DUST Search - No consistency

Vrain Matari wrote:

Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote:

After watching EVE FanFest 2012, DUST 514: Seeding The Universe presentation by CCP LeKjart, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNmCRti9dFM (some EVE "Kjartoons" inside), I was expecting the same what OP pointed is lacking. What changed since 2012? Have you abandoned that consistent universe vision?

Also i have noticed that planets types shown in DUST Star Map are not the same as in EVE Star Map. Same types look different too (ex. Gas). Check out Meves solar system in Everyshore region, Odilis constelation:
http://evemaps.dotlan.net/system/Meves/celestials
In DUST Meves I and Meves II both look like lava planet. In EVE Meves I is barren and Meves II is lava. Also DUST shows only one gas planet. In EVE there are two of that type (Meves V & Meves VI).

Is it still work in progress and tied with not all planet types available for battles in dust (so you'v decided to simulate variability of battlefield by randomizing battlefields for the time being)? Can we expect more consistency in the future?

I've noticed the same things regarding map/planet inconsistencies.

I need to watch 'Seeding the Universe' again, but my memory is that Kjartan did say at one point that the terrain would be procedurally generated for each individual planet based on that planet's characteristics. This generation was a one-time-only affair and after that initial generation the terrain would be fixed, but socket sets and outposts/installations could still be cycled.

I don't know if our current maps were procedurally generated or if the 'stickiness' problems and terrain glitches we've encountered are a result of that process.

I also haven't seen anyone from CCP state that they were giving up on the procedural generation of unique planetary terrains. I certainly hope not. That being said, it is a tough technical problem, and i would expect that several kicks at the can and a couple of years of steady work would be required before the process was running smoothly.

One of the things that has been bothering me about unique terrains is the amount of time that has been required to hand-tweak each map. Much love and respect to the tweakers, ofc, but as things stand it is flat-out impossible to commit the resources required to do all the terrestrial terrains, let alone all the other planet types(which will undoubtedly push the procedural terrain generation engine in different directions and thereby reveal different pathologies). I'm really curious to learn what CCP's approach will be here.

Best solution would be a pathology free terrain-generation engine. That's a big ask. Best bang-for-the-buck tool in a less than perfect world would be an in-match terrain glitch report button, with perhaps the ability to add a note for the devteam.

Anyway to end this over-long post with an over-long sentence, i feel unique planetary terrains is important for immersion, but also important on a much larger scale, in that if we want a New Eden that is 'real' and can be believed, this kind of fidelity is crucial to selling that story.


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 2 post(s)

CCP LogicLoop C C P C C P Alliance 1133	Posted - 2013.10.24 05:02:00 - [1] - Quote Sjem'Tolk wrote: Ok, so there are many Regions, Systems, Planets and Districts which is good, but I find bad is that you can go one a location and perform a fight on the map at that location and then go to that exact same location another time and it is a different map. Of course I can live with it, I'm just saying that this is only one of the things that I have noticed that bother me about the maps. I feel that (while there are several areas of the game that doesn't have consistency, or is being changed frequently) if there isn't consistency in the maps you can't count on anything with the game. In a PC match depending on who owns the area and what they put there it may or may not be consistent with what you saw before. In public matches though it will always be inconsistent as it is utilizing the cycling of different SI Sets and Component (socket) structures and moods to create variety. These worlds and areas are not to be confused with the idea of a CoD or Battlefield game where it is a set location all the time. We have various planets, regions, races, and Surface Infrastructures.


CCP LogicLoop C C P C C P Alliance 1136	Posted - 2013.10.25 00:23:00 - [2] - Quote Vrain Matari wrote: Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: After watching EVE FanFest 2012, DUST 514: Seeding The Universe presentation by CCP LeKjart, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNmCRti9dFM (some EVE "Kjartoons" inside), I was expecting the same what OP pointed is lacking. What changed since 2012? Have you abandoned that consistent universe vision? Also i have noticed that planets types shown in DUST Star Map are not the same as in EVE Star Map. Same types look different too (ex. Gas). Check out Meves solar system in Everyshore region, Odilis constelation: http://evemaps.dotlan.net/system/Meves/celestials In DUST Meves I and Meves II both look like lava planet. In EVE Meves I is barren and Meves II is lava. Also DUST shows only one gas planet. In EVE there are two of that type (Meves V & Meves VI). Is it still work in progress and tied with not all planet types available for battles in dust (so you'v decided to simulate variability of battlefield by randomizing battlefields for the time being)? Can we expect more consistency in the future? I've noticed the same things regarding map/planet inconsistencies. I need to watch 'Seeding the Universe' again, but my memory is that Kjartan did say at one point that the terrain would be procedurally generated for each individual planet based on that planet's characteristics. This generation was a one-time-only affair and after that initial generation the terrain would be fixed, but socket sets and outposts/installations could still be cycled. I don't know if our current maps were procedurally generated or if the 'stickiness' problems and terrain glitches we've encountered are a result of that process. I also haven't seen anyone from CCP state that they were giving up on the procedural generation of unique planetary terrains. I certainly hope not. That being said, it is a tough technical problem, and i would expect that several kicks at the can and a couple of years of steady work would be required before the process was running smoothly. One of the things that has been bothering me about unique terrains is the amount of time that has been required to hand-tweak each map. Much love and respect to the tweakers, ofc, but as things stand it is flat-out impossible to commit the resources required to do all the terrestrial terrains, let alone all the other planet types(which will undoubtedly push the procedural terrain generation engine in different directions and thereby reveal different pathologies). I'm really curious to learn what CCP's approach will be here. Best solution would be a pathology free terrain-generation engine. That's a big ask. Best bang-for-the-buck tool in a less than perfect world would be an in-match terrain glitch report button, with perhaps the ability to add a note for the devteam. Anyway to end this over-long post with an over-long sentence, i feel unique planetary terrains is important for immersion, but also important on a much larger scale, in that if we want a New Eden that is 'real' and can be believed, this kind of fidelity is crucial to selling that story. Technically they are procedurally generated through tools. As a LD works on a area we do have to hand modify and then have the artists retouch them. So the base terrain in its original form is a random generated space. It then has some modifications done for design purposes. They do at that point become static once shipped (excluding changes that may happen based on bugs).