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[REQUEST] Stop Turrets Firing When Unmanned, Remove Redline Turrets

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Andra Syra Science For Death The Shadow Eclipse 2	Posted - 2013.09.28 19:17:00 - [1] - Quote Of the many problems I encounter as a tanker and a dropship pilot, none frustrate me more than the turret. A significant amount of HP (or in a dropship, the entirety of it) can quickly be stripped by a weapon that requires no investment, and often no active involvement of other players. In some maps you don't even need to redline to cover the majority of the map with a rail-gun turret that will allow you to deny the enemy dropships, harass tankers and soak up warpoints by destroying other turrets. Destroying them is relatively easy, of course, assuming you can actually see them without encountering the rendering glitch after traversing an entire map. So you learn the turret positions, but AV is already pretty heavy so you don't want to take your tank out into the open to destroy a the turret. So you have somebody with AV to stop fighting the enemy to destroy a single turret. Have fun describing where the turret that isn't rendering is! Oh, and there wasn't even anybody in the turret. For some reason it had decided to aggress you despite not engaging or even being able to see it. Surprise! Sigh. The truth is at best turrets are free war-points for tankers and at worst a needless, automated, invisible threat to the already poorly balanced vehicles that hide behind the redline. Please change it so turrets only fire when manned, and remove the ones in the redline. This will solve their greatest problems without, quiet simply, removing them entirely (I'd be perfectly happy with you doing that as well).
zibathy numbertwo Nox Aeterna Security 163	Posted - 2013.09.28 19:27:00 - [2] - Quote I'm tired of getting killed instantly as a scout because an unmanned blaster turret killed me while I was fighting someone :( Also railgun turrets constantly shoot me out of my LAVs magically. I'm sorry, but getting instantly killed inside of a moving vehicle by AI, even if it's ridiculously easy to hit me (it's not in a railgun), is really just not acceptable. Imagine if I actually ran proto in pubs. I would lose 150k isk for no reason. It's just a pain and really an embarrassment :( I'd rather be killed a hundred times by a player any day than once by a damn AI.
Andra Syra Science For Death The Shadow Eclipse 3	Posted - 2013.09.28 19:38:00 - [3] - Quote zibathy numbertwo wrote: I'm tired of getting killed instantly as a scout because an unmanned blaster turret killed me while I was fighting someone :( Also railgun turrets constantly shoot me out of my LAVs magically. I'm sorry, but getting instantly killed inside of a moving vehicle by AI, even if it's ridiculously easy to hit me (it's not in a railgun), is really just not acceptable. Imagine if I actually ran proto in pubs. I would lose 150k isk for no reason. It's just a pain and really an embarrassment :( I'd rather be killed a hundred times by a player any day than once by a damn AI. Oh damn! I completely forgot about what it's like to run scout against these turrets (I abandoned scouts with the recent aim assist changes, unfortunately). The frustration is boiling back up already. Yet another reason to buff scouts and nerf turrets into the ground to be quiet honest. My "favourite" used to be getting shot out of LAVs from turrets behind me. =(
Steppin' Blade Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 1	Posted - 2013.09.28 21:56:00 - [4] - Quote +1 - I hate turrets, anything that mitigates them is worth doing in my book.
Andra Syra Science For Death The Shadow Eclipse 8	Posted - 2013.09.28 23:19:00 - [5] - Quote Anybody else have any input on installations?
Robert JD Niewiadomski NULLIMPEX INC 577	Posted - 2013.09.28 23:26:00 - [6] - Quote Steppin' Blade wrote: +1 - I hate turrets, anything that mitigates them is worth doing in my book. a strange voice in Blade's head said Use a swarm launcher Blade, use a swarm... Unmanned turrets are manned by very advanced and sophisticated AI algorithm CCP spent couple of manmonths. And you want to just frow it away? Can't you just pretend you do some PvE? I can With an advanced swarm launcher. 4-6 hits should award you 100WP. And you can expect more dropping in in time I once proposed CCP stick those AI turrets on an RDV and make a surrogate drone. But they apparently dismissed my idea without a word... Oh well... No big deal
THUNDERGROOVE ZionTCD 181	Posted - 2013.09.29 02:45:00 - [7] - Quote Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: Steppin' Blade wrote: +1 - I hate turrets, anything that mitigates them is worth doing in my book. a strange voice in Blade's head said Use a swarm launcher Blade, use a swarm... Unmanned turrets are manned by very advanced and sophisticated AI algorithm CCP spent couple of manmonths. And you want to just frow it away? Can't you just pretend you do some PvE? I can With an advanced swarm launcher. 4-6 hits should award you 100WP. And you can expect more dropping in in time I once proposed CCP stick those AI turrets on an RDV and make a surrogate drone. But they apparently dismissed my idea without a word... Oh well... No big deal Brb landing my dropship to get out and swarm the turret so it blows up my dropship and I'm left standing around here with swarms..
Thurak1 Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 223	Posted - 2013.09.29 05:00:00 - [8] - Quote THUNDERGROOVE wrote: Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: Steppin' Blade wrote: +1 - I hate turrets, anything that mitigates them is worth doing in my book. a strange voice in Blade's head said Use a swarm launcher Blade, use a swarm... Unmanned turrets are manned by very advanced and sophisticated AI algorithm CCP spent couple of manmonths. And you want to just frow it away? Can't you just pretend you do some PvE? I can With an advanced swarm launcher. 4-6 hits should award you 100WP. And you can expect more dropping in in time I once proposed CCP stick those AI turrets on an RDV and make a surrogate drone. But they apparently dismissed my idea without a word... Oh well... No big deal Brb landing my dropship to get out and swarm the turret so it blows up my dropship and I'm left standing around here with swarms.. sounds like a good time to bust some tanks or lav's.
Godin Thekiller Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 955	Posted - 2013.09.29 05:26:00 - [9] - Quote I only hate the redline rails, as they are too far to reach in my Maddy
Hellkeizer The Avutora Complex 120	Posted - 2013.09.29 05:28:00 - [10] - Quote If you hate them now wait until we can spawn them in more important areas

Godin Thekiller Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 955	Posted - 2013.09.29 05:34:00 - [11] - Quote Hellkeizer wrote: If you hate them now wait until we can spawn them in more important areas I bet that people will call them UP when they will be able to, because My Blaster will constantly melt them
DildoMcnutz Science For Death The Shadow Eclipse 213	Posted - 2013.09.29 05:46:00 - [12] - Quote Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: Unmanned turrets are manned by very advanced and sophisticated AI algorithm CCP spent couple of manmonths. And you want to just frow it away? Sophisticated? You mean the algorithm were 95% of the time it does nothing/lazily shoots around you with the accuracy of a crippled blind man but the other 5% it goes into super awesome aggro aimbot mode and tears your ass into shreds instantly? Nothing is more frustrating to me than being ohko by a rail gun turret without even drawing aggro from it, it just up and decides to kill me because the turret is just being an assh0le. Being killed by an unmanned turret is rare, which makes it even more frustrating when it does happen.
Arkena Wyrnspire Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 3576	Posted - 2013.09.29 08:52:00 - [13] - Quote DildoMcnutz wrote: Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: Unmanned turrets are manned by very advanced and sophisticated AI algorithm CCP spent couple of manmonths. And you want to just frow it away? Sophisticated? You mean the algorithm were 95% of the time it does nothing/lazily shoots around you with the accuracy of a crippled blind man but the other 5% it goes into super awesome aggro aimbot mode and tears your ass into shreds instantly? Nothing is more frustrating to me than being ohko by a rail gun turret without even drawing aggro from it, it just up and decides to kill me because the turret is just being an assh0le. Being killed by an unmanned turret is rare, which makes it even more frustrating when it does happen. He was being sarcastic...
Robert JD Niewiadomski NULLIMPEX INC 577	Posted - 2013.09.29 11:27:00 - [14] - Quote I was not totally sarcastic on turret's AI sophistication Just in half Turrets will shoot at you when you shoot at them. It's that "aggro" mode. They can hold grudge very long. Even a stray shot will **** them up... Otherwise you can sneak and hack them. Or remdemo them... I once managed to get close and hack when it was shooting at me. But i was close to a hill side and there was something that prevented turrets shot to register with my hitbox. So it shot at that hill instead. And there is a dead zone around the turret's base when it can't harm you. 3-4 meters radius i suppose... If you have a partner one of you can keep the turret engaged and the other can sneak from the opposite side into the dead zone... I preffer to use SL...
Bendtner92 Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1116	Posted - 2013.09.29 11:39:00 - [15] - Quote I don't think there's neccesarily anything wrong with the turrets being able to shoot when unmanned, however they need to be under the same restrictions as when people manually use them. With this I mean they should have the same turn rates. Seeing turrets do an instant 180 to shoot at something behind them is so stupid. Unmanned Blaster and Rail turrets should also overheat like they do when used manually. It makes no sense that the restrictions are suddenly gone just because it's now unmanned instead of being used manually.
Dalmont Legrand Nemesis Ad Astra RUST415 45	Posted - 2013.09.29 11:52:00 - [16] - Quote OMG STOP YELLING, IT IS FUTURE, YOU NEED TO THINK TO SURVIVE, WHAT NECESSARY OF TURRET IS IF IT IS NOT AUTOMATIC? TURRETS MUST BE CAPTURED AS THEY GIVE ADVANTAGE TO TEAM. LEAVE THEM ALONE AND START PLAYING. SORRY FOR CAPSLOCK
KalOfTheRathi Nec Tributis 768	Posted - 2013.09.29 11:55:00 - [17] - Quote Dalmont Legrand wrote: -- snip of internet screaming -- You were the only one screaming.
KalOfTheRathi Nec Tributis 768	Posted - 2013.09.29 12:04:00 - [18] - Quote Two hits with a Proto Assault FG. Gone. Small Rail gun 5 hits (Militia), middle 4 hits, big 2/3 hits (depends on several things). You Drop Ship pilots should ask the tanks to clear them for you. A team work type of activity. Or get altitude when that will work. Scouts, what happened is somebody shot the silly thing. Then the blaster will target either the Merc that shot it or a Red that is close enough to keep it in agro. Bad luck. CCP/Shanghai might have changed the Agro conditions. It used to be that being under 50% of its range it could decide to track you. If you fired at it then you got instant Agro and it needed to lose track of you for some period of time before it would quit hunting you. Good news is they cannot chase you. Bad news is the Rail Guns will shoot you with a perfect shot on the third round or earlier if already in Agro. 1100HP will pretty much do most Mercs in. I think the number is actually higher but I do not know the exact value. Again, depends on percentages related to your armor and shields. After the recent let's blow stuff up and kill things Event more Mercs are aware of the 100WP just waiting to try and kill the Merc that wants to collect it.
Vyzion Eyri The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 1353	Posted - 2013.09.29 12:19:00 - [19] - Quote Implementation of countermeasures for vehicles should include anti-turret countermeasures. Perhaps cloaks or some kind of flare that draws turret aiming mechanisms. This should protect us from turrets which suddenly target us without even being in sight, as well as pesky invisible swarms. Besides that, the main problem I have with turrets is when I'm hovering over them for gunners to shoot at, my dropship is completely vulnerable to someone who wishes to destroy it. To be honest, this problem for vehicles is something that can't be addressed by changing turrets. Right now as infantry, we rarely see kills by them anymore, since people are catching onto how to avoid/destroy them. Removing them will simply make the maps feel more barren. Instead: 1) Wait it out for the vehicle rehaul. Hopefully more vehicles = more targets for the turrets = safer for individual vehicles 2) Countermeasures, as I mentioned above, or 3) Introduce more installation types (A shield generator which recharges shields, a hack assist module which makes hacking the nearest NULL cannon faster, I can think of so many more but anyway...) and make placements random on the map.
Arkena Wyrnspire Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 3577	Posted - 2013.09.29 13:10:00 - [20] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: Small Rail gun 5 hits (Militia), middle 4 hits, big 2/3 hits (depends on several things). Okay. You are aware that small railguns are completely awful and nobody uses them, yes? More importantly, did you know that they don't get a full AV modifier? They're still penalised for shooting hardened targets.

Krom Ganesh Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 335	Posted - 2013.09.29 13:23:00 - [21] - Quote They could use a tracking debuff tbh. I've had one that constantly tried to shoot me through a mountain. Otherwise, I have no problem. But they also need to make it so turrets don't automatically attack non-turret installations. It's annoying when on one of the new maps a blaster turret constantly attacks the null canon on top of a building if they are controlled by opposing teams.
843 nerfnut96 BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 69	Posted - 2013.09.29 17:17:00 - [22] - Quote I'll second the fact that redline turrets need to be removed.


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