Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
3373
   |
Posted - 2013.08.29 23:06:00 -
[1] - Quote
CCP Wolfman wrote:*When we say weGÇÖre establishing a foundation with the most necessary archetypes that doesnGÇÖt mean youGÇÖre only getting basic and standard. You will have access to proto modules.
We already have Proto turrets that cost too much PG and CPU to fit on the current NOT-PROTO tanks. How is it going to help to add more Proto modules we can't fit because we don't have Proto tanks to fit them on? Proto AV gets proto weapons, modules AND SUITS, and tanks get Proto weapons but then we can't fit anything else because we run out of PG if we try. We'll now get to choose between Proto modules or Proto weapons, and have nothing even remotely competent on our NOT EVEN ADVANCED tanks because we don't get the fitting capacity for them.
Quote:*We will be going over AV damage values along with these changes.
*Dropships will be scoring transport based WP rewards (and yes they have more HP).
There are several problems with AV vs. vehicles. None of those problems are related to the damage dealt by primary AV weapons. Lets look at the problems:
1. AV Grenades: I specified "primary AV weapons" for a reason. Locus Grenades aren't seen as a primary combat tool. They're a useful situational weapon, NOT a main method of attack that's relied on to the exclusion of all else. AV weapons should be a support weapon or a fallback weapon, and should NOT be considered a primary weapon for an AV fitting. At the moment, their damage is not only way too high, but there's an extreme lack of transparency regarding the damage values. Players need to actually know how much damage AV Grenades are dealing, and whatever the amount, it needs to be nerfed REALLY, REALLY, REALLY HARD.
2. LAVs, but particularly LLAVs: LAVs got a massive HP buff for no reason. The "problem" with LAV health was that they died too easily to AV grenades, and there was literally nothing else wrong with them. LLAVs have, as a result of this "fix" of a massive buff to their HP, become more difficult to kill than tanks. This isn't an exaggeration. There might be a small imbalance between raw HP and EHP values in favour of HAVs, but that "advantage" is more than negated by the mobility of LAVs. Nerfing LAV mobility would be a stupid idea, so the logical option is to - no, not buff AV which is already balanced against anything but LAVs - nerf LAV HP back to something that vaguely resembles a sensible level. No LAV, including LLAVs, should be able to tank more than 3 AV Grenades. No LAV, including LLAVs, should be able to tank more than 2 full volleys of Proto swarms where every missile hits.
3. Dropships: It's been obvious for quite some time that Dropships are under-rewarded. The addition of rewards is a great plan, and needs to be done. Preferably before release. OH WAIT LOL 5/14 RELEASE*. Yeah, before deciding to start advertising the game, make sure Dropships are actually working at least vaguely similarly to how they're intended to be working. And here's a pro-tip: When even most AV guys are saying "Dropships are underpowered, they could use a buff", FURTHER REDUCING THEIR HP IS THE EXACT OPPOSITE OF A GOOD IDEA. And how did it not get fixed yet? Seriously, HOW IS THAT ACTUALLY STILL A PROBLEM AND ONLY NOW BEING ADDRESSED? All vehicles lost a skill that gave, at most, 25% extra HP, and had it replaced with a skill that potentially gives 11% extra HP. Other vehicle types got a 25% HP buff (LAVs got stupidly more for no logical reason, and Enforcers desperately needed more and got less than LAVs but still enough), and Dropships didn't, meaning that every other vehicle got a net buff while Dropships took a solid nerf after already being the black sheep of the vehicle family.
4. HAVs stop at Standard: I know I covered this earlier, but it really is a core problem with the AV/vehicle comparison, and deserves a further emphasis. AV gets literally two whole tiers of extra fitting capacity (not counting the advantage in fitting skills that actually allow competent fitting within each tier) above the best HAVs around. We get Militia, or Standard HAVs, with up to Proto weapons. Yes, we'll be able to get Proto modules soon, but that doesn't negate the fact that we can only fit things onto a Standard HAV. There is no Advanced, let alone Prototype HAV. They don't exist, and there's no good reason why not when every other role, INCLUDING OTHER VEHICLES, has them. The primary hunters of tanks - AV players - can bring fully-fitted Prototype AV fittings. Their Dropsuit has the fitting capacity to handle a full complement of Prototype equipment, including an AV weapon, a backup anti-infantry weapon, deployables, AV Grenades (effectively a second primary AV weapon if point #1 isn't addressed), and passive modules that make them tougher to kill. A really, REALLY careful HAV builder can maybe cram 2 Proto weapons onto their HAV, if they're willing to compromise on almost every other aspect of their machine to do it. Add modules and all you've done is given us a choice about what to sacrifice. We're still giving up a huge amount in order to fit a couple of Prototype items into a Standard hull, when we SHOULD have the option of skilling into something that can actually handle Prototype equipment because it's a Protoype HAV that has Prototype fitting capacity.
Fix all those problems, and you're back on track for fun vehicles. Basically scrapping and rebuilding the entire system is more work for what sounds like much worse results.
*Sorry, no. You AREN'T in a release-ready state. Give up the pretense. Admit we're still WAY in beta, bordering on alpha in some aspects of the game. Wait until the game is ACTUALLY finished, then ACTUALLY release it. And while you're at it, ACTUALLY honour the agreement made with early Merc Pack purchasers and give them the full credit of their Pack's contents as you advertised, instead of saying "nope, we changed the deal now" without any real grounds to do so. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
3433
|
Posted - 2013.09.02 00:34:00 -
[2] - Quote
Nguruthos IX wrote:A standard vehicle hull should not be 1 shottable by AV, as it is.
A standard Scout Dropsuit is one-shottable by a decent variety of weapons without getting a headshot (weakpoint). LAVs should be one-shottable by some AV weapons (Forge Guns, Plasma Cannons) but others should need a weakpoint hit (Swarms, AV Grenades).
Logi suits can be one-shotted at their base by a couple of weapons without getting headhots. LLAVs should be tougher than regular and Scout LAVs, but still one-shottable by an equal-tier Forge Gun, and maybe a Plasma Cannon or AV Grenade if it lands a weakpoint hit.
Assault suits can be one-shotted by several weapons with headshots. Dropships should be vulnerable to one-shotting with Plasma Cannons and Forge Guns if hit on a weakpoint.
Heavy suits can't be one-shotted by anything short of AV weaponry. HAVs should likewise be tough enough to survive basically any single hit.
Obviously, this is before modules are added, because you can buff things a decent way with those. Logi variant vehicles shouldn't get massive PG/CPU buffs like they currently do though, that just makes them into better tanks than the supposed "frontline" models. They should get PG/CPU cost reductions on modules that actually suit their intended role, so they can fit those modules without the compromise that other suits are forced into. |