DUST Search - 80-90% reduction in effectiveness of av/tanks against each other

ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:

infantry and vehicles kill av, av kill vehicles, vehicles kill infantry and av. all are weak defence against each other and all are powerful damage against each other. every vehicle use and suit choice should be situational based on whats happening on the field and not just balanced against each other. they are not meant to be equals or more powerful against each other on a solo basis

a squad works as a team to capture a point, vehicle and av players just do their own thing killing each other. if you removed vehicles and by default the need for av then the rest of the game would not change. you bring vehicle i bring av you bring vehicle i bring av and it repaeats constantly. meanwhile while we are not contributing to the fight(if we were not there then there would be more infantry on the ground capturing points) the rest of the infantry are still doing their job as usual.

we only currently need av to kill vehicles and we only need vehicles to give av something to shoot at (at the current state of things). if vehicles had their specific role rather than master of all things then this gives us more options and survivability on both sides. doing what i suggested would allow us to do this.

everyone seems to be all about themselves being able to solo whatever they desire and be uber powerful at it and no one is willing to compromise and its not helping the game.

remember the first dust trailers on how the game would be with tanks, lavs and dropships all working side by side with infantry. this is the only way i can see this happening. with the state the game is in currently, in that same video you would see every vehicle with a rail turret instantly blowing up, every infantry person on the ground getting run over by lav's or being mowed down by large blaster turrets and every dropship would be falling to the ground on fire for no apparent reason.


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ADAM-OF-EVE Svartur Bjorn 225	Posted - 2013.08.26 12:17:00 - [1] - Quote i made a post about this in general forum but it had mixed reviews due to my bad explanation of it so i have moved all the key points here in a better explained post and will be closing down the other. Now i'm an AV player, i like nothing more than killing vehicles which i'm pretty good at but for me the whole balance of AV vs Tanks primarily is that we are just too good at killing each other. the balance is way off. yes i know changes are coming in 1.5 but thats not going to fix most of the underlying problems. at best they are going to narrow the gap slightly or switch the problems from 1 side to the other tanks are their meant to support the ground troops and take out installations and AV is there to try and prevent them. but what we have is tanks and AV virtually insta killing everything. there is no team support its all about the kills and wp. i have a drastic solution which i believe is the only way to truly bring balance on the issue. reduce all ground AV weapon and grenade damage to tanks by about 80% reduce all dps of main tank weapons to infantry by about 80% don't rage yet hear me out reduce all ground av damage to tanks: what this does is allows tanks to roll with the infantry on the ground without the threat of insta death by AV players. reduce all dps from of main tank weapons to infantry: what this does is stops tanks mowing down entire teams with impunity the combination of the above brings new roles onto the field for tanks be that mobile cru's, repair maybe but primarily it allows them to provide not only physical cover while advancing on the enemy but cover fire from all its guns without being deemed as stomping on the enemy. now tanks drivers are probably thinking "well how am i supposed to get my wp and have fun. im a tank i should be able to insta kill anything and be hard to kill myself" well firstly with my idea you are virtually indestructable by infantry so there is your survival without an actual buff to defences and you can still kill tanks and other vehicles etc as you normally would so that wp wont be affected. as for infantry kills your ability to roam closer to them for longer would allow you to get more assists therefore the potential for more wp than you would normally get. AV /infantry players are probably thinking " AV is useless now, we are going to be stomped by tanks". well thats not actually true as lavs and dropships and installations would still be killable as normal and tanks would still be killable with a bit more effort but at the same time that tank is not going to be as big of an issue at any range as it used to be as your survival against them is up. both sides are now weak against each other. this now leaves a gap and a big role to fill. tank vs tank or AV squads i mentioned before tanks working close with the squad. imagine with me 2 opposing teams 1 defending a position and 1 attacking with a tank/cru for support. the defenders have multiple AV players and are doing serious damage to that tank but he is not running. he is getting reps from a LLAV and logi players and still advancing. the defenders don't have to manpower to deploy more av so they call in a tank fit for killing tanks. they deploy it and attempt to kill the cru tank. however the attackers saw the deployment and called in their own tank killer and with the combined effort of the 2 tanks they suppressed the enemy so their infantry could assault the position. as it stands currently we don't have anywhere near that kind of complexity and tactics and thats down to how easy it is to kill each other. it needs to be a drastic change to create a distinctive gap between the vehicles and infantry rather than just shifting that damage to a different weapon but increasing survivability at the same time. 80% reduction to damage to infantry basicly accounts for the inability to target a small fast moving target such as a person. the other turrets should be more effective suppressive fire leaving the primary role of a tank as heavy av support. 80% reduction to damage taken from infantry weapons doesn't mean we can't take the vehicle out but adds survivability when infantry is everywhere. overall infantry survival against tanks is up meaning less proto av is needed and vehicle survival is up meaning lower loss bills for them and less hiding and more supporting. no more 1 man army's in tanks or av
ADAM-OF-EVE Svartur Bjorn 225	Posted - 2013.08.26 12:17:00 - [2] - Quote ADAM-OF-EVE wrote: infantry and vehicles kill av, av kill vehicles, vehicles kill infantry and av. all are weak defence against each other and all are powerful damage against each other. every vehicle use and suit choice should be situational based on whats happening on the field and not just balanced against each other. they are not meant to be equals or more powerful against each other on a solo basis a squad works as a team to capture a point, vehicle and av players just do their own thing killing each other. if you removed vehicles and by default the need for av then the rest of the game would not change. you bring vehicle i bring av you bring vehicle i bring av and it repaeats constantly. meanwhile while we are not contributing to the fight(if we were not there then there would be more infantry on the ground capturing points) the rest of the infantry are still doing their job as usual. we only currently need av to kill vehicles and we only need vehicles to give av something to shoot at (at the current state of things). if vehicles had their specific role rather than master of all things then this gives us more options and survivability on both sides. doing what i suggested would allow us to do this. everyone seems to be all about themselves being able to solo whatever they desire and be uber powerful at it and no one is willing to compromise and its not helping the game. remember the first dust trailers on how the game would be with tanks, lavs and dropships all working side by side with infantry. this is the only way i can see this happening. with the state the game is in currently, in that same video you would see every vehicle with a rail turret instantly blowing up, every infantry person on the ground getting run over by lav's or being mowed down by large blaster turrets and every dropship would be falling to the ground on fire for no apparent reason.
ADAM-OF-EVE Svartur Bjorn 225	Posted - 2013.08.26 12:18:00 - [3] - Quote reserved
ADAM-OF-EVE Svartur Bjorn 225	Posted - 2013.08.26 12:22:00 - [4] - Quote Aikuchi Tomaru wrote: So basically: Make it so that AV-weapons have no AV purpose anymore and let the only purpose of vehicles be to counter other vehicles? nope, read the post and you will see i explained this
ADAM-OF-EVE Svartur Bjorn 225	Posted - 2013.08.26 12:24:00 - [5] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: What is the point of an AV weapon if it does completely laughable damage to vehicles? not vehicles, tanks? read the post or dont reply
ADAM-OF-EVE Svartur Bjorn 232	Posted - 2013.08.28 06:37:00 - [6] - Quote bump