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ARs outrange Lasers

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Lurchasaurus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1789	Posted - 2013.09.07 17:28:00 - [1] - Quote This is a problem. At the very least, they need to have the same range.
Nick nugg3t United Universe Corp 77	Posted - 2013.09.07 17:31:00 - [2] - Quote Lurchasaurus wrote: This is a problem. At the very least, they need to have the same range. No they dont Lasers will burn yo ayus more effectively than any AR would at any far range
Chunky Munkey Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 1425	Posted - 2013.09.07 17:33:00 - [3] - Quote Lurchasaurus wrote: This is a problem. At the very least, they need to have the same range. They may have a greater maximum range, but their effective range is certainly less than a laser's.
Lurchasaurus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1789	Posted - 2013.09.07 17:35:00 - [4] - Quote At the range I am talking about, ARs are still hitting with lethal damage where a laser rifle has at most 10% efficiency. That is 2 damage.
Nick nugg3t United Universe Corp 77	Posted - 2013.09.07 17:42:00 - [5] - Quote Lurchasaurus wrote: At the range I am talking about, ARs are still hitting with lethal damage where a laser rifle has at most 10% efficiency. That is 2 damage. lethal damge? laser rifle is more lethal at far and medium range than AR's I do agree that AR range needs to be nerfed though
Sladen Faust XCUTI0N 8	Posted - 2013.09.07 17:44:00 - [6] - Quote Its true. ARs are more effective at range against LR users. It is due in part to the effective range the LR target has to be in for it to do any threatening damage. i think the niche needs to be expanded just a little for LRs to be a little more effective.
RA Drahcir Psygod9 157	Posted - 2013.09.07 17:45:00 - [7] - Quote only laser users understand the original post
TunRa Ill Omens 137	Posted - 2013.09.07 17:48:00 - [8] - Quote Nick nugg3t wrote: Lurchasaurus wrote: At the range I am talking about, ARs are still hitting with lethal damage where a laser rifle has at most 10% efficiency. That is 2 damage. lethal damge? laser rifle is more lethal at far and medium range than AR's I do agree that AR range needs to be nerfed though No, a LR is only good at med (optimal). At med range the laser does 120% eff. At long AND short range it does between 10-30% eff.
Nick nugg3t United Universe Corp 77	Posted - 2013.09.07 17:52:00 - [9] - Quote TunRa wrote: Nick nugg3t wrote: Lurchasaurus wrote: At the range I am talking about, ARs are still hitting with lethal damage where a laser rifle has at most 10% efficiency. That is 2 damage. lethal damge? laser rifle is more lethal at far and medium range than AR's I do agree that AR range needs to be nerfed though No, a LR is only good at med (optimal). At med range the laser does 120% eff. At long AND short range it does between 10-30% eff. oops I didnt mean to put long range sorry about that
Sladen Faust XCUTI0N 8	Posted - 2013.09.07 17:52:00 - [10] - Quote RA Drahcir wrote: only laser users understand the original post Very True

Lurchasaurus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1792	Posted - 2013.09.07 18:25:00 - [11] - Quote I dont want to argue numbers or anything with AR guys, I simply feel it is wrong that an AR should ever out DPS a laser rifle past a laser rifle's optimal range.
Funkmaster Whale Inner.H3LL 511	Posted - 2013.09.07 18:39:00 - [12] - Quote It's not that the AR "outranges" a laser it's just got a wider optimal range than a laser. I know for a fact that at a laser's optimal the regular AR is only doing ~40% of its DPS. Lasers just need to have their optimal range tuned to be a bit wider.
Lurchasaurus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1792	Posted - 2013.09.07 18:54:00 - [13] - Quote Funkmaster Whale wrote: It's not that the AR "outranges" a laser it's just got a wider optimal range than a laser. I know for a fact that at a laser's optimal the regular AR is only doing ~40% of its DPS. Lasers just need to have their optimal range tuned to be a bit wider. The LR only does 10% max past about 70 meters, not sure the actual distance, but ARs past that distance the AR hopelessly beats the LR. It is a simple matter of the AR having more DPS at longer ranges than the LR, which is supposed to be stronger than AR at range.
Funkmaster Whale Inner.H3LL 513	Posted - 2013.09.07 19:01:00 - [14] - Quote Lurchasaurus wrote: Funkmaster Whale wrote: It's not that the AR "outranges" a laser it's just got a wider optimal range than a laser. I know for a fact that at a laser's optimal the regular AR is only doing ~40% of its DPS. Lasers just need to have their optimal range tuned to be a bit wider. The LR only does 10% max past about 70 meters, not sure the actual distance, but ARs past that distance the AR hopelessly beats the LR. It is a simple matter of the AR having more DPS at longer ranges than the LR, which is supposed to be stronger than AR at range. I'm not sure if this is true. Refer to this. The AR's optimal at Proto is up to 42m, and effective is 71m, while the LR's optimal is 66-85m and effective is 89m. That's what I mean, the AR has a wider range of optimal and effectiveness, while the LRs is limited to a particular range. The LR would still outdps a regular AR in the LR's optimal, but achieving that particular situation is what makes it difficult to use. I think the LR optimal should be like 50-90m instead. The Duvolle TAC is another beast, but that's supposedly supposed to mimic the Rail Rifle's role which we don't have yet.
Jade Hasegawa Intrepidus XI EoN. 98	Posted - 2013.09.07 19:17:00 - [15] - Quote Lurchasaurus wrote: This is a problem. At the very least, they need to have the same range. cry some more they are not the same kind of weapon, so why should they,the AR fires plasma slugs, the LAser rifle fires a coherent beam of light, laser difuses over distance. So what you are really saying s you cannot win with the new FOTM gun?
Th3rdSun L.O.T.I.S. 464	Posted - 2013.09.07 19:35:00 - [16] - Quote Nick nugg3t wrote: Lurchasaurus wrote: At the range I am talking about, ARs are still hitting with lethal damage where a laser rifle has at most 10% efficiency. That is 2 damage. lethal damge? laser rifle is more lethal at far and medium range than AR's I do agree that AR range needs to be nerfed though AR's don't need a nerf,they just need less ammo in the clip.By decreasing the ammo,that will force "smart" teams and players to run in packs more and focus fire on a single target,instead of the lone wolf tactics that plague this game,though not as much as other shooters. The officers AR's are the only ones that should have 60 in the clip.Everything else should have no more than 40.
Aero Yassavi PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1637	Posted - 2013.09.07 19:42:00 - [17] - Quote This guy is not joking, True Adamance and I were just talking about this the other day when we were lasering up on the pipes of Ashland. We were literally aiming at a guy just outside our effective range so we were doing virtually no damage, and then he aims and shoots at us and starts chipping away at our shields. He was probably using that AR trick everyone uses to get perfect aim at range, but it's ridiculous A BLAST TECH WEAPON was out ranging us.
Mejt Seykal Expeditionary Group Minmatar Republic 2	Posted - 2013.09.07 19:49:00 - [18] - Quote I use LR and AR. Laser is good i can easly take down every guy in front of me,if you use AA then its even better (sorry only duvolle will kill all at any range,its so damn good).You know where problem is? Tell me why the hell std,adv and proto LR are all the SAME. No diff in all soo stupid.
Gorra Snell The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 113	Posted - 2013.09.07 19:51:00 - [19] - Quote I've been playing with the LR a bit for the past few days (so, grain of salt and all that), and I'm currently of the mind that a gentler damage falloff/wider optimal range would balance it nicely. The crap damage at short range is fine, but it should own the AR at long range. So, yeah, +1.
Aero Yassavi PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1637	Posted - 2013.09.07 19:55:00 - [20] - Quote Mejt wrote: I use LR and AR. Laser is good i can easly take down every guy in front of me,if you use AA then its even better (sorry only duvolle will kill all at any range,its so damn good).You know where problem is? Tell me why the hell std,adv and proto LR are all the SAME. No diff in all soo stupid. This is not the problem at all, and if you make the advanced and prototype do more damage you create a problem. The advanced can fire longer than the standard, and the prototype can fire longer than the advanced. This is a linear increase in fire duration for an exponential increase in damage output over time. If you think there is no benefit on moving beyond the standard laser rifle, you thought wrong. There is a huge benefit.

Magnus Amadeuss DUST University Ivy League 15	Posted - 2013.09.07 21:39:00 - [21] - Quote Just to help people out on this one, there is a weapon range spreadsheet available in rookie training grounds. Clicky For reference when reading it, optimal range is the very highest range the weapon still does 100% damage, effective range is 30% damage. base laser = 66-85 optimal, 89 effective base TacAR= 62 optimal, 95 effective What this means is that at outside of a ~20 meter range the TacAR s the better choice, and is absolutely better at 88+ meters.
BL4CKST4R WarRavens League of Infamy 1310	Posted - 2013.09.07 21:43:00 - [22] - Quote Lurchasaurus wrote: This is a problem. At the very least, they need to have the same range. I got destroyed by a laser and the guys HP wouldn't come up on my screen, so that is an extremely long range.
RA Drahcir Psygod9 162	Posted - 2013.09.07 23:09:00 - [23] - Quote BL4CKST4R wrote: Lurchasaurus wrote: This is a problem. At the very least, they need to have the same range. I got destroyed by a laser and the guys HP wouldn't come up on my screen, so that is an extremely long range. sure...
Viktor Zokas High-Damage 345	Posted - 2013.09.07 23:13:00 - [24] - Quote RA Drahcir wrote: only laser users understand the original post Yes, buff the laser. I dare you motherfuckers to buff it. :Jackson:
Shadow Archeus OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 126	Posted - 2013.09.07 23:19:00 - [25] - Quote The lr optimal range needs to be expanded
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2298	Posted - 2013.09.07 23:24:00 - [26] - Quote Funkmaster Whale wrote: The LR would still outdps a regular AR in the LR's optimal, but achieving that particular situation is what makes it difficult to use. I think the LR optimal should be like 50-90m instead. The Duvolle TAC is another beast, but that's supposedly supposed to mimic the Rail Rifle's role which we don't have yet. Nope, it's meant to mimic the Scrambler Rifle's role. The Breach Rifle is meant to mimic the Rail.
DJINN leukoplast Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 1227	Posted - 2013.09.07 23:27:00 - [27] - Quote The laser is much more fun now with the new scope, but it requires I get WAY too close to the enemy players to be in the effective range, especially since AR's have about the same effective range. The laser, IMO, should be a hybrid between the sniper rifle and the AR (range closer to the AR than sniper though). Cause since the LR is so useless in CQC, the fact I have to pretty much get right on top of somebody to effectively damage them, just puts me at too much risk for too little reward. Lasers should have much better range, but at the same time be a lot less effective in the medium ranges. LR users should have the same mentality as a sniper, keep your distance, otherwise goodbye suit.
True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1764	Posted - 2013.09.08 00:17:00 - [28] - Quote Lurchasaurus wrote: This is a problem. At the very least, they need to have the same range. No they need less range, they are blaster tech. Lasers vastly outrange blaster tech.
Vell0cet Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 140	Posted - 2013.09.08 01:42:00 - [29] - Quote The solution is to add back the sharpshooter skill that will push the range of the LR out to 115-120ish at level 5 and increase the ADS zoom significantly. This is still well short of the sniper, but will be able to outrage AR's, while being very vulnerable in the AR's optimal. Also, no other weapon requires you to stick your head out of cover stationary for several seconds with a giant "gank me" arrow pointing to your location in order to deal damage effectively. The LR still needs a little love IMO.
Lurchasaurus SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1824	Posted - 2013.09.08 03:21:00 - [30] - Quote alright, im back. nice to see a couple trolls who know nothing. I have no problems with the LR's damage output in its optimal and certainly dont have a problem with the proto having the same damage as the standard. While the numbers are the same, due to the nature of how the weapon kicks into gear once the gun heats up, the proto weapon is able to compound the damage to a much higher scale than the standard and even advanced variant. As i said, i do not want to argue numbers, I am simply of the opinion that a standard variant AR should NEVER out DPS a LR at and beyond the LR's optimal, assuming the LR user isnt an idiot and he is not firing with a cooled LR the entire time. That is all. Optimal ranges on the LR need some adjusting.



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