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Galm Fae
Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY
60
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Posted - 2013.08.14 19:35:00 -
[1] - Quote
Yun Hee Ryeon wrote:steadyhand amarr wrote:Surely all deaths are turamtiac? Some much, much more than others. It's gotten so I don't really mind catching a flechette. The more often it happens, the better the contract is usually going, and it's relatively painless. Relative, specifically, to a 'Toxin' weapon. Why those things are even approved for nanofacture, I really don't understand. Believe me, they are much more fun from the sending end of the weapon. After a sentinel has decimated your squad and clone reserves for a solid fifteen minutes, bundled up all nice and tight in his prototype gear, hearing the big guy scream when you finally take him down just feels so good. There no real endorphin rush like it on the market to thoroughly ruin someone's day.
I make sure to finish an enemy off though, so it isn't like they are rolling around in pain for too long.
No, the really brutal deaths are things that we aren't even authorized to use in combat these days. PSYKLAD rounds, flamethrowers, nerve agents, that is the really nasty stuff. |
Galm Fae
Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY
61
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Posted - 2013.08.14 22:01:00 -
[2] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:Galm Fae wrote:Yun Hee Ryeon wrote:steadyhand amarr wrote:Surely all deaths are turamtiac? Some much, much more than others. It's gotten so I don't really mind catching a flechette. The more often it happens, the better the contract is usually going, and it's relatively painless. Relative, specifically, to a 'Toxin' weapon. Why those things are even approved for nanofacture, I really don't understand. Believe me, they are much more fun from the sending end of the weapon. After a sentinel has decimated your squad and clone reserves for a solid fifteen minutes, bundled up all nice and tight in his prototype gear, hearing the big guy scream when you finally take him down just feels so good. There no real endorphin rush like it on the market to thoroughly ruin someone's day. I make sure to finish an enemy off though, so it isn't like they are rolling around in pain for too long. No, the really brutal deaths are things that we aren't even authorized to use in combat these days. PSYKLAD rounds, flamethrowers, nerve agents, that is the really nasty stuff. And you call me sickening. Where is your honour? Honor is not the same as integrity, Adamance. I would rather have truth in marketing than lies and deceit to create the illusion of a moral high ground. It is through integritiy that people begin to see you for who you really are, and that forms a bond stronger than any admiration a false reputation of honor might generate.
Judge me by my results, not my methods. I would rather brutally cripple an enemy invasion force than enslave a population with a false sense of honor, Templar. It is also frequently said that we should not take this job personally, but it can be hard not to when you lose a large sum of your own equipment to a mercenary who does not even believe in the cause he is fighting for. |
Galm Fae
Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY
61
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Posted - 2013.08.15 05:51:00 -
[3] - Quote
Yun Hee Ryeon wrote: Two of those three are relatively ineffective against a modern, dropsuited combat clone, Fae-haan. The third ... well, we've yet to see battlefield conditions calling for artillery barrages outside of orbital bombardment. In time, perhaps.
I know the experience of using such weapons, myself. I've discontinued their use. The only misery I require from my better-equipped opponents is the loss of their gear to an opponent with inferior equipment.
I was simply trying to make the point that there are worse ways to die.
Now that in mind, I assume after a fair amount of time we all get used to pain, but branding a weapon like the Toxin around an egger makes them so nervous it is hilarious. They don't really appreciate the fact that we can liquefy them outside the safety of their pods. Showing it off opens up a few bar seats, I know that much.
Quote:If one of your results is to worsen my allies' psychological condition for the unforgivable sin of accepting a public contract opposite you, Fae-haan, then you will hopefully forgive me if I regard that outcome as one of your results.
I like to think of that as a strength. After all, some mercenaries will make their employers pay extra for that quality of service, and I will do it free of charge. Nobody here has any fear. As immortals, we simply don't have the capacity. Still, a professional reputation of thoroughly defeating an opponent pays well. It just works out that I take some pride in my work, why shouldn't I? Especially when it aligns with my own ideals from time to time.
Quote:The integrity you seem to promote is a breed of honor with a troubled history. Taken to its extreme, it discards courtesy, duty, law-- all the illusions that underlie civilization. Even in its lesser forms, it erodes those same foundations. Being aware of fictions does not demand that we reject them, any more than being aware that "money" is imaginary demands that you stop using it.
Honor is just the bastard child of pride, and foolish pride at that. When you strip it to its core, honor is just a childish plea with the universe to have it marked somewhere that you are a better man of some sorts. Silver tongues and shady politics have all been claimed to be honorable at some point. But integrity holds no secrets or false promises. It shows the world who you are and what you defend, and allows others to decide for themselves whether you are wrong or right rather than being told the truth by a preconceived notion. Call me daft or tactless, but I would rather know who stands for what and what they are willing to do then have everyone mask themselves behind preconceived notions.
To this end, I am willing to uphold my own values. Even if previous mandates such as courtesy, law, and duty are cast away to do so.
... And, I have forgotten what the original topic was. Sorry, I... think I misplaced my bottle of Frentix. I am a bit on edge today. |
Galm Fae
Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY
61
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Posted - 2013.08.15 06:43:00 -
[4] - Quote
Yun Hee Ryeon wrote:Quote:Nobody here has any fear. As immortals, we simply don't have the capacity. Still, a professional reputation of thoroughly defeating an opponent pays well. It just works out that I take some pride in my work, why shouldn't I? Especially when it aligns with my own ideals from time to time. No fear? For ourselves, perhaps. Also, did we not recently have a discussion of the 'Toxin' and exactly how it relates to your ideals? Have you discovered new ideals that it actually works with, rather than just satisfying a desire to see your opponents suffer? Mostly I just came to terms with the fact I was trying to trick myself into ignoring the fact that I enjoyed the feeling I suppose. It was more damaging in the end to lie to myself than to admit my own wickedness. I no longer employ the Toxin weapon system except as a sidearm for when the moment calls for it. Chiefly, when I come across someone who I feel deserves it. I am not wholly evil, at least not yet. I still believe that a commendable opponent deserves a certain level of respect. Just ask Adamance, we have fought each other before, and I would gladly face him again. Regardless of his ideals, I respect his resolve and determination in combat. Other soldiers however deserve no such courtesy.
Perhaps soldiers like myself.
Quote:What a sad epiphany to have come to, Fae-haan. Like the Blood Raiders, you have found a fragment of truth, and you mistake it for the whole. Not only do you hold yourself above the Empire, but above all of civilization.
It is a mistake I can relate to, yet hate nevertheless. We despise most what we are nearest to becoming. And yet aside from the child killing I smile when I review what the Blood Raiders have accomplished in developing a well educated society that chooses a life that embraces the state of nature that their god birthed them from. Sure they feast upon our own, but these days they do so from the most deserving source in all of New Eden. It is really quite brilliant from a psychological point of view. |
Galm Fae
Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY
61
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Posted - 2013.08.15 06:56:00 -
[5] - Quote
Jackson Olosko wrote:All of you make excellent points. Such a ravaging debate, with such ferocity and passion behind each person's words.
And I still can't get my damn armour off. Are you using Amarr Assault armor? Because that isn't suppose to come off, it is attached to your spine.
Maybe I should have started by saying that. |
Galm Fae
Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY
61
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Posted - 2013.08.15 07:13:00 -
[6] - Quote
Get some logi IT egghead to look at it. I really don't have any sort of a mind for your crazy inconvenient Amarr-tech.
As for the door... I dunno.... Blast it open? I am sure a sapper can lend you some detcord. |
Galm Fae
Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY
61
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Posted - 2013.08.15 22:55:00 -
[7] - Quote
Yun Hee Ryeon wrote: To see one's self and one's place with clarity is commendable in its way. It is more troubling, however, that you seem to prefer a path that conforms to what you want rather than what you are called upon to do and be.
A sure sign of a Caldari who has gone astray is that he speaks words that dishonor his ancestors. You have aligned honor with pride; what then of your forefathers and their culture, steeped in honor? What does it say of yourself that you not only reject their path, but mock it?
I do not believe in evil, Fae-haan, but I do believe in arrogance and folly. In the past, I walked a path comparable to your own, though I never fell in love with suffering, only with death and the deep uncaring cold of places between.
It took long years for me to learn my mistake. I pray that it will not take you so long.
Well I am at least part Intaki. Some have insisted that it grants me a potent fusion of having the capacity for deep thought while still being too direct to entirly think these thoughts through.
My father on the other hand was a mercenary, like myself. In his day, there was only one rule to combat: Survive. On the battlefield, hard choices needed to be made that did not always equate to the honorable thing to do. He taught me the value of personal consistancy over rectitude. I can only hope that the spirits will not be so daft as to judge me by my methods of defending my values.
Besides, honor has always been a nondescript term. If you send a Matari boy off to war and he brings back sixty-four severed heads, he is bringing his family honor. In other cultures, honor is found in pulling a comrad from twisted wreckage or having the humility to accept defeat.
Honor has always simply been a nonexistant reward system for those who conform to what society dictates is acceptable behavior without asking the individual to decide for himself what is right or wrong. Honor, at the end of the day, is just another weapon in the Empire's arsenal.
Quote:Many Minmatar make the same mistake you do, Fae-haan: they believe the Sani are their allies, or at least useful enemies to their hated foes. But the Amarr are not the worst New Eden has to offer, and Sani cultists ascendant over the Empire would be no less of a threat than the Amarr themselves. And if you happen to be a Minmatar with relatives still enslaved, their fate under the Sani would be far more in question.
The Amarr do not hold the weak in open contempt, after all.
What the Sani fail to see is that power for its own sake is analogous to collecting an elaborate toolbox only for the sake of having more tools. Power is a means to an end; with no end but itself, it is reduced to an endless recursive exercise in tool acquisition.
Naturally a cult like the Blood Raiders could never hope to control an entire race of people. But if they were to shake an empire to its foundations, perhaps perhaps perhaps another goal might be achieved. Hypothetically an Empire under s Sani siege by the Sabik would be unstable enough that an outside power would be forced to step in, lest they rip themselves appart in turmoil. At least then a war with the Empire would be seen as an acceptable liberation from a savage and violent cult rather than facing an enemy that can feign nobility.
Ryeon-haani, corrupt governments in power throughout the cluster have all been squabbling for what exists now in the present. I find very few ever have the luxury of fighting for the future, or at the very least predicting possible outcomes. All the outcomes I can see point to one undeniable fact: Unless the Amarr are brought to an end now, they will quickly become the largest threat in the universe. |
Galm Fae
Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY
61
|
Posted - 2013.08.16 00:03:00 -
[8] - Quote
Numbers, Adamance. Numbers and devotion. With Sansha's Nation there is little doubt that they are a threat, and anyone who fails to grasp that concept is a fool or suicidal. If all empires were to collectivly decide to put an end to them, they would be wiped off the face of existance. However you Amarr perpetuate conflicts that prevent us from focusing together to dethrown this threat, a fact that is apparent when you consider that the Blood Raiders maintain an alliance with the Nation not out of respect, but out of mutual hate towards the Amarr Empire.
The Amarr however are a slow burn, a cancer that consumes all. With your empress and your ideology, the Golden Fleet has the potental to slowly gain power until they match all three superpowers combined. You have power, stability, and most importantly numbers. You beliefs drawn people willingly into your empire, or forced them in at gunpoint. Entire cultures, families, and parts of history have been wiped from existance by your Reclamation and placed them under the theocratic control of True Amarr. The only difference between the Amarr and the Nation is that Sansha takes the removal of all identity a bit more literally. Now however? The Empire is weak. Following the war with the Jove and the Minmatar split, you are weaker than ever. We can strike while the iron is hot, or wait until you regain momentum swollow the rest of this world.
Some will call me a coward or radical for saying what needs to be said. I assure you I am neither, I simply see a tactical advantage on what is sure in time to become an enemy of the State. |
Galm Fae
Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY
61
|
Posted - 2013.08.16 00:53:00 -
[9] - Quote
Yun Hee Ryeon wrote:As those Caldari who are ethnic Achura can attest, a person's blood has little meaning compared to their upbringing. The Civire learn to be frank and direct, the Deteis to be still and subtle. I assume I largely just proved my own point about my disposition then.
...
That was a joke.
Quote:If the Amarr have some method of using this code against me, they are more creative than I am. Then you are fortunate enough to have never been betrayed by those who command authority before. We should all be so lucky to be blissfully unaware that occassionally those you are determined to serve and lay down your life for do not share the same sentiments.
Quote:Then you have perceived one truth of our time: the Amarr must not destroy the Minmatar Republic, or we will soon have to face the Amarr. The reverse, however, is also true: the Matari must not destroy the Empire, or we will face both the Federation and the Republic.
The Amarr are aggressive, but not substantially more so than the Federation. Each believes it holds a Great Truth; each will spread that Truth by persuasion or by conquest.
I cannot believe I am saying this, but ancestors choke, I think peace with the Republic and the Gallente is not too much of a long shot. The Republic simply wishes to regain lands that are due to them and regain their cultural freedom. I have made the point before how similar to ourselves the Minmatar are. If anything, in aiding with the destruction of the Amarr, ties with the Republic will shift to us rather than the indecisive and unhelpful political ties that they already hold with the Federation. War with the Amarr would cost us an ally, but it would bolster our own State's power while weakening the Gallente in the cold war that is sure to follow.
So that said, I hope no offense was taken by any Matari for that headhunter joke earlier.
That is all it will be though, a cold war fueled by proxy wars that are sure to span the cluster while never engadging in direct combat. This world would be a safer place that way than with the political turmoil that ravages low and null sec spaces today. |
Galm Fae
Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY
61
|
Posted - 2013.08.16 20:52:00 -
[10] - Quote
Yun Hee Ryeon wrote: You presume more rigidity than my approach contains, Fae-haan. "The job" has layers of priority; treason I become aware of will not simply be ignored because the traitor happens to be my superior.
If you believe that the State has been infiltrated, bring evidence and let it be weighed. There are proper forums for this, and your solo efforts are unlikely to succeed.
Kirjuun, with Heth gone anything I can say is of little importance now. Any additional commentary would just be ex post facto. A young soldier however may still be suseptable to believing that dying on a shelled out rock in the middle of null sec might bring him some form of honor. Esspecially in the Amarr, were Crusaders are taught that striking down any individual who does not believe in their faith is not only encouraged by their generals, but mandated by their God to bring their faith honor.
Quote:You have swallowed far too much Gallentean propaganda concerning the Amarr, Fae-haan. The Amarrian goal of universal conquest is far from realization; even at the pinnacle of their strength, they were no match for the Jove, and their obstacles have only grown since. By habit and custom, they are a cautious people, slow to change, but changing they are; two of the last three emperors have been peacemakers. The Pax Amarria is an ode to the path of scholarship and persuasion over the path of the sword.
Even Empress Jamyl has remarked that the age of slavery is coming to an end.
The Amarr can build ships, certainly. They can prepare for a great Reclaiming ... and what do you think the rest of us will be doing? Cowering in shelters, waiting to be dragged into the streets and clapped in Amarrian irons?
We will, of course, be building ships of our own.
The Amarr are surrounded by enemies. So are we all. You would have us upset the balance of power on the presumption that the outcome would be as you describe. You would have us murder an ally against an ancestral enemy because of what that ally might one day become, if everything goes perfectly for them.
The templars we see here are men of warfare, Fae-haan. They see their role as being that of holy knights. Their capsuleer counterparts are the like of Rodj Blake: warriors.
They are followers. They will hope for glory, but they do not set policy. They will do as they are told.
In the end, the Empire's ideal of conquest is precisely that: an ideal. Like most ideals, the reality will fall short of the hope, and we have another and more immediate problem to deal with: the Gallente continue to war against the people of the State. You are welcome to seek peace, but please remember that the Federation only ever stopped the Great War against your ancestors' State because it encountered the Amarr.
The Amarr are not the only self-righteous conquerors in this cluster, Fae-haan. The Gallente come to tame the Winds; the Amarr are latecomers in that regard. Have I been corrupted by Gallente, or have you been told by those above you what you should be fighting for?
It comes down to this:
The Federation might form another counterattack, or me might negotiate peace with them. They are slowly finding that this war of attrition will not be won on distant planets, but on the desks of politicians. They might return to tame us, and I stand by the fact that reperations must be paid for the fall of Caldari Prime. Yet the Gallente are indecisive, and the Gallente public are slowly starting to ask themselves if a war with us is really what they want in the end.
However, for the Amarr, there is no question. It is their way to invade the land. They will try to tame us. They will organize against us. There will be a war.
War with the Amarr is a much more likely hypothetical than you might think. It will happen, so we might as well allow it to be on our terms. |
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