DUST Search - "Fixing" Logistics Suits

BL4CKST4R wrote:

Cosgar wrote:

Since everyone and their mother has made suggestions on how to balance logistics dropsuits and their role, I guess I'll add in my 0.02 isk . There's a lot of misconceptions of what a logi suit is meant to be within the communtiy. Some claim they should have a repper, nanohive, and injector at all times to be their squad's battle buttler while others claim they should be versatile. Whatever the case, I'd like to see the logi class to be like the other suits- open to interpretation without someone crying OP. So here's my idea in 3 easy steps:

Step 1. Replace the +1 HP/s armor regen logi suit bonus with the Gallente logi's racial bonus and lower CPU/PG on all suit variants. This way we have a fully equipment oriented logistics role. (CPU/PG might need to be adjusted when EWAR modules are available)

Step 2. Give the Gallente logi a new racial bonus. Something related to armor plate CPU/PG reduction or something. (Gallente logis can chime in on this since I don't play Gallente)

Step 3. (optional) Create a "Field Medic" medium suit based on the logistics suit with repair, nanohive, injector, and uplink related bonuses so medic oriented logis can have their own suit. Maybe even add an extra equipment slot at the cost of using light weapons. It's up to you.

Simple, quick, painless and hopefully nobody asks for respecs. Thanks for reading and let me know what you guys think.

Asking as we get passive repairs with the logistics having a slightly higher repair, or the same shield repair as a assault I don't mibd losing the role bonus. As far as the racial we should get efficacy bonus to equipment.

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Cosgar ParagonX 4196	Posted - 2013.08.14 19:32:00 - [1] - Quote Since everyone and their mother has made suggestions on how to balance logistics dropsuits and their role, I guess I'll add in my 0.02 isk . There's a lot of misconceptions of what a logi suit is meant to be within the communtiy. Some claim they should have a repper, nanohive, and injector at all times to be their squad's battle buttler while others claim they should be versatile. Whatever the case, I'd like to see the logi class to be like the other suits- open to interpretation without someone crying OP. So here's my idea in 3 easy steps: Step 1. Replace the +1 HP/s armor regen logi suit bonus with the Gallente logi's racial bonus and lower CPU/PG on all suit variants. This way we have a fully equipment oriented logistics role. (CPU/PG might need to be adjusted when EWAR modules are available) Step 2. Give the Gallente logi a new racial bonus. Something related to armor plate CPU/PG reduction or something. (Gallente logis can chime in on this since I don't play Gallente) Step 3. (optional) Create a "Field Medic" medium suit based on the logistics suit with repair, nanohive, injector, and uplink related bonuses so medic oriented logis can have their own suit. Maybe even add an extra equipment slot at the cost of using light weapons. It's up to you. Simple, quick, painless and hopefully nobody asks for respecs. Thanks for reading and let me know what you guys think.
Meeko Fent Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 592	Posted - 2013.08.14 20:01:00 - [2] - Quote I don't play logi, but I can't see how detrimental these changes are. If you guys have a tight fitting, drop some higher tiered mods for lowers. For the most part, at least in pubs, nobody really cares how fast you rep them.
BL4CKST4R WarRavens League of Infamy 1067	Posted - 2013.08.14 20:02:00 - [3] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Since everyone and their mother has made suggestions on how to balance logistics dropsuits and their role, I guess I'll add in my 0.02 isk . There's a lot of misconceptions of what a logi suit is meant to be within the communtiy. Some claim they should have a repper, nanohive, and injector at all times to be their squad's battle buttler while others claim they should be versatile. Whatever the case, I'd like to see the logi class to be like the other suits- open to interpretation without someone crying OP. So here's my idea in 3 easy steps: Step 1. Replace the +1 HP/s armor regen logi suit bonus with the Gallente logi's racial bonus and lower CPU/PG on all suit variants. This way we have a fully equipment oriented logistics role. (CPU/PG might need to be adjusted when EWAR modules are available) Step 2. Give the Gallente logi a new racial bonus. Something related to armor plate CPU/PG reduction or something. (Gallente logis can chime in on this since I don't play Gallente) Step 3. (optional) Create a "Field Medic" medium suit based on the logistics suit with repair, nanohive, injector, and uplink related bonuses so medic oriented logis can have their own suit. Maybe even add an extra equipment slot at the cost of using light weapons. It's up to you. Simple, quick, painless and hopefully nobody asks for respecs. Thanks for reading and let me know what you guys think. Asking as we get passive repairs with the logistics having a slightly higher repair, or the same shield repair as a assault I don't mibd losing the role bonus. As far as the racial we should get efficacy bonus to equipment.
Ren Ratner Infinite Raiders 52	Posted - 2013.08.14 20:10:00 - [4] - Quote Why would Logis need anything changed?
Cosgar ParagonX 4197	Posted - 2013.08.14 20:13:00 - [5] - Quote Ren Ratner wrote: Why would Logis need anything changed? People are still complaining about all logis, even after the CaLogi nerf.
ALPHA DECRIPTER M.E.R.C. Conventional Forces D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 271	Posted - 2013.08.14 20:20:00 - [6] - Quote I can't really agree with you but I will +1 you for speaking up (it's the only way CCP knows what ppl want, right?). `Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST.
Cosgar ParagonX 4205	Posted - 2013.08.14 21:40:00 - [7] - Quote BL4CKST4R wrote: Asking as we get passive repairs with the logistics having a slightly higher repair, or the same shield repair as a assault I don't mibd losing the role bonus. As far as the racial we should get efficacy bonus to equipment. Equipment efficacy sounds good, but what about reusable stuff like injectors and scanners?
Cross Atu Conspiratus Immortalis Covert Intervention 1473	Posted - 2013.08.14 22:06:00 - [8] - Quote Cosgar wrote: Since everyone and their mother has made suggestions on how to balance logistics dropsuits and their role, I guess I'll add in my 0.02 isk . There's a lot of misconceptions of what a logi suit is meant to be within the communtiy. Some claim they should have a repper, nanohive, and injector at all times to be their squad's battle buttler while others claim they should be versatile. Whatever the case, I'd like to see the logi class to be like the other suits- open to interpretation without someone crying OP. So here's my idea in 3 easy steps: Step 1. Replace the +1 HP/s armor regen logi suit bonus with the Gallente logi's racial bonus and lower CPU/PG on all suit variants. This way we have a fully equipment oriented logistics role. (CPU/PG might need to be adjusted when EWAR modules are available) Step 2. Give the Gallente logi a new racial bonus. Something related to armor plate CPU/PG reduction or something. (Gallente logis can chime in on this since I don't play Gallente) Step 3. (optional) Create a "Field Medic" medium suit based on the logistics suit with repair, nanohive, injector, and uplink related bonuses so medic oriented logis can have their own suit. Maybe even add an extra equipment slot at the cost of using light weapons. It's up to you. Simple, quick, painless and hopefully nobody asks for respecs. Thanks for reading and let me know what you guys think. I like the overall theme of the idea but, as I've brought up elsewhere, the current Gal Logi skill buff is the weakest among the skill buffs for Logi suits and fails to break even in many context regarding fittings costs when compared to adding 1 complex repper (the item which can provide a value of 5/HPs reps). The concept of the Gal bonus is pretty good, and I can actually see why it is so often suggested as a Logi wide bonus but at the end of the day replacing the +5 self rep with the -25% fittings cost to equipment is a net nerf to the logi line. It would require a rough reduction of ~50% fittings cost to be truly effective and I'm not sure if such a reduction is even a consideration for CCP/the community at that level. [Note: these relative values may change if armor rep mods are changed as part of balancing the armor tank line] The other issue with the equipment CPU/PG reduction to fittings costs is that is benefits some types of Logi more than others due to the number of Equipment Slots on the suits. The suits with more slots gain a greater potential benefit than those with fewer causing a net disparity between the races. In addition to the above there's a hidden ISK cost to this change, while the current +5 HP/s is free on the suit gaining any value from the new configuration would require the fitting of mods (presumably some of these mods would already be in use but to get a net savings Proto mods are required) and fitting that armor rep mod would also require ISK as well as the other associated costs (simply not having those reps isn't highly viable in most cases as there is rarely anyone to around to rep a Logi and the lower eHP a Logi has the less effectively they can support their squad). I'd like to reiterate that the conceptual backing for this idea is something I generally like, it's just that the mechanical side has drawbacks that amount to a rather substantial nerf. If armor tanking is brought into balance with shields in a way that includes more access to self reps/lower cost access to resp at that level, and if the actual bonus applied is at max level increased beyond the current 25% value (exact amount dependent on other factors such as the reps mentioned above) then it could become a very viable fix, thought we'd still have to find a way to address the disparity between suits with differing #s of equipment slots. 0.02 ISK Cross ps ~ Re: option 3, I'd test something like this out as one of the "kits", a suit that has mods already included in both the cost and purchase rather than applying separate buffs which might fragment the logi role a bit. Medic isn't the final word in logi by any means, and it shouldn't be, but it is an aspect of logi so I'd rather see it remain part of the pool than me severed.
Cross Atu Conspiratus Immortalis Covert Intervention 1473	Posted - 2013.08.14 22:12:00 - [9] - Quote BL4CKST4R wrote: Cosgar wrote: Since everyone and their mother has made suggestions on how to balance logistics dropsuits and their role, I guess I'll add in my 0.02 isk . There's a lot of misconceptions of what a logi suit is meant to be within the communtiy. Some claim they should have a repper, nanohive, and injector at all times to be their squad's battle buttler while others claim they should be versatile. Whatever the case, I'd like to see the logi class to be like the other suits- open to interpretation without someone crying OP. So here's my idea in 3 easy steps: Step 1. Replace the +1 HP/s armor regen logi suit bonus with the Gallente logi's racial bonus and lower CPU/PG on all suit variants. This way we have a fully equipment oriented logistics role. (CPU/PG might need to be adjusted when EWAR modules are available) Step 2. Give the Gallente logi a new racial bonus. Something related to armor plate CPU/PG reduction or something. (Gallente logis can chime in on this since I don't play Gallente) Step 3. (optional) Create a "Field Medic" medium suit based on the logistics suit with repair, nanohive, injector, and uplink related bonuses so medic oriented logis can have their own suit. Maybe even add an extra equipment slot at the cost of using light weapons. It's up to you. Simple, quick, painless and hopefully nobody asks for respecs. Thanks for reading and let me know what you guys think. Asking as we get passive repairs with the logistics having a slightly higher repair, or the same shield repair as a assault I don't mibd losing the role bonus. As far as the racial we should get efficacy bonus to equipment. This is going to be an on balance nerf to potential WP earnings until CCP rolls out the new WP mechanics (ETA SoonTM). The other trouble with this is that generally the bonus to equipment will not contribute anything to the survivability of the Logi thus the loss of self reps becomes a nerf to eHP which the logi very much does not need another round of. The lower the survival rating the higher the efficiency bonus has to become just to break even on actual utility provided on the field, and then there's the problem with excessive constraint to users/loss of tactical value by creating predictiable fits (unless the new bonuses apply to all types of equipment at the role, rather than racial, level in which case this last can be discounted). Much like the OP the conceptual bedrock is something I actually like but at present its hard to apply the mechanics without it being a net nerf to the logi. 0.02 ISK Cross
TechMechMeds Swamp Marines Kleenex Inc. 166	Posted - 2013.08.15 02:41:00 - [10] - Quote Just like to state amarr logi is an assault oriented logi as stated in its description.

Beeeees KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 98	Posted - 2013.08.15 03:14:00 - [11] - Quote Logi is a type of suit, not a play style really. I still dont appreciate the bright yellow suit coloration, that is sorta implying that its wearer is actually supposed to do something the rest does not. And regarding fixing logis, how about we fix assault first instead?
BL4CKST4R WarRavens League of Infamy 1073	Posted - 2013.08.15 03:15:00 - [12] - Quote Beeeees wrote: Logi is a type of suit, not a play style really. I still dont appreciate the bright yellow suit coloration, that is sorta implying that its wearer is actually supposed to do something the rest does not. And regarding fixing logis, how about we fix assault first instead? Impossible to fix assaults without removing damage modifiers, and they would have to be broken to begin with.


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