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Jax Schwarzstern
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2013.10.11 20:45:00 -
[1] - Quote
When it is suggested (in different guides) that you level up modules with your suit does that mean in my case I went Gallente for scout... that I should go light frame lvl 2 then build up shield extenders to lvl 2 then uplink lvl 2 explosives lvl 2 etc... I know it is referenced in many guides I am just looking for clarification..
TL:DR I am going Gallente scout and I made the mistake that everyone was warning me about going right for scout and not staying at Light Frame longer to build up other skills etc. Deed is done, I am in my pretty scout suit and looking to move on from there...
I am going with a SMG build.. And I want to play with remote explosives also...
But the concept I want more clarification on is how to build a rounded out skill set...
In some of the guides it says to lvl all modules before moving onto advanced...
so if i am going explosives, uplinks etc.
so do everything to lvl 2 before I move onto lvl 3 in the skills?
because I have heard adv items cost less in isk and cpu to fit...then miltia but at the same time if you put adv gear on a std suit you really aren't doing yourself any favors...
so i get scout drop suit to lvl 1 then all my modules should be lvl 1 at least the ones I am using shield extenders/eletronics/expolsives... then once I get to lvl 5 in what I really need for this suit branch out into other builds...
or since I kinda jumped the gun and got to scout first... Should I wait to get all my modules to lvl 3 before I move on to light lvl 4 before scout lvl 2 or now that I am in scouts lvl my modules to my lvl of scout or should I back down to light suits?
Thanks for any insight.
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Koric McLangous
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar
DARKSTAR ARMY
2
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Posted - 2013.10.11 22:01:00 -
[2] - Quote
This really is a personal preference as far as what direction you go leveling your stuff other than the general rule:
Trying to fit advanced mods onto a militia build is difficult and it is almost impossible to do it with proto mods.
Having said that you want to run a SMG Scout then you should skill into your areas to level 1 on most so that you have at least access to various abilities, (Prox mines and Uplinks.) Then you want to level 3 into your suit but only the basic suit without the bonuses. This will give a taste of what it will be like if you want to progress into the Race specific. But a basic advanced suit will have some slots and a descent PG and CPU. Please bear in mind that you will want to get to level 5 shield extenders because this is when all those skills pay off with 66 pts to shield plus the skill's modifier. You also have to look into putting points into your core skills. Everything is from the PG and CPU. The more of this you have the more you really can do.
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IgniteableAura
Pro Hic Immortalis
265
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Posted - 2013.10.30 19:49:00 -
[3] - Quote
I think you did fine going straight into the scout bonus suits. Its really the only way to play a light frame suit. They are also less expensive than the regular variety suits. So it will save you some isk. I would skill into adv and then start working on putting sp into your various dropsuit upgrade skills (pg/cpu) and getting to basic weapon of choice. (shotgun/smg/ar etc)
Basic fitting for scouts revolves around what you want as a play style. Scouts don't have much the ability to add a lot of tank (hp) to their fittings.
Most usual builds on my adv winmitar scout suit is (gal adv scout also has 2/2 slot fitting)
2x complex shields
1 std AR
1 std SMG
1 basic plate
1 kincat or cardiac reg
1 compact nanohive
This is a basic place to start, but I would stick with militia biotics as they are a large SP investment. You can throw on 2 basic plates for more health, but you end up being slower and don't have reps beside your compact nanohive.
This is all personal opinion, but this thread is a great place for advice on scouts and is a wonderful resource for all scout brothers.
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=90055&find=unread
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CharCharOdell
1427
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Posted - 2013.10.31 05:49:00 -
[4] - Quote
Check out these guys: R 0 N 1 N
They're a scout training corp.
Btw, I gave you your first like. You're welcome.
Gùñ-é-º+¼+ò+¦GÖÑ+ú+ú+¡ GÖÑ'Ðe+ü+üGùÑ
Gùú -ä>-üð+++Ç++§<-¡<-¡ Gùó
Speaker of the Mangrove / King of QQ / Co-Founder of the Learning Coalition
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Rogatien Merc
Red Star.
EoN.
1570
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Posted - 2013.10.31 18:51:00 -
[5] - Quote
To answer your question more generally, the answer is an adamant "NO". The way the system is designed you have to understand the balance between "Min/maxing" and "Diminishing returns".
The most effective fits are those fits that can reflect / be affected by as much SP as possible at one time. You are literally putting more power on the battlefield that way. So if you're in a STD scout suit running a shotgun, a shield extender, an armor rep, and a kin cat, then the entire time you are in that suit, all of the SP you have invested into kincats, card regs, armor plates, damage mods, ARs, sniper rifles, etc.... is completely and utterly wasted, at that moment. If your SP is divided among a ton of different things then it drops the average "applied SP" that you have on any given suit. It's just the nature of the beast.
That's the basis of why min/maxing is effective (in any game really).
Now on the diminishing returns side let's look at hacking. To get from III to IV in the hacking skill costs something like 435,000 skill points. This is an incredible amount of SP when you're starting out for what you get. What do you get? You get to shave off a fraction of a second of the hack speed when you are hacking things. Now think, in a match, how often are you literally standing with your finger on the O button hacking? THAT is the only time that this SP 'power' is "applied". So if you have 30mil SP this might be worth it because you realize "well, pretty much ANYthing I get is really expensive at this point, they are all incremental benefits, and that fraction of a second can make the difference between winning and losing a match. Completely true. But at a lower level where you DON'T already have a ton of things trained, that 435,000 SP can grant you a greater amount of 'utility' elsewhere. You can train level I into several core skills that unlock different modules for many different fits (armor plates, flaylock pistols, whatever) or fitting skills very cheaply. Or you can use that SP to bump up things that affect your suit in other ways. But it's important to think about what is having an impact any given moment of battle or any critical moment of battle and what can have the greatest impact across your gameplay experience.
The key to diminishing returns is understanding the concept that being able to have multiple fits and the 'utility' to play the right "role" on the battlefield is often just as or more important than the ability to be really good the wrong role for the situation (i.e. a point is getting over run with infantry and the best AV guy in the game is stuck in a swarm suit... well... it doesn't matter if he's the best AV guy in the game at that point. He needed to be in an infantry fit).
[Sidebar: Lone wolfs have to have more utility because they have to be able to adapt; people in squads with others have the freedom to min/max more because 'we have a guy for that' and they can adapt as a team instead of individuals... this is one reason pubstompers are so effective in squads.]
Someone listed a fit with shield extenders. It's an instance where it is very worthwhile to unlock proto very early for several reasons. For instance, they have a progression of 22hp STD / 33hp ADV / 66hp PRO. Getting it to advanced is worthless - you might as well use militia, but getting it to proto is pretty much a requirement for a lot of suits because the marginal utility of more HP comes into play every time you get down to low health and is critical because it is the determining "you live or you die" factor. Directly relevant to your original question, the benefit from the skill is 2% HP bonus per level, which is miniscule. This means that if you level it to II and then go level something else to II, then something else to II... well, the SP in the skill is having very little impact on any suit's "applied SP quotient" (made up term). Same at level III and IV. Wasted SP until you get it to V. So either commit to getting it all the way to V, or put the SP into something that has more of an impact at that time.
^--- overly complicated, but I hope it helps understand the logic behind the answer to your original question.
"Victory is reserved for those who are willing to pay it's price."
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Rogatien Merc
Red Star.
EoN.
1570
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Posted - 2013.10.31 19:05:00 -
[6] - Quote
Also
- scout suits are cheaper than light suits + bonuses. you should never run a basic light suit again.
- it is more cost effective to increase the meta level of the modules than of the suit. the only benefit you get going STD -> ADV -> PRO on any suit is slot counts. slots are filled with modules. So again with the shield extender example... 1x complex shield extender on a STD scout gives more benefit than 2x STD shield extenders... and is cheaper.
"Victory is reserved for those who are willing to pay it's price."
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