militia is so cack) I tear people apart, even proto's. There is nothing wrong with them and I go solo. Just cus their heavy and have lots of health doesn't make them invulnerable - nor should they be. Use cover, close in on the target, get them from behind (yes its slow as hell but the reaction when you round that last corner and gun down 4 guys in a row is priceless) Maybe I'm too used to running around with an SMG and a scout suit but I use the same tactics for all my characters. What can I say, I hate stand up firefights. I like to outflank and win decisively. Not trying to call you out but any gun can win in a flank attack hell even a MD flux combo could win from behind. Yes pubs as a HMG user is good but in PCs you are usually limited to 1 or 2 spots on a map.
Vitharr Foebane Living Like Larry Schwag 546	Posted - 2014.01.27 07:38:00 - [30] - Quote thread necromancy is bad mm'kay Thanks CCP for making the HMG Heavy viable again :3 That's no excuse to slack off on releasing a heavy laser though =.=

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