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CharCharOdell
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
1073
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Posted - 2013.10.06 18:22:00 -
[1] - Quote
Some modules have stacking penalties (hardeners, damage mods, pg/cpu upgrades); others do not (plates, extenders, etc) However, if one does (it says in the description), then it is subject to stacking penalties to balance them (because, honestly, who wants a sniper that hits with 560 on the body or a railgun that does 2920 damage...or perhaps a massdriver that hits with 210- SPLASH damage
So to balance stuff, CCP made this fun little formula:
S(n) = 0.5^[((n-1) / 2.22292081) ^2] S = modifier of the module; ie, complex damage mod adds 10% damage so you write "S" as 10 n = this is the nth module you have added of this type (enhanced and complex, etc---theyre all counted as damage mods). Okay, so ill stack 2 complex damage mods and 1 basic damage mod 10(1) = 0.5^[((1-1) / 2.22292081) ^2] = 10.00% 10(2) = 0.5^[((2-1) / 2.22292081) ^2] = 8.69% 3(3) = 0.5^[((3-1) / 2.22292081) ^2] = 1.71% Cumulative bonus = 21.61%
Basically, unless your DPS is well over a thousand, that third module isn't gonna do a lot.
If you hate doing math, the other way to go about it is this: 100% module effectiveness (S*1) 86.9%, (S*0.890) 57.1%, (S*0.571) 28.3%, (S*0.283 10.6%, (S*0.106)
Total bonus: 31.34%.....versus the 100% you wanted. So if you thought u could stack 5 complex damage mods and get a 50% damage buff, getting less than a third of that. Hahahaha. Yay MATH! :D |
Patrick57
GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention
465
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Posted - 2013.10.07 00:56:00 -
[2] - Quote
I. HATE. MATH. |
CharCharOdell
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
1078
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Posted - 2013.10.07 01:21:00 -
[3] - Quote
Patrick57 wrote:I. HATE. MATH.
do u like money? the best tankers at the beginning of 1.6 are gonna be the ones who did the math. Combat in New Eden is 2 spreadsheets fighting with each other. |
MINA Longstrike
One Shot Killahz
7
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Posted - 2013.10.07 11:24:00 -
[4] - Quote
CharCharOdell wrote:Patrick57 wrote:I. HATE. MATH. do u like money? the best tankers at the beginning of 1.6 are gonna be the ones who did the math. Combat in New Eden is 2 spreadsheets fighting with each other.
They say that, but there's quite a bit more that goes into it. Target selection (can you catch it? can you fight it? Can you kill it quickly?), awareness as to whether or not your prospective target will have friends around, snap decisions on changing battle conditions etc.
Spreadsheets IN SPAAAAAACE is for pve, PvP has a *lot* more going on a lot of levels in eve. |
Wey Yu
Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2013.10.07 11:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
The third damage mod is pointless and the now defunct third slot should be use more wisely. |
Tebu Gan
CrimeWave Syndicate
135
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Posted - 2013.10.07 18:51:00 -
[6] - Quote
CharCharOdell wrote:Some modules have stacking penalties (hardeners, damage mods, pg/cpu upgrades); others do not (plates, extenders, etc) However, if one does (it says in the description), then it is subject to stacking penalties to balance them (because, honestly, who wants a sniper that hits with 560 on the body or a railgun that does 2920 damage...or perhaps a massdriver that hits with 210- SPLASH damage
So to balance stuff, CCP made this fun little formula:
S(n) = 0.5^[((n-1) / 2.22292081) ^2] S = modifier of the module; ie, complex damage mod adds 10% damage so you write "S" as 10 n = this is the nth module you have added of this type (enhanced and complex, etc---theyre all counted as damage mods). Okay, so ill stack 2 complex damage mods and 1 basic damage mod 10(1) = 0.5^[((1-1) / 2.22292081) ^2] = 10.00% 10(2) = 0.5^[((2-1) / 2.22292081) ^2] = 8.69% 3(3) = 0.5^[((3-1) / 2.22292081) ^2] = 1.71% Cumulative bonus = 21.61%
Basically, unless your DPS is well over a thousand, that third module isn't gonna do a lot.
If you hate doing math, the other way to go about it is this: 100% module effectiveness (S*1) 86.9%, (S*0.890) 57.1%, (S*0.571) 28.3%, (S*0.283 10.6%, (S*0.106)
Total bonus: 31.34%.....versus the 100% you wanted. So if you thought u could stack 5 complex damage mods and get a 50% damage buff, getting less than a third of that. Hahahaha. Yay MATH! :D
So if you want to find out how much your modified weapon does, use this forumla L = proficiency with the weapon you are doing this calculation for (mass driver proff lvl 5, etc) p = modifier value of the proficiency (0.03 if the dmg increases by 3%/lvl) D = DMG (the base damage of your weapon) S = Module modifer (10 = complex damage mod = +10%) n = module number (1st, 2nd, 3rd) R = resulting damage (what your weapon does with skills and mods in effect
R=D(1+(Lp+(0.01(Sn)))) 150=120*(1+(5*(0.03))+(0.01*(10*(1)))) (A Freedom Mass Driver with MD proff lvl5 and 1 complex damage mod)
Hope this was helpful! Bye now!
Thank you, this makes it much clearer on how the formula works.
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CharCharOdell
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
1084
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Posted - 2013.10.07 18:52:00 -
[7] - Quote
Relying on our skill as a shooter can only take u so far. When u meet someone just as good as.you, whoever did the math will win. That is what makes dust so interesting. |
Musta Tornius
Cannonfodder PMC
629
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Posted - 2013.10.09 16:15:00 -
[8] - Quote
Just a minor typo: '86.9%, (S*0.890)' should be 0.869 otherwise thanks for going over this. Always useful for ppl to know about stacking penalties. |
hydraSlav's
Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation
289
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Posted - 2013.10.09 17:12:00 -
[9] - Quote
Good write up. Just one minor thing to note: the stacking is per attribute, not per module per se.
And if an attribute is known to be "stacking penalized", chances are other modules affecting the same attribute will also be stacking penalized (even if the module description does not explicitly mention it). I talk about it here in #247
hydraSlav's wrote:Other notes: An interesting observation regarding Shield Energizer mods. Shield Recharge Rate attribute (previously available on Shield Rechargers) is a stacking penalized attribute. Shield Energizer module description does not mention stacking penalty on the module. However the Shield Recharge Rate of Shield Energizer module is stacking penalized, yet the Shield Penalty is not stacking penalized. This has been verified in-game.
Also, not just bonuses are stacking penalized. Module penalties are also stacking penalized, if the attribute is generally stacking penalized. More about it in #76
Lastly, something completely obscure that no one cares about: sprint bonus and movement penalty, although affecting the same characteristic (speed) are actually different attributes, and stack separately (also discussed in #76 above)
Patrick57 wrote:I. HATE. MATH. For you, my friend there is Dust Fitting Tool. All the math is done, just numbers. If you hate numbers too, sorry you are in the wrong game |
Frank Olson Usul
DUST University Ivy League
35
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Posted - 2013.10.27 19:31:00 -
[10] - Quote
I suck at math (at least this complicated).
Could you tell me how big the running bonus is for 2 or 3 complex kinetic catalyzers? |
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CharCharOdell
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
1309
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Posted - 2013.10.27 20:24:00 -
[11] - Quote
Frank Olson Usul wrote:I suck at math (at least this complicated).
Could you tell me how big the running bonus is for 2 or 3 complex kinetic catalyzers?
10%+8.7%=18.8% damage bonus for 2 complex mods. |
Flix Keptick
Red Star. EoN.
1010
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Posted - 2013.10.30 04:08:00 -
[12] - Quote
CharCharOdell wrote:Patrick57 wrote:I. HATE. MATH. do u like money? the best tankers at the beginning of 1.6 are gonna be the ones who did the math. Combat in New Eden is 2 spreadsheets fighting with each other. heh, I already did
Please don't
GÿåForum warrior lvl.1Gÿå
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