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Joseph Ridgeson
WarRavens
League of Infamy
279
   |
Posted - 2013.10.21 17:02:00 -
[1] - Quote
First off, the Oculus Rift is amazing. It had me fan-girling so hard. But it has the same problem as the 3DS; it is impossible to show how effective it is without having the person try it. I can only imagine the marketing concerns. But this was a pointless side, so I shouldn't have done it.
Anyway, I am a primary tanker. I like Tanks, I have been one since about the first 6 weeks of playing the game, and it is the role that I have the most fun playing. The Devs set up 16 accounts with max skills and created setups that included all prototype items. The accounts originally didn't have any cash but over the course of the say each account had a couple million. I sat down and made my Madruggar and went about playing a couple games. Here is the thing: the accounts only had 'ground pounder' set ups and no Anti-Vehile aside from the Start AV.
The Tank was unkillable. 3 AV guys with Militia Swarms had no chance. I could pretty much sit there and just nom-nom all day. The 4th made it a little bit more difficult; I had to start playing competently without going full ham mode. This was pretty much what it was for a few games; I got to have some fun with my Tank against Militia Fits. Of course, the enemy did wise up.
One Heavy with the IAFG was able to kill me despite having 2 Active Hardeners online and my Repairer (max skills meant that I could fit Best in Slot Plates and Repairers) in pretty much 6 seconds. I couldn't escape fast enough to hide and recall the Tank; the one Forge Gunner blew me to Hell. This is the problem with Tanks, and it has been since Beta.
In Beta, you saw all these posts about Tanks being overpowered because they weren't hard to kill; they were impossible to kill. At the time, no one had proper skills in Anti-Vehicle Weaponry to be able to deal with Tanks. Militia and Standard Anti-Vehicle Weapons don't come close to being able to hurt a Tank. It is silly. Because of this, Tanks were hit in the PG department which basically meant that it was impossible (without max skills as I discovered) to put in an 180mm Plate and Heavy Repairer without a decently sized Powergrid Extender. In this character's case, it meant the BiS Armor Plate and the "uses less PG, heals less Health" Repairer with a 12% PG adder. That was a big hit to the survivability of Tanks. That was a big hit but what was even more dangerous was that everyone had maxed out their primary role and started to work on a secondary. This means IAFG became common.
Prototype AV weapons murder Tanks. Bad. With the PG nerf, IAFG's turn Tanks into Swiss cheese. If that nerf hadn't of happened, I could see it not being as bad. But that is the problem; Militia and Standard AV weapons, unless they are in huge bulk, have little or no chance of killing a Tanker that is worth his salt while an IAFG will kill a Tanker before they have a chance of really reacting. Tanks have a huge base and terrible scaling while AV weapons have a medium base and great scaling. Equation example:
Tanks = 6 + .2X
AV: = 2 + 1X
X = Skill Point Level.
So the starting newbies had no chance against the Tank (like it was in Beta) while the IAFG spanked me like a red headed stepchild. This is a huge problem in balance. It is unfair to the newbies that are flat out unable to do anything to me and it is unfair to me that "I buy more skill points and more money into my Role but yours kills me so easily" type of thing. I don't see how being reworked, even if the numbers are not what is going to go live, will change any of that.
Saberwing: remember the big fat guy that was all "fix tanks!" This is what I was talking about 
Be well. |
Joseph Ridgeson
WarRavens
League of Infamy
279
|
Posted - 2013.10.22 00:44:00 -
[2] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:I thought nothing could make me hate this game more than being a dropship pilot. Then I tried tanks. You don't understand how upset I am right now. 
All vehicles are sort of out paced by AV but I always felt that Dropships were far, far worse off. You really feel as if you are better off in a Dropship than a Tank? 
Can't say I agree with that one. |
Joseph Ridgeson
WarRavens
League of Infamy
283
|
Posted - 2013.10.22 16:19:00 -
[3] - Quote
Operative 1171 Aajli wrote:Right now one guy can sit on a hill and effectively dismiss a whole component of this game. Keep it off the field.
I just played my first match in a while (other than in Vegas) and I see what you mean. My Tank was on the field about 20 seconds before I started getting hit from AV that was doing some hefty damage. I parked it and managed to recall it. Was kinda surprised to see how fast I started to take damage.
Be well. |
Joseph Ridgeson
WarRavens
League of Infamy
286
|
Posted - 2013.10.22 18:57:00 -
[4] - Quote
Goric Rumis wrote:This is possibly the most rational post I've seen on AV/Tank balance. Ever.
Question: Does the tank's gradation factor in advanced and prototype hulls? If so, I would say the grading of AV and of vehicles both need some serious number crunching.
Previously, the Surya and Sagaris only got one additional High or Low. It was the one that would not help their defensive capability. Generally, the Armor Tank would put in some kind of utility active module while the Shield Tank was able to put in a Diagnostic unit to get more PG and Shield. If Prototype Tanks are based on the same design as before, nothing is going to change.
A few months ago, it was really popular to say "Obviously Proto AV is killing your Tanks so easily; you are Standard Tanks. It will be better when the Prototype Tanks are released." The problem with that statement is, as I said above, the previous Prototype Tanks didn't make you any tougher. |
Joseph Ridgeson
WarRavens
League of Infamy
286
|
Posted - 2013.10.22 19:21:00 -
[5] - Quote
Jakar Umbra wrote:If I remember correctly, one of the deciding factors of the PG nerf was the CCp's o wn fault with the CreoDron Breach HAV which had PG in excess of the Madrugar's with a Soma's slot layout. The result was people with maxed out PG skill had insane amounts of PG and could fit a tank with absolutely ridiculous amounts of health. So instead of just changing the PG on the HAV as they should have they used it as one of the reasons to nerf the PG skill.
Note the CreoDron Breach HAV was only obtainable through buying the armored pack. It was pay to win situation.
I don't quite agree with that. The PG Nerf didn't happen to the CreoDron for at least a week or two after the total nerf. It was a small nerf but it was mostly the removal of the 5% PG per level that hurt. I remember reading a Dev post along the lines of "Oops, we forgot to also lower the CreoDron's PG." |
Joseph Ridgeson
WarRavens
League of Infamy
287
|
Posted - 2013.10.22 21:47:00 -
[6] - Quote
LLAV's are probably the hardest to kill vehicles considering their great speed and strong resistances. |
Joseph Ridgeson
WarRavens
League of Infamy
287
|
Posted - 2013.10.22 22:55:00 -
[7] - Quote
No, it was live.
In fact, my dad damn near gave one of the Devs running the DUST games a heart attack. Allow me to paint a story:
I walk over to see no one sitting down at the DUST station other than him. "You are just playing a Skirmish on your own?"
"No. They locked out normal instant battles... but not Factional Warfare." Dad didn't really do much in the game other than look around and giggle but the look on the Dev as he heard "No, this is FW" alone was worth the drive out there.
Anyhoo, if I remember my set-up correctly, it was 6.7k-ish Armor and dual Hardeners. So 25 + (25 * .8691) = 46.7275% resistance plus maxed skill that gives Resistance (however that stacks). So it is actually a higher resistance that 40% DR and had the added benefit of having a Repairer that healed a lot more in bursts.
Be well. |
Joseph Ridgeson
WarRavens
League of Infamy
288
|
Posted - 2013.10.23 14:21:00 -
[8] - Quote
Does anyone know why exactly the change is happening? I don't see how this change is anything other than "Tanks are going to get weaker." |
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