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[request] allow passengers to shoot from dropship

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D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 773	Posted - 2013.08.30 06:14:00 - [1] - Quote https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=104215 i posted this in general discusion, but i feel it needs to be in this section
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 786	Posted - 2013.08.30 19:01:00 - [2] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? that would be awesome. and still balanced because the dropship itself can still get shot down...lolz but it would be awesome to see rockets flying out from my dropship everywhere
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 786	Posted - 2013.08.30 19:05:00 - [3] - Quote Fire of Prometheus wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? Well swarms need that little bit of space when they shoot, mass drivers would need to be relatively close to the ground so that the rounds don't explode in mid air. Perhaps if a mass driver round hit the inside of the DS then it would damage the dropship. i have had mass driver rounds hit my dropship and kill my gunners pretty easy. the passengers are easy targets, but when properly position this can be deadly.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 786	Posted - 2013.08.30 19:10:00 - [4] - Quote Gringo Nos wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? Talked about this a few times with Corp mates. We thought any heavy weapons would be OP. IMO swarm launchers should be a heavy weapon but since they're not I would only want to see sidearms in the passenger seats. So my vote is sidearms only. dont forget you can still hit anypassengers in the dropship... and since they are in a vehicle they also take damage from the AV that hits the vehicle. remember they are just as suseptible as you are. one thing everyone here is forgetting: when you spawn in a match and see an enemy dropship whether its assault or not what does everyone do? they shoot it down. when your team is redlined and you see a dropship what does your team do? shoot it down. so, if you already shot dropships down and theycan't do anything right now, then why is it OP when they can do something? your going to shoot them down anyway
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 786	Posted - 2013.08.30 19:18:00 - [5] - Quote Vin Vicious wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? Seemes like an ideal position for a mass driver to support units on the ground, swarms on the other hand I can see getting out out of hand, take the drop ship to mid ceiling and have swarms rain down with no way of a counter. Massdrivers could just get shot out easily at thier op range with the bay doors open Quick idea for drop ships seeing we're on the subject of the "open bay doors feature" Make it so the only way people can 'drop' or abandon a drop ship is when the bay doors are open This would somewhat solve the lack of kills when downing a drop ship and placing a duty to the pilot to remember too open the doors to save his crew/gunners if he's going down or dropping people off how to counter = your SL or forgun
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 786	Posted - 2013.08.30 19:29:00 - [6] - Quote Gabriella Grey wrote: Skybladev2 wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? Dropships now are not so much threat like vehicles should be. It pretty thin and cannot deliver much DPS. If we allow people use swarms inside dropships it will not be untouchable weapon, because when they shoot all their ammo, they have to go out :) I think allowing customize dropships's DPS and type of damage in that way is a great idea: Take 2 gunners and 4 swarm launchers - you are ultimate vehicle destroyer. Forgegun can shoot you as usual, and when it happens your passengers are easy frag crowd. Take 2 gunners and 4 mass drivers - you can protect any NULL cannon, but need to stand still and low, vulnerable to everyone. And when they out of ammo - they easy frags again. Take 2 gunners and 4 forgeguns - well, I think, they kill can themselves and dropship too while maneuvering from time to time... But if not, maybe you realize at last, that forgeguns are too overpowered? Returning to swarms - if you think 4 swarms can fill a dropship, why 4 swarms can not gather and shoot that dropship? 2 shoots from each player will be enough to kill any dropship. I want to say, that at now drophips are at low dps, high cost and low HP. My Python not get killed every match only because I am not so much threat to other players. If we increase dropship's threat level, then they will be shot down more often and delivering, say, 4 swarms DPS to other players will be quite tricky. Maybe it will teach other players to look to the sky ;) this might sound good to you in theory but as I stated above, this will make the game broken. Dropships and other weapons along those lines that could allow forge guns and swarm launchers to shoot out of them, would simply just kill everything, giving no meaning to much of anything. You should think over how it will impact those who have invest time in vehicles, and various other things. Should I bring up the point about when the flaylock was hated by everyone with a light weapon? its funny how the flaylock was hated, but the AR, sniper and SMG still had more kills than the flaylock. its funny how the flaylock killed people in specific instnances, like close range, or with high ground, but instead of adjusting tactics people screamed OP? its interesting how people who invested SP in flaylocks got screwed over because people using militia ARs couldn't out gun them. the only people complaining really where AR users. the game won't be broken, people will just need to actually use their AV fits. its quite simple. on that note flaylocks actually need a buff.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 789	Posted - 2013.08.31 01:11:00 - [7] - Quote people are scared of this breaking the game... (and by people i mean players who only use ARs). however, as I always mention. this is a way of encouraging a more DYNAMIC gameplay style. namely, people with ARs or whatever weapon can't just camp one spot because their are many tactics that can be used to remove them, or by pass them. basically, the more variaty there is in a game, and the more options availible the more dynamic a gaming experience is. by allowing passengers in a dropship to shoot from the passenger seats, tons of oportunities are open for team play, dropship modification, dropsuit fittings (making a suit purposely to dropship) and much more. this will enable dropships to have offensive ( bombarding an objective, before deploting troops to capture it) and defensive capabilities (providing cover fire for VIPs as you retreat from an objective). it will enable dropships to be a threat to tanks, and not just another easy raill turret kill. it will encourage more people to invest in dropships At the same time it will encourage enemy players to invest in AV gear (they may use AV nades on a regular fit instead of only AV fits), to move strategically, to take and use blaster turrets and rail cannons as opposed to just destroying them. (rails are a dropships enemy) , forgunners will have something to shoot other than just infantry (ever wonder why that forgegunner gets up on the roof and shoots infantry. no one runs vehicles as much, dropships go down in seconds, and tanks are no match for even basic AV. so instead of using the HMG and getting peiced up by ARs [because the AR > HMG] they use the forgun) all in all. its a good decision
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 789	Posted - 2013.08.31 01:13:00 - [8] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? A great way to break the game even more. Forge gun trails are very rarely seen. Swarms can be invisible a significant portion of the time. Any MD at elevation is difficult to take out now. Imagine them at 100m. Now put all of them at a significant height above the battlefield. Most weapons will be unable to respond. Not to mention that Drop Ships are invisible a portion of their flight path because of the recent Great Draw Path Optimization. But the grass is very pretty as it Freaking Grows while you walk by. So natural. And, I agree that it should include a full SP refund not only for Tanks but for my Heavy as well. Hey! Maybe this is the start of a continual CCP/Shanghai releases something ugly and everyone gets a full SP respec to avoid it cycle. That might work ... Not. no one gave me my SP back when you complained about flaylocks. No one gave me my SP back when you decided to make ARs do more damage than HMGs. HTFU. this is a thinking mans game. I refuse to have it dumbed down
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 790	Posted - 2013.08.31 01:53:00 - [9] - Quote Fire of Prometheus wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? I would limit any high-damaging weapons from being able to fire out of DS's. Would cause too much grief. Define high damaging, Forge guns? Mass driver? Snipers? Swarm launchers? high damage = ARs
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 790	Posted - 2013.08.31 02:55:00 - [10] - Quote Fire of Prometheus wrote: Haha I say forge gun is OP, it does more damage than a rail cannon on a tank note. small blaster turret dps (25750/(60)) = 312.5 militia AR dps = 467 milita AR dps > small blaster turret. Quote:* EDIT: I think forge guns are high damage :p note the following: (this without proficiency, damage mods or headshots.) militia ARs dps in 4 seconds time = 467 * 4 = 1868 Assault forge gun dps in 4 seconds time = 1538 militia AR dps > forge gun dps here is a better comparison. militia AR dps per second up to 4 seconds = 467@1sec, 934@2sec, 1401@3sec, 1868@4sec AFG dps per second up to 4 seconds = 0@1sec, 0@2sec, 0@3sec, 1538@4sec AR is not only better than forge gun but does better damage overtime. the only difference between forgun dps and milita AR dps is the following: milita damage vs vehicles in 4 seconds = 1868 .10 = 186.8 Assault forge gun damage vs vehicles in 4 seconds = 1538 1 = 1538 note: i use 4 seconds as the constant for comparison as it takes 4 seconds to charge an Assault forgun

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 794	Posted - 2013.08.31 14:20:00 - [11] - Quote Skihids wrote: The only reason people are freaking out at hand held weapons is that turrets are currently pop guns that don't inspire fear. The vehicle rebuild promises to buff damage output and add burst defense for brief hard hitting engagements. As such it's going to be buffing small turrets for dropships. That should make them better the hand held weapons which will then make personal weapons much less of an issue. One that can be balanced by vulnerability and the need to hold he ship rock steady because only the turrets shield their gunners and have stability augmentation. they shouldn't freak out at all really. i have to put my drop ship at risk everytime I come down to get some shots on these guys.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 795	Posted - 2013.08.31 15:02:00 - [12] - Quote Lillica Deathdealer wrote: Well I think any heavy weapons being shot from inside should seriously offbalance and shake the dropship. Swarms and massdriver would be pretty fine because they couldn't have a sustained presence in the air- They wont be able to use nanohives in the dropship and would quickly run out of ammo. Also as other people have said its got a big risk. One proper tank or AV guy could destroy an entire squad by killing one dropship. I think all of this would only work when we have vehicle locks though, because we can just imagine how blueberries will camp inside your dropship for a whole game now that they could shoot out of it, or a full squad of blueberry forge gunners inside your dropship would flip it upside-down. i dnt think firing the forguns or heavy weapons from them ship should throw it off balance. i mean trying to hover this thing is hard enough. if you see forgunners in a dropship, get your SL, forge gun and AV nades to handle them. or better yet a plasma cannon.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 796	Posted - 2013.09.01 04:04:00 - [13] - Quote this was an intended feature. dropships need this anyway.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 796	Posted - 2013.09.01 04:48:00 - [14] - Quote I can't believe people actually want only secondariesw to be used from the passenger seats...lol can u imagine getting nova knifed from a dropship?...lol use only hipfire from the passenger seats would be balanced.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 797	Posted - 2013.09.01 06:25:00 - [15] - Quote Nguruthos IX wrote: I just think its funny how often people say things like "Derp Realism! // justify some random OP thing because it's Realistic. But when it comes to shooting guns out of a helicopter essentially, suddenly there are all these artificial restrictions. Side arms only Can't use scopes Not certain guns etc. Hmmmm, where are all the realism proponents now? yeah. thats what ive been saying.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 798	Posted - 2013.09.01 10:02:00 - [16] - Quote ADAM-OF-EVE wrote: Sarducar Kahn wrote: Snipers on DS = easy counter snipe. It's not as if they can hide up there. snipe someone out of a ds, someone thinks highly of his sniping skills. only takes the pilot to rotate the ship slightly every few secs and at that height your going to have a really hard time. the player on the ground no matter where he/she is will be practically shooting directly up which means you must be in the right position at the right time to get them. if that ds is slowly rotating then you have little chance of counter sniping him. imagine trying to shoot someone off a tower from the base of the tower. thats exactly how its going to be with the dropship at max height. and at that height he is more likely to see you before you get a good shot on him not if your already on top of your MCC
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 798	Posted - 2013.09.01 10:25:00 - [17] - Quote these guys are clearly shooting out of a helicopter with LMGs, and ARs... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7O7ovNi42U in modern ware, and modern warefare 2, and modern warefare 3, there were several spots in the story mode where you could shoot from helicopters... and of course enemies could shoot oyu back. for example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9kYtesQkVI go to 1:58 second marker and see what he does http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mij3IwTghHg notice 12:51 and beyond ooppss... they didn't.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 798	Posted - 2013.09.01 13:54:00 - [18] - Quote Evolution-7 wrote: When dust was on the carbon engine, you were able to do this. Video link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKtYqWBR7h0 so beautiful.... so.. pristeeeeeeeeeen!!!! what happened to that engine?
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 799	Posted - 2013.09.01 13:55:00 - [19] - Quote Django Quik wrote: What sidearm has the range to be even minimally useful from a dropship? nova knives
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 799	Posted - 2013.09.01 20:08:00 - [20] - Quote Nguruthos IX wrote: D legendary hero wrote: these guys are clearly shooting out of a helicopter with LMGs, and ARs... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7O7ovNi42U in modern ware, and modern warefare 2, and modern warefare 3, there were several spots in the story mode where you could shoot from helicopters... and of course enemies could shoot oyu back. for example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9kYtesQkVI go to 1:58 second marker and see what he does http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mij3IwTghHg notice 12:51 and beyond ooppss... they didn't. People can be Shooting running pigs with an AR from a fast moving aerial vehicle? 'Dropship Realism proponent's' ironic response: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWjDYz2ldN0 you have to admit thats prety cool... I wish that was my job... shooting pigs from a chopper

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 799	Posted - 2013.09.01 22:23:00 - [21] - Quote Nguruthos IX wrote: D legendary hero wrote: these guys are clearly shooting out of a helicopter with LMGs, and ARs... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7O7ovNi42U in modern ware, and modern warefare 2, and modern warefare 3, there were several spots in the story mode where you could shoot from helicopters... and of course enemies could shoot oyu back. for example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9kYtesQkVI go to 1:58 second marker and see what he does http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mij3IwTghHg notice 12:51 and beyond ooppss... they didn't. People can be Shooting running pigs with an AR from a fast moving aerial vehicle? 'Dropship Realism proponent's' ironic response: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWjDYz2ldN0 whats gonna happen to people below my massdriver bound dropship....lolololz you gotta admit this face is the funniest anime face i've ever seen someone make... once my lil bro show'd it to me. i had to post this....lolololololz http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x124a9y_zex70-streamanime-tv_creation&start=890 14:49-14:54 thats exactly what will happen. man.. i miss abridged.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 799	Posted - 2013.09.02 05:31:00 - [22] - Quote Crow Splat wrote: I think that we would stop seeing dropships full of swarms and mass drivers about 3 days after we were allows to do it. Once all the dropship pilots realize that they won't make it 10 feet off the ground because of all the AV that will be headed their way, you won't see many dropships at all. funny because thats exactly how it is now Quote: It's funny how all of you think this would be some unkillable abomination in the sky when it would only take half the number of players in the dropship to shoot it down with ease. And if that's not bad enough then destroyer HAVs are in the not-too-distant future so that's one more thing to shoot you down. Don't forget about fighters too whenever they show up. So Woman, now that we have established that those tactics wouldn't be that difficult to counter, how about we make one of the Minmatar small turrets a belt-fed, automatic mass driver? Basically a Mk 19 grenade launcher used by current day military vehicles. actually thats a good i dea. we already have missle turrets. so whats thedifference except an arc.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 799	Posted - 2013.09.02 18:11:00 - [23] - Quote Inyanga wrote: NoxMort3m wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? in every vehicle with a passanger seath that does not have a turret should allow the occupant to fire their side arm, and only the side arm, it allows you to do more than nurse kill assists and keeps it from being over powered Not to bully, but did you read any of the other posts in this thread? They explain why that is a poor idea, and why primaries would still be viable without being too powerful. Also, have you piloted, or been a flying gunner? To all ready to post here: Please back up your reasonings with a sound argument. (Wow, did I just ask that of the internet!?) It'll make for less rage, and better fights! are you crazy nova knives are the perfect side arm to use from a vehicle
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 799	Posted - 2013.09.02 18:12:00 - [24] - Quote Bright Cloud wrote: Bettie Boop 2100190003 wrote: If you let people shoot out Commandos would have a happy home. Swarm Launcher & Mass Driver Who wouldnt love being shot at by 2 commandos and 2 heavies with Forge Guns + the guns in the DS. As long as they make it so when you "over kill" a Drop Ship it explodes killing every one. I would love getting 7 kills with my proto swarm launcher! That would be fine with me. When the dropship hits 0HP it should explode in mid air and not on the ground. Its just stilly that the dropship is the only exception to it while tanks and LAV's allready instantly explode. no when tanks and LAVs catch fire they have time to escape. I think its a nice mechanic to have the dropship crash instead of explode mid air.... thats actually realistic. the only things that should blow up a dropship mid air are rail cannons on tanks or rail turrets.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 802	Posted - 2013.09.03 00:16:00 - [25] - Quote Komodo Jones wrote: CHIKANO BMXer wrote: Hecarim Van Hohen wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? It would make me feel all squishy inside :3 But for real, sounds kinda/ possibly/ potentially op to me :/ How about limiting the weapons to rifles, smg's, pistols etc.? i'm tired of ppl still whining about weapons they already weakened i havn't been killed by a mass driver in ages That's impressive the way I use em lol, still shouldn't be nerfed, just give people buffs, how about giving people an explosive damage dampener or something? I think that when 1.4 rolls around and people start armor tanking there will be people who are far more difficult to kill with it, maybe then people will stop screaming OP then people will stop using MD, and the only weapon that will be able to kill will be ARs... then like after uprising... people will say that TTK is too long and only ARs will get a buff.... welcome to AR 514. the only thing that could change that is if CCP wolfman levels up use BUFF lazers to lvl 5 proficiency... right now he has lvl 4 operator. thats enough to get an adv buff lazer.. but whoever nerfs stuff has lvl 5 nerf bat proficiency and officer nerf bats
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 802	Posted - 2013.09.03 00:18:00 - [26] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? Huge fan. I would refer to this as the Dust equivalent to the AC-130 . Yes!...lolololz If I can get a good dropship with mlaster turret, a passenger with an Assault HMG, and Forgunner, I have an AC-130...lololol well, all the suits gear, and ship combined its about the same price as one. when we get HDS i will fully invest in being a pilot
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 806	Posted - 2013.09.03 02:28:00 - [27] - Quote Fire of Prometheus wrote: Come on CCP just do it already!!!!! do it...CCP...do it
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 809	Posted - 2013.09.04 16:31:00 - [28] - Quote Thrydwulf Khodan wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? About the same as I would with a dropship filled with forgeguns. That would change the game FOTM to dropships gunboats loaded up with Massdrivers and forgegun passengers. A high reward low risk situation with minimal to no retaliation opportunity for ground based troops without A/V. and thats why those grund troops need to put SP in some AV gear, to swat those dropships out the sky. the new maps have plenty of indoor cover. i do not understand why you guys complain about guns and vehicles that the game has multiple counters for, instead of just using the counters. your argument is baseless and stupid. its like saying TANKs are OP because infantrymen with assault rifles can't destroy it with just their assault rifles. no **, because tanks totally weren't designed for that? dropships the helicopters of this game are desgined to with stand small arms fire too. if the 90% resistance to small arms fire were removed from vehicles a single militia AR can take out a tank in 8 seconds Quote:** Dropships currently fill the same role as a helicopter in current combat, and the side turrets meet that need well. (Though adding a spot for a rear gun, or allowing the forward facing gun to be run by a co-pilot/gunner would be a nice separation of duties.) dropships turrets are garbage right now unless you have proto turrets.. but this isn't enough CPU/PG to fit proto turrets and make your dropship effective. BTW helicopter in current combat can have infantry shoot out the passenger sides
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 809	Posted - 2013.09.04 16:37:00 - [29] - Quote Gabriella Grey wrote: CommanderBolt wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? Thats potentially 7 kills in two or three shots of a forge or railgun however.... :) 'all the eggs in one basket...' I assume this is something you guys at CCP have discussed before and come to the same conclusion as some people here that it could be a problem. However could it be balanced say by reducing passenger slots? For example: Have the 2 usual gunners and then only 2 passengers at the doorways with the ability to fire weapons? (Total of 5 people including the pilot) the larger capacity variants of the dropship is designed to transport teams... Assault dropships carry less passengers, I don't think its best for the game that, as stated previously, should weapons that can dominate with a great presence should be shot from dropships or any vehicle for that matter. Especially if they can clearly show that the result is a broken gameplay positive for dropships or more negative. Dropships have turrets, and that is exactly what they are designed for, why make them obsolete? If people are allowed to shoot out of dropships, it should be weaponry that can not cause a mass anarchy to vehicles or making a raid from out of a dropship over powered, in the case of the mass driver. and the game isn't massively broken right now with ARs out gunning HMGs and basically everything else? I mean for god's sake a milita AR does greater dps than an AFG (in the 4 seconds it takes an AFG to fire, a milita AR can do 1896 damage. AFG only does 1538) what difference is there between a forgunner on a roof and one in a dropship except that the dropship can be shot down? seriously, no one here wants to invest in AV gear so you want to nerf something that could never be overpowered. while we are nerfing things here how about we reduce the AR dps from 467 to 340 like the breach AR.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 809	Posted - 2013.09.04 17:15:00 - [30] - Quote Gabriella Grey wrote: Dropships are fragile, but a good pilot knows where they should and shouldn't go. It is so frustrating to hear from people wanting to operate along the same lines as a tank or similar how a murder taxi use to be. There are tons of pilot forums by great players who have taken the time to go through what is needed for dropships and what you should be aware of. If you are in doubt you should read the previous replies by many veteran pilots and new pilots alike. I honestly think the a few post above have not even taken in the consideration how this would just break the game for pilots and for other vehicles as well. Sometimes one should think how things will effect the game as a whole rather than what they think would be great no matter the circumstances. Further more if you want to compare something how infantry weapons are, even though its off subject, how easy do you think aim assist will be when taking out other vehicles and turrets with such a large hit box? I think the lot of you are not even giving any serious thought to what you are posting in regards to vehicles. this was an intended feature ccp has in the game partly... you can open the doors to a dropship at will now... but you can't fire out them. dropship turrets are weak right now. missle n rail turrets are garbage unless full proto. blaster gotta be scatter to get any effect. so, if my passengers can't shoot out why can they be shot while in it? the reason real life helicopter have turret mounted guns is because those are more powerful Yes more powerful than infantry weapons. real life helicopters can be taken down with 1-2 good rpgs. dropship turrets have LESS dps than ARs for infantry, BUT with 2-3 swarms you can still takeout a derpship

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 809	Posted - 2013.09.04 17:17:00 - [31] - Quote Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: Thrydwulf Khodan wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? About the same as I would with a dropship filled with forgeguns. That would change the game FOTM to dropships gunboats loaded up with Massdrivers and forgegun passengers. A high reward low risk situation with minimal to no retaliation opportunity for ground based troops without A/V. Dropships currently fill the same role as a helicopter in current combat, and the side turrets meet that need well. (Though adding a spot for a rear gun, or allowing the forward facing gun to be run by a co-pilot/gunner would be a nice separation of duties.) Do you realize how easy it is to shot down a dropship with swarms? It is (literary) a flying coffin... If every body in a team gives in to this goonboat and not switch to swarms, they deserve to be fried and sprayed from high above ...
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 809	Posted - 2013.09.04 17:24:00 - [32] - Quote T8R Raid wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? what my corp and i did, was, i pulled out a grimsnes, they all jumped on top with forge guns, worked better than expected, im a smooth enough pilot to do it without losing someone off the side of it.. until i got rocked with a rail gun and they ALL fell off, comically hilarious, noone died and i got away since the doot on the turret didnt know how to hit a moving target. dropships are so fragile that yes, you should be able to launch ANYTHING out of it, since the first thing thats gonna happen is that the other team will notice immediately and start bringing out forge guns, then your 5 or 7 manned dropship is just a burning pile of metal. good song title though.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 814	Posted - 2013.09.05 04:21:00 - [33] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: Plus, I'd like to point out something: What if Wolfman decides to buff DS's tank? then what? You still think that the apparent "flying coffins" would still be able to use the high-powered weapons inside? yep, because, swarms and forguns can still kill them. dropships don't have enough ehp to tank that hard. and even if they did.. you can still shoot the gunners out with small arms and AV. for the gunners to be effective they need to be in your small arms range too.... i lost gunners like that. only snipers, would be immune to that rule... but a dropship hovering accross the map is an easy target for rail cannons and swarms and forguns. plus counter snipers
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 816	Posted - 2013.09.05 08:08:00 - [34] - Quote 501st Headstrong wrote: excillon wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? God no...The MD's need to be nerfed already, people are seriously abusing the EXO and freedom as it is. Agreed, can't take on these guys even with my heavy suit. I have to pray I kill them before they turn around and start blasting me. if your a real heavy you would know that getting outgunned by ARs is more of a problem than MD... especially since the glow orange now happy holloween b****es
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 816	Posted - 2013.09.05 08:35:00 - [35] - Quote Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: Calling CCP Wolfman, calling CCP Wolfman... Do you still follow this thread? Have your post was serious invite for discussion or just sarcasm to troll us? What is your general impression on the DUST (forum) community reception of the OP idea based on this thread posts? I can't be objective cos i'm pro it and my impression is there are more ppl who love it compared to haters Am i wrong or right?
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 828	Posted - 2013.09.05 11:48:00 - [36] - Quote Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: Hey Hero, i think this thread should go into hibernation mode untill CCP sorts out 1.4 patch issues They apparently are on fire and have no time to answer to the spoiled brats' whim Maybe bump it next week? Ppl will get bored and loose interest into it otherwise... I'm not the guy bumping it people see it and respond because they want to see this happen. issues with 1.4 will be done by next week. this with the passengers im trying to get confirmed as a hotfix if its a simple coding issue (we can shoot into dropships cant we so the coding can't be that much different), its hard then at least 1.5
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 828	Posted - 2013.09.05 11:54:00 - [37] - Quote Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: Pvt Numnutz wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? Thank you for saying this. Even though I think it would be really cool to be able to have my squad shooting out of the dropship while we come into a point, it would be massively overpowered and far too easily abused. My friend and I had a discussion about this a while back. We came to the conclusion that if you were to implement this it would have to be sidearms only. I must say now it would definitely be more trouble than its worth. I can see blues shooting endlessly inside my dropship, trying to get kills with a pistol instead of jumping out over the point I'm hovering over for obvious reasons. If you want to shoot your weapon you jump out when the pilot gives you a good place to jump out on, leave the dropship kills to the gunners and Assault dropship pilots, that's what they train for! There is one problem with your argument: Quote: (...)I can see blues shooting endlessly inside my dropship(...) Infantry weapons have limited ammo. And as others said: pilot would have to hover midair (read: wait for shutdown motionlessly) to allow successful hits from said weapons. How long will ammo last if there is no place in DS to deploy hives? And how long will dropship last if it don't move? And as of Uprising 1.5 patch (coming probably in four weeks) vehicles will get limited ammo as well. Dropship cost ISK. Modules cost ISK. Infantry weapons cost ISK. Multiplied by number of mercs shooting. My guess is the combined cost of this combo shotdown will equall or exceed the cost of equipement destroyed by it in it's "life expectancy" window. Show me now where is the lack of balance here? in fact it would still be UP due to dropship flight mechanics, and the fact that AV can still kill my passengers even now out of my dropships. dropships now are just flying war points... they dnt accomplish much because thhey get insta-killed by all AV. and again... what side arms could possible by of use from any dropship? flaylocks are NOT MD and dnt have the splash range as such, scrambler pistols dnt have the range to be effective, SMGs only with proficiency will have enough range to do anything... and nova knives?! c'mon bro. I would need to hover at 10m altitude from the ground to kill enemies like this. I might as well just land and hvae them jump out and attack.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 828	Posted - 2013.09.05 12:01:00 - [38] - Quote shaman oga wrote: As promised here is the video of the aerial attack there was only one guy on their team running AV
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 832	Posted - 2013.09.05 12:23:00 - [39] - Quote shaman oga wrote: Yes, is the sad story of AV, all or nothing. Of course do stupid things like that in a match with a lot of AV is impossible, it's impossible to use every kind of dropship if there are a lot of AVers. this is the relationship of[IMG]http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view6/3846267/sweat-laugh-o.gif[/IMG] AV to drop ships
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 858	Posted - 2013.09.06 20:59:00 - [40] - Quote shaman oga wrote: Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote: shaman oga wrote: Yes, is the sad story of AV, all or nothing. Of course do stupid things like that in a match with a lot of AV is impossible, it's impossible to use every kind of dropship if there are a lot of AVers. You'v destroyed only one HAV in 10 minutes! Had to restock ammo couple of times and constantly run away from AV. And you'v been almost shotdown in one moment. How many players were in red team? It's strange so little swarms coming at you after all. I am puzzled... Not very OP imho. EDIT: This way you can pack more swarms on DS than in passenger compartment of dropship I'm still convinced that allow weapon usage on DS is not a good thing, the DS itself it's not OP, but the method that you can use to hunt vehicles will be OP. are you serious?

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 859	Posted - 2013.09.07 08:05:00 - [41] - Quote Cpt Merdock wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? Or an HMG shooting out of there acting like an extra turret almost. are you serious?
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 861	Posted - 2013.09.07 21:48:00 - [42] - Quote 501st Headstrong wrote: I don't really think this is such a bad idea. I mean, in helicopters of today, people can shoot out of it by sitting on the ground and aiming. You don't know how many times I have raced to a dropship, but hostiles gun me down. If the doors could open for a DS on the ground and people could lay down cover fire until I board, that would be amazing, it really increases the team mechanic. As for combat in the air, 4 dropship passengers can't do anything currently, just stay concernedly at the healthbar lol. This would be the time to implement some new weapons that lock onto targets finally hunting down LAVs and aiming at hubs of hostiles, somewhat like a turret Forge Gun, however it takes around 10 seconds to charge, and 10 to reload. This turret has to be manned by 2 people. One on each side, and that would be heaven. Or! Flamethrowers. Just throw open the door and raze the battlefield with long tendrils of death! The risk would be substantial, but dropships and their turrets in my opinion are very hard to make effective. Mostly they are used for transportation. Making them hubs for combat and viable combat reinforcements would make it Star Wars-esque, similar to how clones fall dead in the ship as other clones crouch and lay down combat until the driver gets airborne. Don't change the current DS mechanics, introduce three new Dropships : The Anaconda, which is like a long sky-dragon capable of carrying multiple squads of players, and spikes underneath it which can tear apart infantry if the driver is skilled enough to drag across the ground without killing themselves. the WarMonger. This ship can have up to 9000 armor, and the inside of it has cover so players can duck and fire. Since its twice the size of normal dropships, it can hold 9 players( minus 3 because of the cover, optional). Lastly is Atlantis, a DS tank convertible. If the dropship lands, it has a module that can allow it gain tracks and become a tank. It can only become a tank, and then a Dropship back one time before it must charge for ten minutes. The Atlantis is an Assault Dropship with a frontal turret that becomes a spherical cannon, finally able to target other flying vehicles hovering above it. Oh, and these Dropships can lock themselves, so players not meant to be in them can't board. This is my future of Dust. Thoughts? I think you have some insteresting ideas there. but i agree with the first paragraph.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 865	Posted - 2013.09.07 23:33:00 - [43] - Quote @501 you have some good ideas. but, i would wait until after 1.5 to see how this works out. also, medium dropships nd heavy dropships haven't been introduced yet. so I'd like to see what CCP has in store for those. the art department is already designing them.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 867	Posted - 2013.09.08 06:59:00 - [44] - Quote Bone Scratcher wrote: I agree with this, but not unless Forge Guns are patched. Why give them 5 kills? im a forgunner, but i also fly dropships forgunning from a dropship is awesome!
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 897	Posted - 2013.09.09 19:15:00 - [45] - Quote so, CCP wolfman are you guys going to do this or....?
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 941	Posted - 2013.09.11 03:18:00 - [46] - Quote we are getting these passengers to shoot!
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 956	Posted - 2013.09.12 03:23:00 - [47] - Quote with te amount of views, posts and positive reponses there is really no other choice but to give us this feature already intended for game play since beta
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 959	Posted - 2013.09.12 15:25:00 - [48] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: there are various ways balancing weapon stacking if passengers are able to use their weapons. mass drivers & plasma cannons get weapon sway swarms get higher lock on times and fire delays and heavy weapons should be disallowed Heavy weapons should be hipfire only light weapons you can aim side arms you can't use.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 966	Posted - 2013.09.12 20:32:00 - [49] - Quote Prince Mahav's wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? Swarm launchers? Seriously? It's already a pain to deal with a Dropship when they're straight over your tank. You cannot counter them. We'll just add 4 swarm launchers to the passenger seats and see how that'll turn out.... Mass drivers seems ideal, but swarm launchers is just too much. dropships are useless right now... the need this
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1018	Posted - 2013.09.13 17:16:00 - [50] - Quote still waiting CCP wolfman

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1022	Posted - 2013.09.14 05:29:00 - [51] - Quote vehicles are a profitless venture right now we need a way of making them more cost effective. doing this for dropships is a step in the right direction.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1036	Posted - 2013.09.15 08:25:00 - [52] - Quote KA24DERT wrote: ...as a Mass Driver user, this is a terrible idea. I've seen one of our dropship pilots with ONE gunner play a close quarters support role and just rack up massive kills. I'm sorry if your pilots are scrubs, but the current capabilities of dropships are seriously underutilized. This feature will make them over powered. Trust me, you do NOT want me in a dropship with a Mass Driver. You will be sad. you don't want me shooting your dropship with an assault forgun. definately not starburt side. imma capsize your @$$
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1042	Posted - 2013.09.16 17:13:00 - [53] - Quote bump
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1043	Posted - 2013.09.17 05:20:00 - [54] - Quote except it wont. bump
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1043	Posted - 2013.09.17 05:32:00 - [55] - Quote Beforcial wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? Give tanks a siege mode where they initiate a dome like shield and allows them to use an Anti-DS weapon that can actually shoot strait up aswell as sideways, but he won't be able to move until he disengages it. A low rate of fire type weapon no tracking some thing like the forge but tank size. [ ... ] <------------add ideas there. the dropships right now are under used and very useless other then being ~~a quick air taxis~~ shot down immediately for a quick 75 points , which 80% of them are. When they are actually called in. There we go. that is truth
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1044	Posted - 2013.09.18 05:01:00 - [56] - Quote bump
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1051	Posted - 2013.09.18 15:33:00 - [57] - Quote this would also encourage CCP to make the small turrets better, since small turrets suck... and if they put ammo limits then no one will ever use small turrets.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1053	Posted - 2013.09.18 20:18:00 - [58] - Quote Atiim wrote: Gringo Nos wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? Talked about this a few times with Corp mates. We thought any heavy weapons would be OP. IMO swarm launchers should be a heavy weapon but since they're not I would only want to see sidearms in the passenger seats. So my vote is sidearms only. So what about us Logi's? There's No way CCP Logibro would like that (or any logi). by side arms only, he means nova knives and melee's only...of course logi's can only melee so yeah...
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1053	Posted - 2013.09.18 20:32:00 - [59] - Quote i'm still trying to figure out what makes people like gringo nos the undisputed champions of all that is balance, empowering them to dictact what is and isn't OP? ...lol the DEV's intended it in the game. they simply didn't have the time to finish it. since vehicle fixes are coming in 1.6, why not use this chance to implement something thats supposed to be in the game.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1057	Posted - 2013.09.19 03:10:00 - [60] - Quote KA24DERT wrote: Arc-08 wrote: KA24DERT wrote: PSA: If you want this feature you are a terrible dropship pilots, and all of your friends are terrible dropship pilots. really your saying that you can make a great profit using dropships, and that getting some extra kill assits off of infantry in your dropship woudl be a terrible idea?!!!?. do you even pilot a dropship, it isn't hard to get a kill if you can be in a map with only MLT AV, but your saying that you do not want to get more WP, and thus more isk for flying your dropship. plus how does liking something make us terrible dropship pilots?! Yep. I've been in squads with Stay Fresh, Loopy T, and other amazing pilots. They rarely lose one, and they are crazy good even with one manned turret. They're about as deadly as a madrugar with blasters. If you let me shoot out of a dropship piloted by those two, in addition to manned turrets, it will be OP. I do agree that ISK and and WP rewards need to be buffed in general to reward excellent performance in matches. But that is totally separate from this issue, which is just a case of terrible dropship pilots asking for features to make up for their lack of skill. those guys don't get shot done because they run with teams full of proto scrubs man. everyone on their team who's not in a dropship runs proto ARs man get real. plus running three or four dropships together is hard to do on a regular basis. finally, none of them carry CRUs in their dropships. they only run assault dropships. so, yeah 4 assault dropships with a team of proto caldari scrubs with ARs makes them hard to take down. but at the same time... anything combined with a team of proto caldari AR uses is hard to take down. look at LAVs. I'm a great pilot but the facts are simple, the dropship is gimped! Calling people who are trying to get something gimped buffed is like called scouts scrubds for getting insta-killed by GEKs... Dropships = flying scouts

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1061	Posted - 2013.09.20 07:12:00 - [61] - Quote Atiim wrote: D legendary hero wrote: Atiim wrote: Gringo Nos wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? Talked about this a few times with Corp mates. We thought any heavy weapons would be OP. IMO swarm launchers should be a heavy weapon but since they're not I would only want to see sidearms in the passenger seats. So my vote is sidearms only. So what about us Logi's? There's No way CCP Logibro would like that (or any logi). by side arms only, he means nova knives and melee's only...of course logi's can only melee so yeah...sarcasm Who da &$@% is gonna be able to use nova knives and melee in a dropship? That would require someone to fly the ship right oh the ground next to someone. Do you use the PREVIEW function before posting? Non-Logi's trying to cripple us
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1061	Posted - 2013.09.20 07:17:00 - [62] - Quote KA24DERT wrote: D legendary hero wrote: KA24DERT wrote: Arc-08 wrote: KA24DERT wrote: PSA: If you want this feature you are a terrible dropship pilots, and all of your friends are terrible dropship pilots. really your saying that you can make a great profit using dropships, and that getting some extra kill assits off of infantry in your dropship woudl be a terrible idea?!!!?. do you even pilot a dropship, it isn't hard to get a kill if you can be in a map with only MLT AV, but your saying that you do not want to get more WP, and thus more isk for flying your dropship. plus how does liking something make us terrible dropship pilots?! Yep. I've been in squads with Stay Fresh, Loopy T, and other amazing pilots. They rarely lose one, and they are crazy good even with one manned turret. They're about as deadly as a madrugar with blasters. If you let me shoot out of a dropship piloted by those two, in addition to manned turrets, it will be OP. I do agree that ISK and and WP rewards need to be buffed in general to reward excellent performance in matches. But that is totally separate from this issue, which is just a case of terrible dropship pilots asking for features to make up for their lack of skill. those guys don't get shot done because they run with teams full of proto scrubs man. everyone on their team who's not in a dropship runs proto ARs man get real. plus running three or four dropships together is hard to do on a regular basis. finally, none of them carry CRUs in their dropships. they only run assault dropships. so, yeah 4 assault dropships with a team of proto caldari scrubs with ARs makes them hard to take down. but at the same time... anything combined with a team of proto caldari AR uses is hard to take down. look at LAVs. I'm a great pilot but the facts are simple, the dropship is gimped! Calling people who are trying to get something gimped buffed is like called scouts scrubds for getting insta-killed by GEKs... Dropships = flying scouts Two clarify, I played with one great dropship pilot at a time, not 2, or 4. Also, maps are big, dropships are fast, and dropsuits are slow. It doesn't matter too much how many "proto scrubs" they run with, our actions on the ground don't have a strong connection to their ability to avoid swarms and forgers while racking up kills. Half of you guys complaining about getting shot down just don't know how to fly. Even CCP is trolling you at this point, give this idea up.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1061	Posted - 2013.09.20 07:20:00 - [63] - Quote Xak Arji wrote: Ok, as a devoted pilot I know the passengers DO NOT need to be able to shoot out the side. Forge guns...mass drivers... and all kinds of folks that would exploit the system.... I can see that issue blowing up the forums in negative feedback in less than an hour to you poor guys in CCP ( You must be sick of our negativity) BUT how about a different proposal? You do plan on giving us vehicle toons a chassis option to mod with eventually right? Why not give the assault dropships the ability to sacrifice the gunner spots for frontward-facing pilot controlled turrets. That would let us get more WP and kills and feel more justified when we loose a million ISK for a wopping 5 kills.... *Ya know, because infantry regards us as such a huge threat and goes on a search and destroy ON SIGHT for a relatively small threat compared to other players.* And can you devise some sort of defense for forge guns aside from flipping? maybe slow the slugs enough that we can dodge them AT LONG RANGE (addressed at fellow player/ critics) when we see them? Thanks guys. thank you. this is exactly the reason this needs to be implemented. especially, when we are allowed to remove turrets.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1061	Posted - 2013.09.20 07:24:00 - [64] - Quote Drapedup Drippedout wrote: I still don't understand why a DS pilot cannot operate a forward facing blaster turret? I don't fly DS, and my alt is a forge so this is coming from someone that enjoys blasting those things to pieces. The DS's out there now have less survivability than a paper airplane in hell. Why not give the pilot a fighting chance and blaster (like an SR) that is effective against infantry and even somewhat against vehicles? You can't allow infantry to fire from them, with the height ceiling, the endless possibilities of loadouts (2 proto swarms, 2 proto turrets, and 2 proto repair tools) current AV weapon ranges and current flight speeds they would literally be a flying fortress. But why not give the pilot the ability to defend himself? I think an adv level rail gun would be pretty cool. It may actually give the rail gun a legitimate place in this game. lolololz... ok. So, instead of balancing dropships by allowing all the passengers to be useful, and giving us fitting options by allowing us to fly without turrets. You want to gimp dropships in disguise of a buff?...lololz Rail tueerts are le worst in the game.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1088	Posted - 2013.09.20 23:51:00 - [65] - Quote Caeli SineDeo wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: ~~Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example?~~ Sad thing Wolfman those would not be to bad. think of all 4 guys with forge guns. Sitting in a highly tanked armor dropship or a full speed tanked shield dropship pub stomping would be brought to a whole new lvl. Only way I see this applicable is if the limitations to what weapons are allowed to be shot out of dropships. Otherwise we would see some broken things that end up destroying balance @Baal you really do not know what your talking about. Rendering issues currently will allow dropships to disappear in the sky while having the range of a forge gun to rain death from thin air. Any decent forge gunner will have no trouble adjusting to the movement of a dropship. And using this to kill 4-16 people depending on how many forgers you have and then fly out quickly as they reload and rep up your HP. This would be very broken. I was a very avid dropship pilot and I know this will break things. Just think of alldin and cubs sitting in a derpship with there forges. Ya just **** all around. broken things destroying balance? good point. you mean like: milita AR capable of killing a heavy with 1600ehp in 3.4 in its effective range Proto caldari suits being about to tank as hard as a heavy ARs being supperior to HMGs in just about every way dropships getting one shotted by forguns, or killed in 2 volleys of swarms even with armor hardeners activated and armor reps activated one assault suit with adv AV nades and proto AV being able to take out almost any vehicle in the game by himself hitting an areal assault vehicle with rounds from an AR tilting it, scout and heavy suits being totally gimped sounds like the game is already pretty broken pal. but, in case such an experienced pilot such as yourself is worried about being OP don't worry I'll make sure I forgun you out the sky with 1 shot from my breach. Because in case you haven't noticed flaming wrecks are not OP.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1096	Posted - 2013.09.22 00:04:00 - [66] - Quote its time for justice. got 4500+ views, and approx. 350 comments, with only 1 blue tag? com'on
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1101	Posted - 2013.09.23 18:21:00 - [67] - Quote Arc-08 wrote: that doesn't mean anything because they are still weak enough to die in 2 hits. having it easier is much different then havin it easy :P actually dropship mechniques after chromosome got worse. they used to fly like the helicopeters in BF3 now they just kinda suck... they are flying boats with the ehp of a scout porportional among vehicles
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1101	Posted - 2013.09.23 18:25:00 - [68] - Quote KA24DERT wrote: D legendary hero wrote: its time for justice. got 4500+ views, and approx. 350 comments, with only 1 blue tag? com'on If you would actually take time to read people's posts, instead of showing your mastery of strike-throughs, you'd see this is a bad idea. If you would actually read the one Dev post in this thread, you'd realize you are being trolled... BY CCP. If you read 90% of the 350+ comments like i have over the course of this thread you will realize his troll was countered by almost everyone. Most people want this to happen. People who fly dropships want this to happen and people who don't fly dropships want this to happen. the only people scared of this are people like you who run assault and AR and dnt want to play tactically but just want to bumb rush every objective red line people and then complain about redline sniping. every excuse about this being OP is baseless and has been proven so by the simple fact that: AV vs dropships = dropship gone. problem solved. if you invested in AV there would be nothing to complain about. this is a great idea. Your just a scrub.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1101	Posted - 2013.09.23 18:27:00 - [69] - Quote Shijima Kuraimaru wrote: Arc-08 wrote: that doesn't mean anything because they are still weak enough to die in 2 hits. having it easier is much different then havin it easy :P Ah. So you want it easy. Sorry. Dust isn't supposed to be easy. There's always supposed to be something that'll mess you up in short order. For vehicles it's AV. For AV it's everything on the field. LOL If you want easy, play GTA 4 and use cheat codes. correction "Dust isnt supposed to be easy... unless our using an AR. then you can do whatever you want."
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1101	Posted - 2013.09.24 00:14:00 - [70] - Quote nukel head wrote: D legendary hero wrote: KA24DERT wrote: D legendary hero wrote: its time for justice. got 4500+ views, and approx. 350 comments, with only 1 blue tag? com'on If you would actually take time to read people's posts, instead of showing your mastery of strike-throughs, you'd see this is a bad idea. If you would actually read the one Dev post in this thread, you'd realize you are being trolled... BY CCP. If you read 90% of the 350+ comments like i have over the course of this thread you will realize his troll was countered by almost everyone. Most people want this to happen. People who fly dropships want this to happen and people who don't fly dropships want this to happen. the only people scared of this are people like you who run assault and AR and dnt want to play tactically but just want to bumb rush every objective red line people and then complain about redline sniping. every excuse about this being OP is baseless and has been proven so by the simple fact that: AV vs dropships = dropship gone. problem solved. if you invested in AV there would be nothing to complain about. this is a great idea. Your just a scrub. I have 4800 views, 300+ positive comments and 600 likes to prove that bro I run assault AR quite frequently and I would like to see this happen. Come on, DLH, we get it - you don't like ARs. The people that are opposed to this idea are referring to weapons that are already being abused on the ground like mass drivers. There are even some that feel that forge guns and swarm launchers would be overpowered in this scenario. It is true that you can dump a lot of firepower out of a dropship, but it is a single point target also. Instead of wasting your time popping shots at a dropship for maybe one kill you could possibly take out a whole squad. They will be in a position to get some great shots in, but they will also be in a position to receive some great shots. My forge gun fitting could be devastating to a setup like this. I do have a request if this is implemented, however. It should also be added that dropships that sustain damage beyond HP capacity explode instantly in the sky instead of having to impact the ground first. If we hit them hard enough we want the gratification of fireworks and kills. Idk why everyone is complaining about MD i hardly see people running them anymore. the "imaginary' teams of people running MD are in reality just teams of people running ARs peppered with scrambler rifles. Why should anyone waste a wopping 1million ISK dropship for 5 or so kills, because you know after the first guy gets killed he respawns in AV and there you go you just lost a dropship, by the time you see the swarms you ship is hit, better pray there isn't a forge gunner running around, even militia forges are devestating to DSs now you want the drop ships to instantly explode in the air taking out the entire squad as well? if thats the case then i don't want my passengers to be shot out my dropship by anything other than AV, they should have infinate ammo while in the dropship, and no aim restrictions on the side of the DS they are on. dik why everyone wants to gimp this mechanic before its ever implemented.

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1105	Posted - 2013.09.24 20:14:00 - [71] - Quote Talos Vagheitan wrote: While we're at it. Let the LAV passengers shoot too CCP is already planing pn putting this in. see "feed bakcs/suggestions", 4th to last post.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1106	Posted - 2013.09.24 22:23:00 - [72] - Quote im completely against that. FF or altering the trajectory. why? I already have problems with blue berries getting my dropship blown up. If I have to deal with them trolling my dropship and getting me killed its going to mitigate the advantage of having them shoot in the first place. when same team infantry shoots infantry on the ground their physical location and momentum are unaltered. When same team infantry shoots vehicles (not DS) their path is unaltered. likewise it should be with dropships
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1106	Posted - 2013.09.25 02:13:00 - [73] - Quote Nonya Bizznizz wrote: I think if this idea was implemented, Bay doors would be a whole lot more useful. I think that you should only be able to fire out of the ship if the bay doors are open, however a lucky shot or a skilled sniper could still get at you. If these doors were closed, you can't shoot out, but any small arms fire below would have to aim carefully to be able to shoot the passengers. Also, I think the pilot of a dropship should be able to get shot , so that hilarity would ensue when all passengers of the dropship suddenly start to drop, and bail just a second too late. IDK how many times I was playing as a sniper when suddenly a pilot of a ADS was facing my direction and shooting at my teammates while I simply watched. haha then this game would be just like halo... where snipers can shoot people out of tanks...
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1109	Posted - 2013.09.26 17:19:00 - [74] - Quote wowo 379 comments, 5,150 views, 600 likes. CCP Wolfman I know there is no way you can read through 379 comments, but just based on the number of likes and views alone there should be an indication that people want this
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1110	Posted - 2013.09.26 19:04:00 - [75] - Quote Xak Arji wrote: Nonya Bizznizz wrote: I think if this idea was implemented, Bay doors would be a whole lot more useful. I think that you should only be able to fire out of the ship if the bay doors are open, however a lucky shot or a skilled sniper could still get at you. If these doors were closed, you can't shoot out, but any small arms fire below would have to aim carefully to be able to shoot the passengers. Also, I think the pilot of a dropship should be able to get shot , so that hilarity would ensue when all passengers of the dropship suddenly start to drop, and bail just a second too late. IDK how many times I was playing as a sniper when suddenly a pilot of a ADS was facing my direction and shooting at my teammates while I simply watched. ..... That would make me throw an absolute fit. Do you know how much a python costs? It would be different if it were like halo and it was free, but it's not. A good 6 games worth of pay out the window. As if we weren't squishy enough, plus the skill it takes to hit someone on top of that is no joke. A forge gun can take me in 2 at least 3 hits. A swarmer can in about 3 hits... now you want SNIPERS to be able to snipe me out?! You might as well just take the damn things out of the game entirely, they are gimped enough already. Dropships should cost the same price as LAVs.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1110	Posted - 2013.09.26 19:05:00 - [76] - Quote honestly, dropships should cost the same as LAVs. The tech isn't that much more advanced and they die just as fast, actually faster
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1127	Posted - 2013.09.28 19:10:00 - [77] - Quote Talos Vagheitan wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? Excellent point. A simple solution in my mind, allow passengers to shoot only while the bay doors are open. This would give the bay doors an actual function, possibly encourage pilots to make real landings instead of hot-drops, and prevent DS's from becoming too OP. ^^this makes perfect sense. That was the intended function. In this way passengers can't be protected while they attack, but can by defended while they are not capable of shooting. thumbs up
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1147	Posted - 2013.10.02 01:52:00 - [78] - Quote lets do this
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1152	Posted - 2013.10.04 03:32:00 - [79] - Quote lets make this real
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1155	Posted - 2013.10.07 02:03:00 - [80] - Quote ok CCP seriously, its 396 comments, 6000 views and 600+likes now. Can I get a yes or no?

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1165	Posted - 2013.10.08 03:26:00 - [81] - Quote we can do this
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1177	Posted - 2013.10.09 23:02:00 - [82] - Quote so no CCP comment after 400 replies and 600 likes?
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1186	Posted - 2013.10.12 03:40:00 - [83] - Quote i guess thats a no...lolz
D legendary hero Ultramarine Corp 1311	Posted - 2014.01.15 16:38:00 - [84] - Quote Varjac Theobroma Montenegro wrote: What about aerial dog fights? I think we would see redline forge guns in a higher vantage point. Unless of course your passengers could only fire from low altitude. one suolution: rail turrets Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubadosPronto saberá justiça I am a Defender of the downtroddenSoon you will discover justice
D legendary hero Ultramarine Corp 1311	Posted - 2014.01.15 16:39:00 - [85] - Quote basically for any opposer to this remember that RAIL tanks and Rail installations kill dropships (and passengers) in 2-3 hits max. AV is still powerful vs dropships. -AND- Dropships still have very little offensive capabilities Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubadosPronto saberá justiça I am a Defender of the downtroddenSoon you will discover justice
D legendary hero Ultramarine Corp 1317	Posted - 2014.01.15 23:43:00 - [86] - Quote bogeyman m wrote: Hoover Damn wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? I'd feel like the dropship was being used to its fullest potential. :D EDIT: and if a dropship with two HMGs is scarier than a dropship with a pair of blasters, maybe you should consider what it says when a man-portable minigun is scarier than a vehicle-mounted fully-automatic plasma cannon. A derpship with HMGs would have to be close enough that you could hit them with AV grenades, no? this^^ = balanced. so, it could never be OP Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubadosPronto saberá justiça I am a Defender of the downtroddenSoon you will discover justice
D legendary hero Ultramarine Corp 1317	Posted - 2014.01.15 23:49:00 - [87] - Quote these 24 pages ( yes I read them... i was there when it happened) are full of mixed responses. but the general consensus is that This would not be OP. so, pretty much EVERYONE agrees that passenger's should be able to shoot from dropship seats (and by extension LAV seats). The disagreement comes about with regards to wether there should be restrictions placed on it or not. As far as I am concern there should be no limitations. But, A good suggestion stated above (and no doubt reference before in 24 pages) is to only permit AV of lvl 4 or 5 proficiency to be used out of the dropship. This would initially reduce the amount of people using AV from DP. Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubadosPronto saberá justiça I am a Defender of the downtroddenSoon you will discover justice
D legendary hero Ultramarine Corp 1318	Posted - 2014.01.16 14:47:00 - [88] - Quote bogeyman m wrote: Komodo Jones wrote: Seeth Mensch wrote: Komodo Jones wrote: At this point dropships are... a giant WP pinata and that might change how people feel about it. LOL and that there's balance. Well, make the swarm launchers a bit better again. It was overnerfed last time. Taken out context but yes, good job editing lol. Haven't used swarms that much at all and they are easy enough to evade, seems like all AV has been nerfed to area/idiot denial tool. Yes it was equal parts AV being powerful and cheap as well as vehicles being flimsy and expensive that caused the change but at some point they gotta realize that there's a problem when AV masters are having trouble taking down BASIC vehicles...remember these are basic, there is no advanced or proto vehicles lol. I was able to get close to an Incubus today - the pilot must have been distracted - with my Advanced Swarm Launcher (with one Enhance Damage Mod). I got off one whole clip (three volleys, 15 missiles, 3,465 damage) before he even moved. Might have cleared half his shields (with zero armour damage). Before my 3 second reload plus 1.4 second target-lock cycle completed, he got off three (3) cannon shots. My bunny hopping avoided the first two but the third hit with enough damage to kill me twice over. I caught a quick local spawn and found the Incubus in the same place - he had already returned to full shield. War Points are not (currently) awarded for damage. So unless an AVer gets lucky enough to actually down a derpship and get those 75 WPs (and rarely any kills because most passengers simply abandon ship), they get nothing for their attempts at trying to protect their squad and/or strategic position (as useless as that effort now is). So no, there are no pinatas today. but if you could fire those swarms from a derpship and follow him down, you could take him out. Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubadosPronto saberá justiça I am a Defender of the downtroddenSoon you will discover justice
D legendary hero Ultramarine Corp 1321	Posted - 2014.01.17 02:22:00 - [89] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: Hoover Damn wrote: DeathwindRising wrote: just make it so that you can only use sidearms... you know since, youre in a confined space in all you dont have much room for using bulky light and heavy weapons I disagree. Have you looked around the inside of a dropship while you were in one? There's loads of room for whatever you want. well then for balance reasons it depends on the effectiveness of splash damage weapons. mainly the mass driver. however, a dropship holds 7 people. 75 wps for the dropship + 50 wps for each clone lost inside = 475 wps for railguning one dropship. add a defend order to the tanker it goes up to 420 wps for just the 7 clones. idk how much for the dropship. maybe 90? so 510 wps total right there. THEN add two gunners to the tank... 25 (or 30 because of the defend order) wps each for vehicle assist = 175 (or 210 with the defend order) wps each for a total of 350 (or 420 with a defend order) wps. so 510 wps for the tanker and (ill go with 420 here) 420 wps from the gunners = 930 wps for one target lol and if everyone in the tank is in the same squad... you'd be a 3rd of your way to an orbital. so does anyone here want to be solely responsible for the orbital that gets dropped because they wanted to sit in a dropship and spam mass drivers all day? i think CCP should do this. if you guys honestly think itll help you and your team in the long run, go right ahead lol to be fair most likely the gunners on the side hit will be killed instantly, and then the pilot and other passengers will escape, unless they get squished by the dropship falling down. so, on average you'll get the dropship destruction + the 2 passengers. Their team will possibly lose 3-4 clones. so the wp gain will fall somewhere between 500 and 400. still, the risk vs reward for the tanker for is minimal. 2 shots that give you 400-500 wps for your squad (if your tank has passengers) is a lot of reward, for minimal risk (red line tanking). Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubadosPronto saberá justiça I am a Defender of the downtroddenSoon you will discover justice
D legendary hero Ultramarine Corp 1321	Posted - 2014.01.17 02:28:00 - [90] - Quote for the record. DS do not less armor, tanks do not need less armor. AV just needs WP for damage caused. This will encourge more people to AV, and that as a result will kill more DS and tanks. AV by itself should not kill tanks, or DS. AV in numbers should kill any vehicle in the game. for example null cannons are AV, one null canon doesn't win the game (not talking about domination) but multiple wrecks MCCs. also, this thread is about DS and gunners not AV Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubadosPronto saberá justiça I am a Defender of the downtroddenSoon you will discover justice

D legendary hero Ultramarine Corp 1321	Posted - 2014.01.17 10:18:00 - [91] - Quote I don't understand why people are so scared of heavy weapons being fired from a DS. HMGs are garbage in general but especially at range. even with the buff they are still pretty poor. So have a weapon with crazy spread at long range trying to take out round infantry is not a feaseble threat. really... with missile turrets gunners get shot out by scrabler rifles and GARs, do you really think an HMG with less range is going to be more effective? Forge guns got a range nerf and a splash damage nerf so its the opposite end of the HMG. You have an extremely precise weapon that you can't use ADS, and your trying to hit moving targets with no cover? seriously the dropships are open, and the passenger's can not move. any noob with an AR can gun him down. Now, I will say that YES before the splash nerf this could have been devastating. But, now that the forge splash is nerfed, I find it hard to beleive that anyone especially in this forum would die to that. The oonly people who might need to worry about flying forges would be heavies.... but they oretty much need to worry about everything else anyway as the largest target on the battlefield. Flying forge vs tankers vs DS ok. Flying forge guns would help balance out the current tank situation. why? because DS would have an offense (or rather defense) against tanks. DS would also be able to engage other dropships effectively (now DS just try to get more altitude until the ceiling, or just ram into each other. which is not actual air combat). flying AV, (swarms, forguns) will force tankers to play more tactically. Tanks will now need to consider their movements, and map location relative to DS. DS will need to consider there range relative to tanks. etc... AVers will actually be able to keep up with the vehicle "they could have only killed if they got that last shot off". This can do wonders for balance without a single nerf or buff. Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubadosPronto saberá justiça I am a Defender of the downtroddenSoon you will discover justice
D legendary hero Ultramarine Corp 1324	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:08:00 - [92] - Quote Serimos Haeraven wrote: D legendary hero wrote: I don't understand why people are so scared of heavy weapons being fired from a DS. HMGs are garbage in general but especially at range. even with the buff they are still pretty poor. So have a weapon with crazy spread at long range trying to take out round infantry is not a feaseble threat. really... with missile turrets gunners get shot out by scrabler rifles and GARs, do you really think an HMG with less range is going to be more effective? Forge guns got a range nerf and a splash damage nerf so its the opposite end of the HMG. You have an extremely precise weapon that you can't use ADS, and your trying to hit moving targets with no cover? seriously the dropships are open, and the passenger's can not move. any noob with an AR can gun him down. Now, I will say that YES before the splash nerf this could have been devastating. But, now that the forge splash is nerfed, I find it hard to beleive that anyone especially in this forum would die to that. The oonly people who might need to worry about flying forges would be heavies.... but they oretty much need to worry about everything else anyway as the largest target on the battlefield. Flying forge vs tankers vs DS ok. Flying forge guns would help balance out the current tank situation. why? because DS would have an offense (or rather defense) against tanks. DS would also be able to engage other dropships effectively (now DS just try to get more altitude until the ceiling, or just ram into each other. which is not actual air combat). flying AV, (swarms, forguns) will force tankers to play more tactically. Tanks will now need to consider their movements, and map location relative to DS. DS will need to consider there range relative to tanks. etc... AVers will actually be able to keep up with the vehicle "they could have only killed if they got that last shot off". This can do wonders for balance without a single nerf or buff. You're missing the point though, forges don't have a range nerf when compared to the range needed to hit an enemy dropship, not to mention its range is 400 meters! That kind of fire power from that distance would be incredibly devistating to other vehicles. And you're already assuming that they wouldn't allow people to move when inside the dropship, when yet you can already actively look around when you're a passenger inside of one. If forges were able to look around and shoot inside a dropship, the result would be a complete dismanteling of tiers for dropships. SP would be completely un-needed since you could skill into a viper and get 4 forge guns in the same ship and go dominate high-level tankers. As a result of SP not being a big requirement to have a strong dropship, more vehicles like these will litter the battlefield with noobs who want to try out the forge gun passenger tactic, this will result in an all new form of vehicle spam, this time for dropships. The fact you think that this would somehow add "balance" to this game is completely ridiculous, do you fly proto assault dropships at all? With my proto Python I can take out tanks quite easily, without any passengers needed, and that's what an assault dropship is for, making assaults on targets, and so AGAIN, having passengers that can shoot AV and weapons would render the assault dropship completely pointless and a waste of SP & ISK. This "use of AV" theory for passengers in dropships is one of the most rediculous and insane ideas this community could have ever come up with, and I'm sure that many proto dropship pilots like Blackhole Nova, Judge, Pvt. Numnutz, Black0ut, Ngthuros IX, Mobius, etc would agree that adding this component would absolutely ruin balance for aerial vehicles, and right at the time they were finally starting to become balanced against AV, and not-so-much against the OP Militia tank thanks to a failure in coding for militia's this build. And what a great example to highlight a similar incedent (similar to what would happen if dropships were low SP sinks), ever since the militia tanks in this build were given a low SP req and low ISK value, but high damage, players began to abuse them and spam them now and we have this situation frankly known as "tank spam", and this is souly because of the fact they are so devestating and easy to get. Now imagine a viper or myron capable of annihilating the best tanks and infantry units, as well as the best aerial pilots in the game. Don't you think this would cause the EXACT SAME influx of players to spam dropships? I don't see how people couldn't notice the similarity in this proposal, and the problem with tanks right now. If you were a pilot (fly assault dropships and regular drops. I flew dropships when they sucked hard and cost a small forune) you would know that there is no such thing as "balance" among aerial vehicles. Also, dnt forget, DS are not as easy to pilot as tanks. I have seen plenty a noob crash. The only real difference between assault dropships and militia one is the pilot operated turret. So, you can stock some forgunners on their too... Its hard for me to imagine an "ACE" pilot getting taken down by a milita dropship when you have complex mods, greater speed, agility, and fitting options militia dropships don't have. Tank spam occured because AV can't harm tanks fast enough. That is a separate unrelated issue. We are talking about dropships here. I find it hard to believe your assault dropship 1 on 1 with a tank of the same teir could destroy him if he is a decent tanker. Killing militia tanks with proto gear on DS is one thing...I have done that plenty of times but killing a tank with proto mods. lies (unless you have 2 other ADS with you) locked to one direction? Thats like saying DS and tanks should not be able to engage infantry only other DS and other tanks. Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubadosPronto saberá justiça I am a Defender of the downtroddenSoon you will discover justice
D legendary hero Ultramarine Corp 1324	Posted - 2014.01.18 07:36:00 - [93] - Quote Komodo Jones wrote: No weapon exclusions, however firing a forge gun round should have the same physics bump effects on the dropship as getting hit with a forge round. Why no weapon exclusions? Because there's no justified reason for it, you have a mobile platform for gunning sure, if you wanna use up your ammo trying to hit something from a moving unstable platform go for it, it won't make the dropship any less defensive vs AV, and finding people to use AV wouldn't be a problem if they do points based on damage dealt, and they definitely won't have a problem finding people to use AV when there's a dropship full of mass drivers harassing people. It won't be OP, it's a glass cannon, a big one in the sky that's easy to hit. It's the same situation as right now with tanks except less extreme, if you want to deal with a new threat you need to use a new tactic, you can't just run around with your rifle and expect to be able to deal with that. And if you don't want to change and adapt then you're gonna have a rough time. amen. This is truth. Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubadosPronto saberá justiça I am a Defender of the downtroddenSoon you will discover justice
D legendary hero Ultramarine Corp 1354	Posted - 2014.01.25 23:29:00 - [94] - Quote Cooper Eudaemon wrote: So, I'm just going to leave this official trailer from 2011 right here... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gw0gOjOWDuI There are so many cool concepts in this video that if implemented in the game would be extremely epic... Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubadosPronto saberá justiça I am a Defender of the downtroddenSoon you will discover justice
D legendary hero Ultramarine Corp 1421	Posted - 2014.02.03 23:28:00 - [95] - Quote JDEZ09 wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Seems like a good opportunity to discuss this idea. How would you feel about dropships filled with swarm launchers or mass drivers for example? I can definitely chime in a bit here. This sounds like a great little gamble here. I certainly do like using the prototype swarms launchers still, it's just that I feel as if the positioning with the weapon can be a bit difficult at times running on foot. A drop-ship light weapon class gunner would be a great idea for swarm launcher investors because it could be easier for them to attack without necessarily having to focus on evading as much small ground fire. You are talking about potentially the most exciting air battles in the future if this is to be considered. The now less range on the swarm launchers may give it a fair attack range, this will require the skill of the pilot to perfect for multiple types of engagements. It also can shed some light on a new idea of squad based vehicle fittings. Very reminiscent of other very popular FPS games in the genre that also like to capitalize on the scale of the warfare. Take a skilled pilot coupled with a sniper, and you're looking at something like a scene from the movie "District 9" I can already see it now.. "Get that Thales!! hes in the dropship!!" Forge Gunner: "I'm on it." YES! Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubados_Pronto saberá justiça

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