DUST Search - Dropsuit racial symmetry in 1.6?

Daxxis KANNAH wrote:

Vell0cet wrote:

Daxxis KANNAH wrote:

Vell0cet wrote:

Nguruthos IX wrote:

Agree though, suits seems reasonable to cram in before vehicles.

Although again, perhaps they're scared to waste an influx of players on a generally otherwise insufficient game-state?

I'd be very surprised if CCP was deliberately holding stuff back like that. The racial suits may have been scheduled to be released after the vehicle changes on the original roadmap. Given the recent setbacks however, it makes a lot of sense for CCP to reevaluate that roadmap and get new suits out sooner to buy some time for the team to resolve whatever "integration issues" they may be having.

What is your reasoning that suits could be deployed if weapons cant be?

The rumoured weapons are slight variations of existing weapons - same as suits

Well CCP stated they are being held back due to "integration issues" which I assumed to mean they've made code changes/refractors that have caused significant issues (possibly performance related--just a guess) that will take time to sort out. Suits really shouldn't require tweaking the code to implement, they're essentially skins of existing mechanics with different stats.

Which I have been arguing the other racial weapons are as well.

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Vell0cet Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 366	Posted - 2013.10.02 07:02:00 - [1] - Quote Given the announcement that vehicles and weapons won't be here in 1.6 I think adding the missing racial heavy and light suits should be a priority. I get that CCP hit a major snag with integrating the vehicle and weapon changes, and as a programmer I understand these issues can potentially be very nasty to fix and take a lot more time then might be originally estimated. It sucks, but it's part of development, and refactoring code can be very difficult. Dropsuits however should be fairly easy to add if the art assets are finished. There shouldn't be major coding changes, related to get them in the game. I'm not asking for new roles that may create new balancing challenges, but adding new suits will finally let players to start investing SP into the racial variant of the suit they want. There may be some balancing tweaks that need to be made once the suits hit the servers, but those should be hotfixable (tweaking stats in the database and not code changes). I think releasing the missing racial variants of existing suit roles would go a long way towards softening the blow of the delayed vehicle changes and weapon additions.
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2492	Posted - 2013.10.02 07:03:00 - [2] - Quote Why shouldn't racial tanks, DS, and LAV be deployed as well?
richiesutie 2 The Rainbow Effect 327	Posted - 2013.10.02 07:05:00 - [3] - Quote Lol like ccp gives **** about dropships They nerffed teamwork for Christ sake.
Nguruthos IX PEN 15 CLUB 1928	Posted - 2013.10.02 07:06:00 - [4] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Why shouldn't racial tanks be deployed as well? Presumably, if the art was done, they might be able to along with the vehicle update but there'd be no point to do it before that. As then they'd be releasing tanks that work one way, balanced towards that and then change them 2 months later. However CCP stated that the art team is Not the hold up on new content such as suits and vehicles. So, I really don't know what that means. Is it all already done?
Vell0cet Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 366	Posted - 2013.10.02 07:07:00 - [5] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Why shouldn't racial tanks be deployed as well? They may not be ready. If they are, then I think we would all love to see them. Based on the fanfest slide, the Amarr vehicles looked more like concept art than finished models. They may also be more complicated to model than suits (suits all share the same animations).
Nguruthos IX PEN 15 CLUB 1928	Posted - 2013.10.02 07:07:00 - [6] - Quote richiesutie 2 wrote: Lol like ccp gives **** about dropships They nerffed teamwork for Christ sake. DUDE they nerfed PASSENGERS> passengers! passengers can no longer look around freely while in a dropship. Like. Whaaa... why???
richiesutie 2 The Rainbow Effect 327	Posted - 2013.10.02 07:08:00 - [7] - Quote Nguruthos IX wrote: richiesutie 2 wrote: Lol like ccp gives **** about dropships They nerffed teamwork for Christ sake. DUDE they nerfed PASSENGERS> passengers! passengers can no longer look around freely while in a dropship. Like. Whaaa... why??? You've never heard about the dropship mega nerf?
Nguruthos IX PEN 15 CLUB 1928	Posted - 2013.10.02 07:08:00 - [8] - Quote Agree though, suits seems reasonable to cram in before vehicles. Although again, perhaps they're scared to waste an influx of players on a generally otherwise insufficient game-state?
Nguruthos IX PEN 15 CLUB 1930	Posted - 2013.10.02 07:09:00 - [9] - Quote richiesutie 2 wrote: Nguruthos IX wrote: richiesutie 2 wrote: Lol like ccp gives **** about dropships They nerffed teamwork for Christ sake. DUDE they nerfed PASSENGERS> passengers! passengers can no longer look around freely while in a dropship. Like. Whaaa... why??? You've never heard about the dropship mega nerf? oh idk
IamI3rian OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 336	Posted - 2013.10.02 07:12:00 - [10] - Quote Influxes are OP, and need to be nerfed. --- Remember: IamI3rian told ya Wish I could play Skyrim again for the first time. -AflockOfHippies

True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2497	Posted - 2013.10.02 07:17:00 - [11] - Quote Nguruthos IX wrote: Agree though, suits seems reasonable to cram in before vehicles. Although again, perhaps they're scared to waste an influx of players on a generally otherwise insufficient game-state? Yup so holding back content because CCP is scared the influx will join a flawed game, flawed not only by the some lack adequate gameplay features, but mostly flawed by the lack of content they so ardently hold back.
richiesutie 2 The Rainbow Effect 328	Posted - 2013.10.02 07:23:00 - [12] - Quote Nguruthos IX wrote: richiesutie 2 wrote: Nguruthos IX wrote: richiesutie 2 wrote: Lol like ccp gives **** about dropships They nerffed teamwork for Christ sake. DUDE they nerfed PASSENGERS> passengers! passengers can no longer look around freely while in a dropship. Like. Whaaa... why??? You've never heard about the dropship mega nerf? oh idk once gunner could go 40/0 regularly or you could park your ds somewhere and just camp in the gunner seat.
Vell0cet Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 368	Posted - 2013.10.02 07:26:00 - [13] - Quote Nguruthos IX wrote: Agree though, suits seems reasonable to cram in before vehicles. Although again, perhaps they're scared to waste an influx of players on a generally otherwise insufficient game-state? I'd be very surprised if CCP was deliberately holding stuff back like that. The racial suits may have been scheduled to be released after the vehicle changes on the original roadmap. Given the recent setbacks however, it makes a lot of sense for CCP to reevaluate that roadmap and get new suits out sooner to buy some time for the team to resolve whatever "integration issues" they may be having.
Vell0cet Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 372	Posted - 2013.10.02 14:09:00 - [14] - Quote .
Daxxis KANNAH Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 383	Posted - 2013.10.02 15:33:00 - [15] - Quote Vell0cet wrote: Nguruthos IX wrote: Agree though, suits seems reasonable to cram in before vehicles. Although again, perhaps they're scared to waste an influx of players on a generally otherwise insufficient game-state? I'd be very surprised if CCP was deliberately holding stuff back like that. The racial suits may have been scheduled to be released after the vehicle changes on the original roadmap. Given the recent setbacks however, it makes a lot of sense for CCP to reevaluate that roadmap and get new suits out sooner to buy some time for the team to resolve whatever "integration issues" they may be having. What is your reasoning that suits could be deployed if weapons cant be? The rumoured weapons are slight variations of existing weapons - same as suits
Vell0cet Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 378	Posted - 2013.10.02 15:40:00 - [16] - Quote Daxxis KANNAH wrote: Vell0cet wrote: Nguruthos IX wrote: Agree though, suits seems reasonable to cram in before vehicles. Although again, perhaps they're scared to waste an influx of players on a generally otherwise insufficient game-state? I'd be very surprised if CCP was deliberately holding stuff back like that. The racial suits may have been scheduled to be released after the vehicle changes on the original roadmap. Given the recent setbacks however, it makes a lot of sense for CCP to reevaluate that roadmap and get new suits out sooner to buy some time for the team to resolve whatever "integration issues" they may be having. What is your reasoning that suits could be deployed if weapons cant be? The rumoured weapons are slight variations of existing weapons - same as suits Well CCP stated they are being held back due to "integration issues" which I assumed to mean they've made code changes/refractors that have caused significant issues (possibly performance related--just a guess) that will take time to sort out. Suits really shouldn't require tweaking the code to implement, they're essentially skins of existing mechanics with different stats.
Daxxis KANNAH Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 383	Posted - 2013.10.02 15:46:00 - [17] - Quote Vell0cet wrote: Daxxis KANNAH wrote: Vell0cet wrote: Nguruthos IX wrote: Agree though, suits seems reasonable to cram in before vehicles. Although again, perhaps they're scared to waste an influx of players on a generally otherwise insufficient game-state? I'd be very surprised if CCP was deliberately holding stuff back like that. The racial suits may have been scheduled to be released after the vehicle changes on the original roadmap. Given the recent setbacks however, it makes a lot of sense for CCP to reevaluate that roadmap and get new suits out sooner to buy some time for the team to resolve whatever "integration issues" they may be having. What is your reasoning that suits could be deployed if weapons cant be? The rumoured weapons are slight variations of existing weapons - same as suits Well CCP stated they are being held back due to "integration issues" which I assumed to mean they've made code changes/refractors that have caused significant issues (possibly performance related--just a guess) that will take time to sort out. Suits really shouldn't require tweaking the code to implement, they're essentially skins of existing mechanics with different stats. Which I have been arguing the other racial weapons are as well.
Vell0cet Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 380	Posted - 2013.10.02 15:54:00 - [18] - Quote Daxxis KANNAH wrote: Vell0cet wrote: Daxxis KANNAH wrote: Vell0cet wrote: Nguruthos IX wrote: Agree though, suits seems reasonable to cram in before vehicles. Although again, perhaps they're scared to waste an influx of players on a generally otherwise insufficient game-state? I'd be very surprised if CCP was deliberately holding stuff back like that. The racial suits may have been scheduled to be released after the vehicle changes on the original roadmap. Given the recent setbacks however, it makes a lot of sense for CCP to reevaluate that roadmap and get new suits out sooner to buy some time for the team to resolve whatever "integration issues" they may be having. What is your reasoning that suits could be deployed if weapons cant be? The rumoured weapons are slight variations of existing weapons - same as suits Well CCP stated they are being held back due to "integration issues" which I assumed to mean they've made code changes/refractors that have caused significant issues (possibly performance related--just a guess) that will take time to sort out. Suits really shouldn't require tweaking the code to implement, they're essentially skins of existing mechanics with different stats. Which I have been arguing the other racial weapons are as well. You could be right, but then I don't see why CCP would be having "integration issues" that are taking months to fix if it was so simple to add them. Weapons are inherently more complicated than suits and could have issues related to the code. The length of the delays seem to point in this direction IMO.
Chunky Munkey Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 1658	Posted - 2013.10.02 16:05:00 - [19] - Quote If they don't have the time to fit major updates into a patch, why would you think other major updates should be in tuere instead?
Vell0cet Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 384	Posted - 2013.10.02 17:36:00 - [20] - Quote Chunky Munkey wrote: If they don't have the time to fit major updates into a patch, why would you think other major updates should be in tuere instead? Because suits don't involve coding in the same way weapons and vehicle changes do. If the art exists (and I think this has been confirmed) then adding suits is primarily an exercise in deciding on slots and bonuses.

Daxxis KANNAH Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 384	Posted - 2013.10.02 18:24:00 - [21] - Quote Vell0cet wrote: Chunky Munkey wrote: If they don't have the time to fit major updates into a patch, why would you think other major updates should be in tuere instead? Because suits don't involve coding in the same way weapons and vehicle changes do. If the art exists (and I think this has been confirmed) then adding suits is primarily an exercise in deciding on slots and bonuses. Curiously there was also chatter about art not being the bottleneck after people were discussing why it was taking so long to produce the assets. I think something really strange is going on and whomever left the project either didnt document well enough or the transition is just taking really long for content delivery to continue. Stuff they thought they could do just inst coming in well. Many of these things (that we are asking for as basic core content) dont seem that hard to implement but it sure isnt turning up in game.
Rogatien Merc Red Star. EoN. 1334	Posted - 2013.10.02 18:28:00 - [22] - Quote Vell0cet wrote: Dropsuits however should be fairly easy to add if the art assets are finished... Oh you poor fool. You glorious, wonderful, naive fool. Oh how your heart is about to be broken...
Vell0cet Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 386	Posted - 2013.10.02 18:36:00 - [23] - Quote Daxxis KANNAH wrote: Vell0cet wrote: Chunky Munkey wrote: If they don't have the time to fit major updates into a patch, why would you think other major updates should be in tuere instead? Because suits don't involve coding in the same way weapons and vehicle changes do. If the art exists (and I think this has been confirmed) then adding suits is primarily an exercise in deciding on slots and bonuses. Curiously there was also chatter about art not being the bottleneck after people were discussing why it was taking so long to produce the assets. I think something really strange is going on and whomever left the project either didnt document well enough or the transition is just taking really long for content delivery to continue. Stuff they thought they could do just inst coming in well. Many of these things (that we are asking for as basic core content) dont seem that hard to implement but it sure isnt turning up in game. I agree that something is seriously wrong in Shanghai.
Ryder Azorria Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 622	Posted - 2013.10.02 18:37:00 - [24] - Quote Vell0cet wrote: Daxxis KANNAH wrote: Vell0cet wrote: Nguruthos IX wrote: Agree though, suits seems reasonable to cram in before vehicles. Although again, perhaps they're scared to waste an influx of players on a generally otherwise insufficient game-state? I'd be very surprised if CCP was deliberately holding stuff back like that. The racial suits may have been scheduled to be released after the vehicle changes on the original roadmap. Given the recent setbacks however, it makes a lot of sense for CCP to reevaluate that roadmap and get new suits out sooner to buy some time for the team to resolve whatever "integration issues" they may be having. What is your reasoning that suits could be deployed if weapons cant be? The rumoured weapons are slight variations of existing weapons - same as suits Well CCP stated they are being held back due to "integration issues" which I assumed to mean they've made code changes/refractors that have caused significant issues (possibly performance related--just a guess) that will take time to sort out. Suits really shouldn't require tweaking the code to implement, they're essentially skins of existing mechanics with different stats. One would expect the same to be said of the weapon and vehicle changes.
Kigurosaka Laaksonen DUST University Ivy League 22	Posted - 2013.10.04 16:06:00 - [25] - Quote Just read through the OP to add my 2 cents to yet another post that... CCP NEEDS to work on getting BASIC CONTENT out AS SOON AS POSSIBLE! The longer we go without the complete [Race] [Class] pattern for dropsuits and vehicles, the more, and larger, problems it will cause.
Toby Flenderson research lab The Superpowers 68	Posted - 2013.10.04 16:10:00 - [26] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Why shouldn't racial tanks, DS, and LAV be deployed as well? Reread the post if you think the OP is favoring dropsuits over vehicles.
Vell0cet Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 404	Posted - 2013.10.04 16:56:00 - [27] - Quote Toby Flenderson wrote: True Adamance wrote: Why shouldn't racial tanks, DS, and LAV be deployed as well? Reread the post if you think the OP is favoring dropsuits over vehicles. I'd love to see vehicles too of course. I just think suits may be easier to implement. At this point, just releasing SOMETHING to help bring more racial symmetry would be worthwhile. I'm under the impression that suits would be the easiest/fastest form of significant content to push out the door (assuming the art assets exist), and would buy CCP a little time/goodwill to continue to sort out the vehicle rebalance clusterf*ck. If vehicle racial symmetry is closer and easier to get done, then they should do that, but based on recent statements by CCP that really doesn't seem likely. I just think that if vehicles have been a bigger problem than they anticipated, then perhaps CCP should reprioritize the roadmap a bit and focus on things they can release more easily with less coding.


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